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AKG k702's and "lack of bass".

post #1 of 42
2/20/13 at 7:27pm
Thread Starter 

I've often heard this being said when there is ever a discussion about these headphones.

 

Do they really lack bass? Or does it just seem that way at first if you're accustomed to more bass emphasized headphones?

 

I took a look at the frequency response graph at headphone.com and compared the frequency measurement to the highly regarded Sennheiser HD600's.

 

 

 

Surprisingly the graph clearly shows that the K702s have slightly stronger sub bass than the HD600's, yet i've seen it being said that anything below 30hz on the K702's is "non-existent".

 

So how can this possibly be?

 

Could it be that the graph was measured after hundreds of hours of burn in time?

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post #2 of 42
2/20/13 at 9:41pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sound Quest View Post

Surprisingly the graph clearly shows that the K702s have slightly stronger sub bass than the HD600's

 

So how can this possibly be?

 

Heya,

 

Just because it measured that way to a microphone doesn't mean it is perceived that way to your ear.

 

The K702, just like the K701/Q701, is relatively polite with bass. Not a bassy headphone at all.

 

You can hear it's sub-bass tones when it plays, but it's very weak and polite, not strong and present. Certainly not flat in line with everything else. And neutral headphones are supposed to be completely flat. These don't sound flat to me.

 

Very best,

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post #3 of 42
2/21/13 at 3:49am
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by MalVeauX View Post

 

Heya,

 

Just because it measured that way to a microphone doesn't mean it is perceived that way to your ear.

 

The K702, just like the K701/Q701, is relatively polite with bass. Not a bassy headphone at all.

 

You can hear it's sub-bass tones when it plays, but it's very weak and polite, not strong and present. Certainly not flat in line with everything else. And neutral headphones are supposed to be completely flat. These don't sound flat to me.

 

Very best,

 

I see, thanks for the explanation.

I've been contemplating these headphones for quite a while now, but whenever I see people say that they're only good for classical and jazz, it kind of puts me off them.

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post #4 of 42
2/21/13 at 4:02am
So far getting back in the headphone game. Headphone people are 180 degrees opposite of home audio guys. They value what I detest such as an outside the head sound experience which the akg provides they hate. They love the in your head or on your nose sound stage. I feel this is an automatic knock the core headphone guys give. Then I have to say the average headphone guru would be the bassist of bassheads on the home audio community and would be disregarded once that proclivity was known. That's just for starters don't get me started on the love of freaking op amps. Good gosh
Edited by dcfis - 2/21/13 at 4:03am
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post #5 of 42
2/21/13 at 4:30am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sound Quest View Post

I've often heard this being said when there is ever a discussion about these headphones.

 

Do they really lack bass? Or does it just seem that way at first if you're accustomed to more bass emphasized headphones?

 

I took a look at the frequency response graph at headphone.com and compared the frequency measurement to the highly regarded Sennheiser HD600's.

 

 

 

Surprisingly the graph clearly shows that the K702s have slightly stronger sub bass than the HD600's, yet i've seen it being said that anything below 30hz on the K702's is "non-existent".

 

So how can this possibly be?

 

Could it be that the graph was measured after hundreds of hours of burn in time?

 

 

With a decent hps amp you can easy hear down to 20hz. About ''lack bass'', those rumors are spread by diluted kids that want cheap high end hps with a boomy bass.

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post #6 of 42
2/21/13 at 4:35am
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Acix View Post

 

 

With a decent hps amp you can easy hear down to 20hz. About ''lack bass'', those rumors are spread by diluted kids that want cheap high end hps with a boomy bass.

 

Diluted?

 

I think you mean "deluded". biggrin.gif

 

But yeah, I tend to agree. Most youngsters just want "loud" with big boomy bass. They have no idea that music also has a mid-range and a treble.

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post #7 of 42
2/21/13 at 4:42am
Thread Starter 

Would the Fiio E17/E09k provide enough power to juice these babies up?

 

Or would it require something more spectacular?

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post #8 of 42
2/21/13 at 4:42am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sound Quest View Post

 

Diluted?

 

I think you mean "deluded". biggrin.gif

 

But yeah, I tend to agree. Most youngsters just want "loud" with big boomy bass. They have no idea that music also has a mid-range and a treble.

 

lol, I meant diluted from realty...but deluded will work even better for those boomy youngsters!! very_evil_smiley.gif 

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post #9 of 42
2/21/13 at 4:44am
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Acix View Post

 

lol, I meant diluted from realty...but deluded will work even better for those boomy youngsters!! very_evil_smiley.gif 

Well i'm fairly young (or so I like to think so), and i don't want big boomy bass that over powers everything else.

 

So there is still a little hope for the younger generation. biggrin.gif

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post #10 of 42
2/21/13 at 5:03am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sound Quest View Post

Well i'm fairly young (or so I like to think so), and i don't want big boomy bass that over powers everything else.

 

So there is still a little hope for the younger generation. biggrin.gif

 

I guess so, in some point the understanding of the balanced sound will come to visit you. You can get a used K702 for a great price.

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post #11 of 42
2/21/13 at 6:29am

Hi,
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sound Quest View Post

Do they really lack bass? Or does it just seem that way at first if you're accustomed to more bass emphasized headphones?

 

I took a look at the frequency response graph at headphone.com and compared the frequency measurement to the highly regarded Sennheiser HD600's.

 

Surprisingly the graph clearly shows that the K702s have slightly stronger sub bass than the HD600's, yet i've seen it being said that anything below 30hz on the K702's is "non-existent".

 

So how can this possibly be?


I have tested the previous version (K701) and the HD600 here:

http://www.head-fi.org/t/648968/a-headphone-group-review-for-speaker-listeners-testing-eight-headphones-from-80-to-1-200

You may notice that without XBass I found both HD600 and K701 bass shy, so much so that it bugged me and I would not consider these headphones for my own use unless there is a way to correct this deficiency. So yes, they lack bass, as does the HD600.

You may also notice that for both headphones I felt the XBass setting on my iFi iCAN head-amp needed for a balanced sound was the same. My main system uses floor standing 3-Way speakers with a 10" bass, to give some reference of what bass I am used to. They have a solid, deep bass, but without being buddy, imprecise or overly resonant. 

I would say after the correction the K701 was bass champion. I loved the way they get down and boogie and give scale and impact to music.The HiFiman HE-500 were rather close though and that WITHOUT XBass.

BTW, I hunted down that headphone graph comparison site you used. It is very good. I have here the Shure SRH-1440, HiFiman HE-500, Sennheiser HD600 and AKG K701 (all of which I reviewed).

 

 

 


If you read the reviews and my reactions to the bass of each of them, these graphs clearly tell the truth, for bass at least.

 

I can make less sense higher up, but I think I can see why the Shure bothered me sounding edgy and why I felt the HE-500 was too laid back for truthful sound.

Nice site, i will add these graphs and some comments to my reviews. Good thread, i am really learning stuff.

Cheerio Rich

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post #12 of 42
2/21/13 at 7:05am
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by bedlam inside View Post

Hi,
 


I have tested the previous version (K701) and the HD600 here:

http://www.head-fi.org/t/648968/a-headphone-group-review-for-speaker-listeners-testing-eight-headphones-from-80-to-1-200

You may notice that without XBass I found both HD600 and K701 bass shy, so much so that it bugged me and I would not consider these headphones for my own use unless there is a way to correct this deficiency. So yes, they lack bass, as does the HD600.

You may also notice that for both headphones I felt the XBass setting on my iFi iCAN head-amp needed for a balanced sound was the same. My main system uses floor standing 3-Way speakers with a 10" bass, to give some reference of what bass I am used to. They have a solid, deep bass, but without being buddy, imprecise or overly resonant. 

I would say after the correction the K701 was bass champion. I loved the way they get down and boogie and give scale and impact to music.The HiFiman HE-500 were rather close though and that WITHOUT XBass.

BTW, I hunted down that headphone graph comparison site you used. It is very good. I have here the Shure SRH-1440, HiFiman HE-500, Sennheiser HD600 and AKG K701 (all of which I reviewed).

 

 

 


If you read the reviews and my reactions to the bass of each of them, these graphs clearly tell the truth, for bass at least.

 

I can make less sense higher up, but I think I can see why the Shure bothered me sounding edgy and why I felt the HE-500 was too laid back for truthful sound.

Nice site, i will add these graphs and some comments to my reviews. Good thread, i am really learning stuff.

Cheerio Rich

 

Hey, thanks for your input. I'm glad you like the graph site, I think it comes in very handy.

If I was to buy the K702's, I would be powering them with the Fiio E17 and E09k docking station. But I have no idea what effect the bass-boost functions on the E17 would have on these headphones. I don't want big boom "beat pro" like bass, I just want the bass to be present, without sounding thin or tinny like.

 

I've heard a few people complain that the K702's sound thin and tinny, which is a bit hard to believe considering the overwhelming positive reviews that they get. I just wish I had them in front of me right now with the DAC and Amp, just so I could find out with my own ears.

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post #13 of 42
2/21/13 at 7:48am
What are those home audio speakers?
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post #14 of 42
2/21/13 at 7:53am
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by dcfis View Post

What are those home audio speakers?

 

What do you mean?

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post #15 of 42
2/21/13 at 7:58am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Acix View Post


With a decent hps amp you can easy hear down to 20hz. About ''lack bass'', those rumors are spread by diluted kids that want cheap high end hps with a boomy bass.

Could not put it better myself. Give this headphone a good amp and it has oodles of bass, not the wooly stuff I hear from the so called "great" headphones around here which are all bass centric . I tried the Senn Momentums the other day, dreadful headphones with wooly bass, little definition or subtly.

I am actually considering getting another pair of these, I sold mine a couple of years ago because I fell for the "headfi" what should sound right thing but thankfully have moved on. Listening to the pair I sold my friend through a Rega amp the sound was involving, clean and had everything in proportion.

And soundquest, I truly do not feel the amp your looking at is good enough for these headphones. The last thing you want to be doing is EQ'ing a headphone to sound right to you. Much better to carefully system match components to get the sound you desire. The sound will be more authentic in the long run.

I have used in the portable area the SR71-B with these and it is a good enough amp to drive them well, this is not just about power, it is about quality, the Fiio may have the power but it certainly does not have the quality to get the best out of these phones I feel
Edited by ianmedium - 2/21/13 at 8:03am
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