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The Fiio X3 Thread. - Page 435

post #6511 of 12909
Quote:
Originally Posted by shrimants View Post

EDIT: holy crap i broke 1000 posts!

Grats mate, must be the power of the X3 at work eh :P

post #6512 of 12909
Quote:
Originally Posted by shrimants View Post

I think you misunderstood me. Take, for example, the play mode. There are 3 options: Repeat, Shuffle, Repeat Once.

Right now you use volume buttons to scroll back and forth through these 3 options.

I always wonder, why do we NEED to go backwards AND forwards? Why is it so hard to press the "OK" button to just cycle through ? Repeat -> Shuffle -> Repeat Once -> Repeat.

I'd say press/hold the "scroll down" button should start scrolling by alphabet.

Definitely double button is an annoyance. but thats up to Fiio to decide, i guess.

I also dunno what is up with gapless clicks. seems like a very intermittent issue.

I do think that multi-buttons or double/triple clicking buttons would be a good option for various functions, though I dont know what functions.

UI consistency and ease of learning are just as important as speed of operation. Having the volume button choose between options and ok to select them is consistent. And going by your proposal, what would you do about media lib update, where you use volume buttons to select between auto anf manual AND ok to do a manual update?

Ditto the double click / multi-press proposals. Not learnable without reaching for the manual.
post #6513 of 12909
Here's the wall of text I wrote in Chinese explaining the proposed multi-level category navigation. Hope there will be enough room left in the firmware rom to add the required code lol

那category的改进要求收到详细信息是这样的
category下有album genre artist
如果选album就直接显示所有album
如果选genre选了例如rock这風格之后则应该再有以下选项:
artist
album
all songs
如果这时选all songs则显示所有合该genre的歌,不过应该按 专辑一>track no.顺序而不是全部同genre的歌按filename顺序
如果选genre之后选album,则须要列出所有包含符合该genre的曲目的album,这时选一album则列出该album的所有歌
如果选genre之后选artist,则应该显示所有有曲目符合该genre的artist.这时选了一歌手应该再有以下选项:
album
all songs
如果这时选all songs则显示所有合该genre和artist的歌,不过应该按 专辑一>track no.顺序而不是全部符合條件的歌按filename顺序
如果选genre和artist之后选album,则须要列出所有包含符合该genre和artist的曲目的album,这时选一album则列出该album的所有歌

如果category下选了artist选了一歌手之后则应该出现
genre
album
all songs
的选项,其操作原理和上述genre下的菜单的操作一样。
post #6514 of 12909
Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe Bloggs View Post

UI consistency and ease of learning are just as important as speed of operation. Having the volume button choose between options and ok to select them is consistent. And going by your proposal, what would you do about media lib update, where you use volume buttons to select between auto anf manual AND ok to do a manual update?

Ditto the double click / multi-press proposals. Not learnable without reaching for the manual.

Right, I wasnt sure about those ones. One one hand, everything kind of works. on the other hand, we'd be freeing up buttons. Thats why I said its better for dev to decide this one. However, to answer your question, I'd seperate those into 2 menu options. One for the manual/auto option and another for an "update now" option. Alternatively, I'd create a submenu for the media library.

Media Library >
* Update Type: auto/manual
* ReInitialize Library (no more eject card, update, insert card, update)
* Update Library

For double click/multiple buttons, I think you're right about having to read the manual, but I dont think needing to memorize a couple of button presses would irritate many users if it actually adds something of value. The question is, what would be added? For example: If we do OK+Back at the same time, can that do screen off? That would be pretty cool, users wouldnt really care to read the manual for it but it would definitely be a nice function to have. Similarly, sometimes I'm in "now playing" screen, I press and hold "back" to get to menu. Now i cannot get back to my folder position. Obviously I can browse to the folder position, but what if I could press 2 buttons at once or something? like volume +/- at the same time, as an example. or even simply press/hold the back button again to go right back to the "now playing" screen, and if i single-press "back" it will put me into the folder structure or the category view, whichever I was using. Does that make sense?

Definitely these are feature requests though, not even close to something i'd consider important. Just fun ideas to toss around.
post #6515 of 12909
Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe Bloggs View Post

Here's the wall of text I wrote in Chinese explaining the proposed multi-level category navigation. Hope there will be enough room left in the firmware rom to add the required code lol

那category的改进要求收到详细信息是这样的
category下有album genre artist
如果选album就直接显示所有album
如果选genre选了例如rock这風格之后则应该再有以下选项:
artist
album
all songs
如果这时选all songs则显示所有合该genre的歌,不过应该按 专辑一>track no.顺序而不是全部同genre的歌按filename顺序
如果选genre之后选album,则须要列出所有包含符合该genre的曲目的album,这时选一album则列出该album的所有歌
如果选genre之后选artist,则应该显示所有有曲目符合该genre的artist.这时选了一歌手应该再有以下选项:
album
all songs
如果这时选all songs则显示所有合该genre和artist的歌,不过应该按 专辑一>track no.顺序而不是全部符合條件的歌按filename顺序
如果选genre和artist之后选album,则须要列出所有包含符合该genre和artist的曲目的album,这时选一album则列出该album的所有歌

如果category下选了artist选了一歌手之后则应该出现
genre
album
all songs
的选项,其操作原理和上述genre下的菜单的操作一样。
Great, seems like what I wanted from the few english words tongue.gif Would you mind translating/summarizing it? Then everyone would know what exactly has already been asked of the devs.
post #6516 of 12909
Quote:
Originally Posted by binc View Post

Great, seems like what I wanted from the few english words tongue.gif Would you mind translating/summarizing it? Then everyone would know what exactly has already been asked of the devs.

If it helps, this is what I sent to Joe. Its got the list of bugfixes from earlier along with the way I said the artist/album and track numbering should be sorted out. I dont know what Joe wrote in chinese, but it approximates to what is written in this document on the first page.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/b7yiook6m654bjo/Fiio%20X3%20Bug%20Fixes%20V1.0%20shrimants.doc
post #6517 of 12909
Quote:
Originally Posted by pennylane View Post
 

So are there any playback issues with AAC at all?  ie, decoding, gapless, etc?  I need to try it myself, but just wondering.. I've been mulling over switching from MP3 to AAC for lossy codec and don't see why not.

 

For me, AAC has not produced that many problems.

 

As someone else mentioned, it´s not really gapless. The tiny pop isn´t very disturbing to me but to others it very well might be. It should be noted that this pop is probably produced by the AAC encoder delay of 1024 samples (the encoder adds silence, called 'priming').

 

Otherwise, AAC is the only codec yet NOT producing any phase errors... or other errors for that matter. Of course, floating point decoding isn´t used which makes the FiiO unsuited for 'Mastered for iTunes'-files.

 

However, I´ve noticed that the FiiO stops after having played one album in AAC and having started the next album (AAC). After the second or third track of the second album it simply stops. It´s still responsive though I can´t change the track. I can navigate through the menu, press all the buttons etc. but I cannot start another track. I have to shutdown it with force. I haven´t reported this yet because I wanted to wait until the decoding issue has been corrected.

 

Don´t know if this happens with MP3 or with OGG as well. But this also happened when using WMA Professional. But that decoder was buggy anyway.

post #6518 of 12909
Quote:
Originally Posted by Unfie View Post
 

Is mp3 playback really that bad? I was about to pull the trigger on getting these until I read about the mp3 issues. I have a good amount of FLAC files since I started buying CDs, but mp3s are still a big part of my collection. I hope it gets fixed soon because I want to try this out.

 

Yes, it is. You can still buy it though, FLAC playback is perfect.

 

And why would you hesitate buying it? It´s not that MP3 decoding issues are destroying the MP3s, you know. And when it gets fixed, the MP3 files already residing on the SD card / internal memory will be played the same way - only with (hopefully) better quality.

post #6519 of 12909

Been a bit interested in the X3, was hoping to get answer on a couple of questions.

 

1. This is essentially an e17 as far as dac/amp goes, with a dap on top? Thats what I keep hearing but just wanted to confirm.

 

2. When plugged into a laptop for usage of usb dac, does it use the battery as power source and consistently keeps charging it or can it take the power over usb and bypass the battery? Should one be concerned of the battery getting worn out quickly if used a lot with a laptop?

 

3. Anyone tried these with a pair of Q701? Obviously not looking to use those as portable, just curious of how it'd sound.

 

Thanks!

post #6520 of 12909
Quote:
Originally Posted by benandjerry View Post
 

3. Anyone tried these with a pair of Q701? Obviously not looking to use those as portable, just curious of how it'd sound.

 

Got to try it with a Q701 at a recent hi-fi show. I'd still miss a proper desktop amp, but it was a lot better than my old "power blackout/thunderstorm" rig, which was to use the iPad2 to drive the HD600 (instead of as a digital server). The dealer had amps strapped to it but personally (YMMV) the gains in SQ were too small for me to bother strapping anything to it if I got one. Overall, if I had the Q701 and the power's out, I'd definitely be happy if I had the X3 instead of using a tablet.

post #6521 of 12909
Quote:
Originally Posted by shrimants View Post


I think you misunderstood me. Take, for example, the play mode. There are 3 options: Repeat, Shuffle, Repeat Once.

Right now you use volume buttons to scroll back and forth through these 3 options.

I always wonder, why do we NEED to go backwards AND forwards? Why is it so hard to press the "OK" button to just cycle through ? Repeat -> Shuffle -> Repeat Once -> Repeat.

I'd say press/hold the "scroll down" button should start scrolling by alphabet.

Definitely double button is an annoyance. but thats up to Fiio to decide, i guess.
 
I also dunno what is up with gapless clicks. seems like a very intermittent issue.

I do think that multi-buttons or double/triple clicking buttons would be a good option for various functions, though I dont know what functions.

No misunderstanding. I do agree with your idea of using the OK button to cycle, what I meant was instead of just leaving the volume buttons as volume only, maybe we could use em for alphabetical skipping. If another method was available that would be great too - maybe a 2 speed scrolling (hold the down/up button for 2+ seconds, and then scroll speed doubles). I can't imagine what it would be like having to scroll through 64gb worth of mp3 right now.

 

As far as the screen turning on what I'd do is probably have it so that the track skip, and volume buttons would act immediately without having to turn on the screen first. Then have it so that the menu/back button would still act as a screen activation if someone wants to just check whats playing (hope that makes sense).

 

Having read what Joe said about consistency and such, he does make some valid points, but there hopefully can be some improvement that will benefit everyone without having to relearn the whole process.

 

Congrats on 1000 posts,

Cheers.

post #6522 of 12909
Quote:
Originally Posted by benandjerry View Post

3. Anyone tried these with a pair of Q701? Obviously not looking to use those as portable, just curious of how it'd sound.

I have only had X3 a few days (FW2.1) and I was pleasantly surprised how much I like my Q701 (bass modded) with it. I'm not saying it drives them at the best possible level (?) but for my personal tastes I enjoy the pairing (I'm not a fan of the Q701 in standard form).

post #6523 of 12909
Quote:
Originally Posted by Marlene View Post
 

 

Yes, it is. You can still buy it though, FLAC playback is perfect.

 

And why would you hesitate buying it? It´s not that MP3 decoding issues are destroying the MP3s, you know. And when it gets fixed, the MP3 files already residing on the SD card / internal memory will be played the same way - only with (hopefully) better quality.

Also keep in mind that while the issue definitely manifests in testing, many people have had very positive listening experiences using MP3 files (including me). Some tube amps that people swear by test awful (several% THD anyone?)

So it would be fair to say that while there is possible room for improvement it is not "bad" as is.


Edited by sbradley02 - 11/21/13 at 2:24pm
post #6524 of 12909
Quote:
Originally Posted by sbradley02 View Post

Also keep in mind that while the issue definitely manifests in testing, many people have had very positive listening experiences using MP3 files (including me). Some tube amps that people swear by test awful (several% THD anyone?)
So it would be fair to say that while there is possible room for improvement it is not "bad" as is.
Agreed. To give some perspective, the distortion is at about -60db which in everyday units is 1/1000000 times as big as the signal. I.e. The signal is 1 million times stronger than the noise. Of course, it's not as simple as this, because our hearing isn't linear, but I think to most people, under most listening conditions, it shouldn't be particularly bothersome. I have a few mp3s and they don't seem significantly worse than the FLACs and AAC files I have.
post #6525 of 12909
Quote:
Originally Posted by tjw321 View Post


Agreed. To give some perspective, the distortion is at about -60db which in everyday units is 1/1000000 times as big as the signal. I.e. The signal is 1 million times stronger than the noise. Of course, it's not as simple as this, because our hearing isn't linear, but I think to most people, under most listening conditions, it shouldn't be particularly bothersome. I have a few mp3s and they don't seem significantly worse than the FLACs and AAC files I have.

And that is about the same as you get with a pristine vinyl record.

I get a huge kick out of some of the posts in Head-Fi along the lines of "DAC chip XYZ with SNR of 130dB has to be much better than DAC chip ABC with SNR of 120dB".

 

One thing I am curious about - question for Marlene - what was used for a test signal?

 

And I am not saying this isn't something that Fiio shouldn't be paying attention to - they should. Just don't make a buying decision based on it. My Fiio X3 handily beat my Colorfly C4 and I am looking forward to the X5 when it comes out, and yes I will continue to use MP3s almost exclusively.

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