Head-Fi.org › Forums › Equipment Forums › Portable Headphones, Earphones and In-Ear Monitors › Earsonics SM64: The Impressions Thread
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

Earsonics SM64: The Impressions Thread - Page 49

post #721 of 1296
Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe Bloggs View Post


Bad analogy on sagan's part. Full colour gamut LCDs don't yet exist (but note that it is the extremes that are cut off, analogous to 20k and 15Hz on headphones). Full hearing spectrum IEMs can be had relatively cheaply.

 

That's true...  Keep in mind, I'm not saying that the drop at the 5kHz is a positive thing, but there is a reason why it's done.

post #722 of 1296
Quote:
Originally Posted by tinyman392 View Post

A lot of custom stage monitors cannot actually.  Lots of manufacturers cut this area out for the same reason Earsonics did.  They don't do it to the degree Earsonics did, but they do do it.  Westone, Shure, UE, Aurisonics...  The list goes on. 

Stage monitors are meant for... stage monitoring. Being able to hear your own voice above the din of the band is a different requirement from hi fi listening. wink.gif
post #723 of 1296
Quote:
Originally Posted by tinyman392 View Post

 

A lot of custom stage monitors cannot actually.  Lots of manufacturers cut this area out for the same reason Earsonics did.  They don't do it to the degree Earsonics did, but they do do it.  Westone, Shure, UE, Aurisonics...  The list goes on. 

SE5/AC2 from Westone have no suckout, neither do the UE customs, nor the Shures. Dips, around 10db max yes, SM64's 5k is de-emphesized  by 3 times the amount, that's the difference between a moderate dip and complete suckout. It simply comes off as a crossover error poorly excused by the manufacturer.


Edited by Inks - 6/27/13 at 11:38pm
post #724 of 1296
Personally I find that suppressing frequencies around 10k has a greater effect on suppressing sharp sounding sibilance...
post #725 of 1296
Westone um3x has a 25dB suckout around 5k that's even wider bandwidth than the sm64. I wouldn't say that puts the sm64 in good company though as I auditioned the um3x before knowing about its FR and it did sound like cr@p... wink.gif
post #726 of 1296

nope 10db for UM3X,just use low OI sources


Edited by Inks - 6/27/13 at 11:46pm
post #727 of 1296
Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe Bloggs View Post

Bad analogy on sagan's part. Full colour gamut LCDs don't yet exist (but note that it is the extremes that are cut off, analogous to 20k and 15Hz on headphones). Full hearing spectrum IEMs can be had relatively cheaply.

Yeah not a great analogy. I only mean to say that something that should be there isn't. Like if a piano couldn't play F#?
post #728 of 1296

All I know is that to my ears, this medium/treble transition sounds good....really natural, never piercing, organic, sweet, convincing....

 

Those who have listened to it and I really mean LISTENED or better: those who have them, do you think that you feel something lacking there... please can all those who listened to them answer... no graphs arguments please. 

 

IS THERE REALLY SOMETHING LACKING IN VOICES (female), TIMBRES, GUITARS, CYMBALS?

 

I think that the real question is that.... is something lacking?

 

Why can't we also speak this language instead?tongue_smile.gif


Edited by sly_in_the_sky - 6/27/13 at 11:54pm
post #729 of 1296
Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe Bloggs View Post

Personally I find that suppressing frequencies around 10k has a greater effect on suppressing sharp sounding sibilance...

Once you hit 9k the ear's resonants don't come into play [no longer does the ear de-emphasize], so if anything, de-emphasizing 9-10k makes a lot more sense to avoid harshness or sibilance. Their excuse is simply horrible, it's a poor crossover implementation they're trying to justify. 

post #730 of 1296

Ok... Ink want to push graphs discussions...and continue to do provocation...

 

So funny....bigsmile_face.gif I love you Ink....

 

I want to push listenning experiences... please those who read, also show that we can speak about listenning experience....


Edited by sly_in_the_sky - 6/28/13 at 12:04am
post #731 of 1296
Quote:
Originally Posted by sly_in_the_sky View Post

Ok... Ink want to push graphs discussions...and continue to do provocation...

 

So funny....bigsmile_face.gif

 

I want to push listenning experiences... please those who read, also show that we can speak about listenning experience....

 

We're illogical though for doing so Sly ;). Then again the last time I checked enjoying music is not a science. :P

post #732 of 1296
Quote:
Originally Posted by Inks View Post

nope 10db for UM3X,just use low OI sources

I see a 10dB dip in the raw data on innerfidelity but 25dB on the compensated curve
Quote:
Originally Posted by sly_in_the_sky View Post

All I know is that to my ears, this medium/treble transition sounds good....really natural, never piercing, organic, sweet, convincing....

Those who have listened to it and I really mean LISTENED or better: those who have them, do you think that you feel something lacking there... please can all those who listened to them answer... no graphs arguments please. 

IS THERE REALLY SOMETHING LACKING IN VOICES (female), TIMBRES, GUITARS, CYMBALS?

I think that the real question is that.... is something lacking?

Why can't we also speak this language instead?tongue_smile.gif

I think it would be a bit much for us to shell out for an expensive pair of earphones that we expect to sound bad just to say we have personally listened to them. All I can say is I reproduced such a 5kHz cutout using parametric EQ on my etys. It didn't sound horrible but it sure sounds better without it (I matched volume between the two settings to eliminate the well known human bias towards the louder sound). For reference, I do actually add a 10dB narrowband cut at 7.5kHz to compensate for me not being able to insert the etys deep into the ears. But such a compensation would make measurements flat at 7.5k,not cut out, and has nothing to do with 5k anyway, so that's neither here nor there confused.gif

Of course, people are going to say that simulation using EQ is nothing like the real thing, despite experiments conducted by the Audio Engineering Society that shows cheap and expensive headphones to be nigh indistinguishable in SQ when FR is matched, never mind that the experiment was conducted using full size headphones where sonic interaction with the subjects' head and ear are much more unpredictable and objective sonic performance of cheap full size headphones are generally much inferior to expensive ones whereas even very cheap IEMs can show exemplary measurements, so if anything one would expect the experiment to be even more "successful" if using IEMs... confused.gif
Edited by Joe Bloggs - 6/28/13 at 12:13am
post #733 of 1296
Quote:
Originally Posted by tinyman392 View Post

 

A lot of custom stage monitors cannot actually.  Lots of manufacturers cut this area out for the same reason Earsonics did.  They don't do it to the degree Earsonics did, but they do do it.  Westone, Shure, UE, Aurisonics...  The list goes on. 


Why cut out the range that  doesn't cause harshness? Sibilance starts kicking in from 6-7khz and gets harsher as we move up to 11 or 12khz. Ocharaku, Sennheiser all tried to reduce the half wavelength resonance within 6-8khz to cut down sibilance with their latest offerings, not 5khz.

post #734 of 1296
Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe Bloggs View Post


I see a 10dB dip in the raw data on innerfidelity but 25dB on the compensated curve
I think it would be a bit much for us to shell out for an expensive pair of earphones that we expect to sound bad just to say we have personally listened to them. All I can say is I reproduced such a 5kHz cutout using parametric EQ on my etys. It didn't sound horrible but it sure sounds better without it (I matched volume between the two settings to eliminate the well known human bias towards the louder sound). For reference, I do actually add a 10dB narrowband cut at 7.5kHz to compensate for me not being able to insert the etys deep into the ears. But such a compensation would make measurements flat at 7.5k,not cut out, and has nothing to do with 5k anyway, so that's neither here nor there confused.gif

IF's compensation method has it's issues [to that compensation, the 8320 has flat 5k, when in reality it has way too much of it], if you compensate it with a Olive-Welti or the ISO standard, it's like a 15db drop,about half of the SM64s. 


Edited by Inks - 6/28/13 at 12:18am
post #735 of 1296

I think that we can easilly mix both words...

 

What mades me mad is that the last 3-4 pages, the discussions is becomming boring and always saying the same thing...

 

when a good IEM is touching crowd... -> Ah, we have the HF DOGS that come and want to destroy it never listened to it but showing graphs...

 

I Have seen that in most IEM threads (at least the lasts)...


Edited by sly_in_the_sky - 6/28/13 at 12:14am
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
Head-Fi.org › Forums › Equipment Forums › Portable Headphones, Earphones and In-Ear Monitors › Earsonics SM64: The Impressions Thread