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How do these speakers look for nearfield listening

post #1 of 14
2/2/13 at 10:01am
Thread Starter 

I am building a 2.1 systems; passive speakers, and a sub. 

Speakers I have notices:

PSB image B5 or B6 http://www.crutchfield.com/p_760IMGB6C/PSB-Image-B6-Dark-Cherry.html?tp=186#details-tab

Paradigm Mini Monitor

http://www.newaudiovideo.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&products_id=9706

 

How will either of this speakers do?  They will be placed on either side of my computer monitor.

Will they be too bright?

Any other suggestions for speakers?

 

Thanks

 

PS No active speakers.  I want the flexibility of a passive speaker system.

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post #2 of 14
2/2/13 at 10:13am

Those aren't near-field monitors, theyre bookshelf speakers.  While they'd work just fine, they wont have the flat response at close-range that you're looking for

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post #3 of 14
2/2/13 at 11:41am
Quote:
Originally Posted by El_Doug View Post

Those aren't near-field monitors, theyre bookshelf speakers.  While they'd work just fine, they wont have the flat response at close-range that you're looking for

And how do you know that they are not flat enough, and what he wants? LOL

That's just nearfield monitor marketing hype, a "these are not the droids you are looking for" magic attempt. Based on these measurements of the PSB Image B6, looks like they do measure with a +/- 3db response from 60Hz–20kHz: http://www.stereophile.com/content/psb-image-b6-loudspeaker-measurements

One thing about the PSBs is that they have a 6 ohm impedance rating. Make sure your amp is rated for that. But the B6 would be my choice over the Paradigms because of the little bit lower frequency response. Sitting nearfield, the subwoofer output is more likely to be localizable the higher you have to set the crossover. And read the rest of that review (not just the measurements page), and you'll see the listening test was very favorable.

I use Energy Vertias V5.1s in my desktop system--comparable in class to the PSB Image series. I really like them. What kind of sub are you going to get?
Edited by cel4145 - 2/2/13 at 11:42am
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post #4 of 14
2/2/13 at 12:32pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by cel4145 View Post


And how do you know that they are not flat enough, and what he wants? LOL

That's just nearfield monitor marketing hype, a "these are not the droids you are looking for" magic attempt. Based on these measurements of the PSB Image B6, looks like they do measure with a +/- 3db response from 60Hz–20kHz: http://www.stereophile.com/content/psb-image-b6-loudspeaker-measurements

One thing about the PSBs is that they have a 6 ohm impedance rating. Make sure your amp is rated for that. But the B6 would be my choice over the Paradigms because of the little bit lower frequency response. Sitting nearfield, the subwoofer output is more likely to be localizable the higher you have to set the crossover. And read the rest of that review (not just the measurements page), and you'll see the listening test was very favorable.

I use Energy Vertias V5.1s in my desktop system--comparable in class to the PSB Image series. I really like them. What kind of sub are you going to get?


My thoughts exactly.  I am not going to go with a speaker just because it has the flattest frequency response. 

 

What do you mean by a bit lower frequency response?  Does that mean the PSB plays lower frequencies than the Paradigm? 

I don't have a sub yet but I was planning on using the sub's internal crossover to send the higher frequencies to the speakers.

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post #5 of 14
2/2/13 at 12:54pm
As far as using the sub's internal crossover (without bass management from an AVR that has hipass filters for the speakers that allows for multiple crossover points to be set), often the crossover settings end up being somewhere near the -3db point of the frequency response where the speaker are rolling off (a good guess). So based on the specs of the two speakers, you'd probably up having to set the sub crossover 10hz or so higher with the Mini Monitors than the PSB B6. I've also heard others say this about the Mini Monitors.

And if by chance you wanted to see a comparable speaker with a flatter response, the Ascend Acoustics CBM-170SE are very, very flat until they start to roll off at 100hz (check their measurements page). They are Internet direct speakers that are considered the same class as the Paradigm Monitors, PSB Image, and B&W 600 series.

So what kind of sub are you thinking?
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post #6 of 14
2/2/13 at 1:28pm
Thread Starter 

I am not sure what sub.  i have to do research on the nature of different sub's crossovers.  It is hard to find a receiver or amplifier with internal crossover that doesn't cost 700 or doesn't have cheapish components like an affordable 5 or 7 channel receiver.  So I am thinking of plugging the amp's speaker output to the subwoofer's high level input, and plug the subwoofer's output to speakers.

I would rather have an adjustable crossover, but I have heard that many sub's have a fixed crossover when using high level input/outputs. 

 

Honestly I just bought an SVS PB12-NSD but I don't have the space for it and it doesnt have high level input/outputs.  I plan on returning it.

 

Edit: Those Ascend Acoustics 170 are too wide for my desk


Edited by GerGa - 2/2/13 at 1:36pm
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post #7 of 14
2/2/13 at 7:16pm
Right. A lot of subs do have adjustable low pass crossovers filters. They just don't have a high pass filter as well. And you tend to see more of those high level input and output pairings on budget subs, which don't have high pass filter capability. However, I think the SVS SB12-NSD has an RCA input/output option that uses an 80hz high pass filter on the RCA output. It's smaller, too, than the PB12. Check the manual or call SVS. The other problem you'll have is that other than SVS, Rythmik, Power Sound Audio, Outlaw Audio, and HSU, then most of the subs available are really not good price/performance values. For example, to get an equivalent performer to the SVS PB12-NSD from a traditional speaker vendor, you'll likely end up having to pay $1200 to $1500 MSRP. Unless you get them on sale, it's just not worth it.

If you want multiple crossover options, other than an Outlaw Audio RR2150, an AVR is the way to go. Now instead, you could get a mini-DSP and run your source to it, and then setup high pass and low pass filters for the RCA outputs. If you bought an integrated amp with pre-out/amp in, you could run the pre-out to the mini-dsp. Nice thing about it is that it has a built in parametric EQ if you ever get serious enough to get a measurement mic and work with REW or some other measurement software.

It would be easier to get a Denon receiver with Audyssey MultEQ (or better version) since the room correction software will EQ both the speakers and the sub automatically. I think you'd be surprised how good one of those can sound, especially given the benefits of the bass management and Audyssey.
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post #8 of 14
2/3/13 at 5:26am
Thread Starter 
I want a system with one volume control. I feel like with the mini dsp, I would have separate volume adjust at the sub.

That said, Im stuck to subwoofers with high level input/output.
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post #9 of 14
2/3/13 at 8:10am
Quote:
Originally Posted by GerGa View Post

I want a system with one volume control. I feel like with the mini dsp, I would have separate volume adjust at the sub.

I would assume you are looking at integrated amps or 2 channel receivers since you want better electronics. Many are going to have pre-amp outputs/amp inputs to connect that properly so you can use the volume control. Pretty common feature.
Quote:
Originally Posted by GerGa View Post

That said, Im stuck to subwoofers with high level input/output.

Well, good luck with that. I really do think you'll have a hard time finding a non-budget sub that has that feature.
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post #10 of 14
2/3/13 at 8:36am
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by cel4145 View Post


I would assume you are looking at integrated amps or 2 channel receivers since you want better electronics. Many are going to have pre-amp outputs/amp inputs to connect that properly so you can use the volume control. Pretty common feature.
Well, good luck with that. I really do think you'll have a hard time finding a non-budget sub that has that feature.

Please explain how this would work.
It seems to me like you are saying connect source to amplifier, amplifier's preamp out to minidsp, minidsp to sub, and also minidsp back into amplifier??????????, then amplifier to speakers?

I find that you are telling me to operate my amplifier with two inputs(which is not possible).  Either that or I do not understand what you suggest I do with the minidsp.


Edited by GerGa - 2/3/13 at 8:40am
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post #11 of 14
2/3/13 at 8:51am
Quote:
Originally Posted by GerGa View Post

It seems to me like you are saying connect source to amplifier, amplifier's preamp out to minidsp, minidsp to sub, and also minidsp back into amplifier??????????, then amplifier to speakers?

An integrated amp is a preamp and a power amp. Two units in one. The preamp is where you are plugging in sources, a switching unit for changing between them, the volume control, tone controls, etc. The power amp then receives the signal from the preamp and amplifies it. Many have a set of RCA inputs and outputs on the back that connect the two. Here it is on the HK 3490 circled in red:



So you can plug up as many sources as you want up to your integrated amp and use your volume control. Then preamp out to mini dsp input. Mini dsp has 2 sets of outputs. One would go back to the main amp input on the back of your amp, the other to the subwoofer.
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post #12 of 14
2/3/13 at 8:56am
Oh and that HK 3490 is a 2 channel stereo receiver. In this case, what makes it a receiver is that it has AM/FM. So it's the same as an integrated amp with a tuner built in so it can "receive."
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post #13 of 14
2/4/13 at 5:12pm
Thread Starter 

It looks like the minidsp needs to be connected to a computer to use it?

 

I was about to buy power monitors and preamp(dacmagic plus)..until I realized I couldn't use the DACmagic plus without a computer.  I may sometimes want to use my system with an MP3 player as source, and a computer may not be available.

 

So it would be nice if I utilize the MiniDSP without a computer.  Possible?  Or are there alternatives to the MiniDSP?
 

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post #14 of 14
2/4/13 at 7:50pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by GerGa View Post

It looks like the minidsp needs to be connected to a computer to use it?

I was about to buy power monitors and preamp(dacmagic plus)..until I realized I couldn't use the DACmagic plus without a computer.  I may sometimes want to use my system with an MP3 player as source, and a computer may not be available.

So it would be nice if I utilize the MiniDSP without a computer.  Possible?  Or are there alternatives to the MiniDSP? 

Read some more to verify, but I think you just need the computer to setup the minidsp. To program it with the settings you want, and then disconnect it and use it. Then you don't need a computer again unless you want to change the programming on it.
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