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HD600 in the form of an IEM with very good isolation - Page 2

post #16 of 71
Quote:
Originally Posted by ZARIM View Post

The Grado GR10 and Sony EX1000 are closest match to the HD600 in term of soundsignature and both offers very detailed mids, highs and good punchy bass with great imaging.

X2!

post #17 of 71
Thread Starter 
Grado GR10 and Sony EX1000 seem amazing, but isolation is also key here and unfortunately they appear to be average in that area.

I was just having a look at headroom's graph in comparison to the ER-4S and I find their similarity very interesting; http://graphs.headphone.com/graphCompare.php?graphType=0&graphID[]=3271&graphID[]=743

It looks like the Grado's have a low-shelf increase below ~800z and a bell-shaped decrease at around 2khz and ~15khz in comparison. Excuse my inexperience but is this because Grado based their IEM's off the Ety's?
post #18 of 71

I've owned the Etys and I have to say they aren't that close to the HD600 in sound signature. My recommendation would be the Westone UM3X which I think is the closest I've come to the HD600 in IEM form. The soundstage is noticeably smaller though, but with similar warmth and midrange.

post #19 of 71

I haven't heard the hd600, but i've heard the 580 and 439 and while both different, I found even the 439 to be more accurate than all of the IEMs I've tried so far.  For neutrality the ety and westone are good, but they are not hd600 good based on comparative reviews of the senn models as well as graphs.

 

I can say the westone 4r (my current IEM) is very muffled sounding when compared side by side to any more neutral over ear phone.  The hd600 improves upon the treble a lot compared to the 439, and the westone 4r is more soft treble than the 439 even.  Using accudio you can simulate other headphone's fr curves.  While it doesn't give you the true quality, it shows the basic difference in frequency response.  With the 4r I'm actually using the senn hd600 setting regularly as it makes the 4r sound much more neutral and clear.  The shure 535 has pretty good bass, i wouldn't say it is prominent in the sense that it is boosted, but rather it sounds that way because of the lack of highs.  They are no where near as detailed highs as the westone or senn over ears.

 

The pfe 232 is pretty good treble wise, but I find it is exaggerated v shaped, so not really the same sort of sound as the senns either.

 

The closest thing I've heard would probably be the pfe112 or tdk ba200.  Neither as good still, but both much more neutral then any other iem I've heard with no EQ so far.  I was looking for the same thing personally, and I've found that after a bunch of IEMs and a price of up to $500 there simply is not an IEM with that quality of sound.  I haven't tried everything, so it's possible there are options out there, but as different as the models have been that I've tried, they all share a similar IEM-ness that just sounds different.

 

Don't get me wrong, some of these IEMs sound excellent, just not as good in my opinion.  I find the weakest point is almost always the treble.  80% of IEMs have severely rolled off treble, harsh treble or they sacrifice something else completely to get good treble and thus don't sound good anyway.

 

Price-wise the ba200 would be my master value pick being as close as it gets for an affordable sum of money.  IEMs have there own benefits, but I would just wear your hd600 in public and cover your head with an air tight space helmet.  That should give you even better isolation than an IEM and you get the bonus of looking cool at the same time.


Edited by luisdent - 2/7/13 at 5:04pm
post #20 of 71

I know you said no customs IEMs but you can get custom molds for any in ear headphones for under $100 if you find the right place…

post #21 of 71
Thread Starter 

Are the UM3X overly colored and muddy sounding? There is a huge processing delay on my ER-4S. rolleyes.gif Supplier in Hong Kong. I found a local that had the DBA-02 MKII which wasn't mentioned in this thread but they had a dropped price so I bought them too. Browsing around here I can read they're accurate sounding too. They should arrive monday and come with triple-flanges like the ER-4S so the isolation should be good!

With the HD600, what appeals to me most (apart from the warm (but not colored) oomph they provide on well recorded, well mixed & mastered cinematic film scores ala audiophile versions of 'Rise' from the TDKR OST and several tracks from Transformers: Dark of the Moon) is the mid to highs, they feel so balanced and present. These factors really help when I'm using them in the studio, I really know I've done it right, I tend to 'feel' it and I haven't been wrong so far, but accurate/
neutral/analytical works well too.



Cheers
 

----

Quote:
Originally Posted by luisdent View Post

I haven't heard the hd600, but i've heard the 580 and 439 and while both different, I found even the 439 to be more accurate than all of the IEMs I've tried so far.  For neutrality the ety and westone are good, but they are not hd600 good based on comparative reviews of the senn models as well as graphs.

 

I can say the westone 4r (my current IEM) is very muffled sounding when compared side by side to any more neutral over ear phone.  The hd600 improves upon the treble a lot compared to the 439, and the westone 4r is more soft treble than the 439 even.  Using accudio you can simulate other headphone's fr curves.  While it doesn't give you the true quality, it shows the basic difference in frequency response.  With the 4r I'm actually using the senn hd600 setting regularly as it makes the 4r sound much more neutral and clear.  The shure 535 has pretty good bass, i wouldn't say it is prominent in the sense that it is boosted, but rather it sounds that way because of the lack of highs.  They are no where near as detailed highs as the westone or senn over ears.

 

The pfe 232 is pretty good treble wise, but I find it is exaggerated v shaped, so not really the same sort of sound as the senns either.

 

The closest thing I've heard would probably be the pfe112 or tdk ba200.  Neither as good still, but both much more neutral then any other iem I've heard with no EQ so far.  I was looking for the same thing personally, and I've found that after a bunch of IEMs and a price of up to $500 there simply is not an IEM with that quality of sound.  I haven't tried everything, so it's possible there are options out there, but as different as the models have been that I've tried, they all share a similar IEM-ness that just sounds different.

 

Don't get me wrong, some of these IEMs sound excellent, just not as good in my opinion.  I find the weakest point is almost always the treble.  80% of IEMs have severely rolled off treble, harsh treble or they sacrifice something else completely to get good treble and thus don't sound good anyway.

 

Price-wise the ba200 would be my master value pick being as close as it gets for an affordable sum of money.  IEMs have there own benefits, but I would just wear your hd600 in public and cover your head with an air tight space helmet.  That should give you even better isolation than an IEM and you get the bonus of looking cool at the same time.


Cool! But... what the hell man?

post #22 of 71

Compared to ER4S the UM3X will sound muddy but relative to everything else I think the bass is terrific.

post #23 of 71
Quote:
Originally Posted by Manofwood View Post

Are the UM3X overly colored and muddy sounding? There is a huge processing delay on my ER-4S. rolleyes.gif Supplier in Hong Kong. I found a local that had the DBA-02 MKII which wasn't mentioned in this thread but they had a dropped price so I bought them too. Browsing around here I can read they're accurate sounding too. They should arrive monday and come with triple-flanges like the ER-4S so the isolation should be good!

With the HD600, what appeals to me most (apart from the warm (but not colored) oomph they provide on well recorded, well mixed & mastered cinematic film scores ala audiophile versions of 'Rise' from the TDKR OST and several tracks from Transformers: Dark of the Moon) is the mid to highs, they feel so balanced and present. These factors really help when I'm using them in the studio, I really know I've done it right, I tend to 'feel' it and I haven't been wrong so far, but accurate/
neutral/analytical works well too.



Cheers
 

----


Cool! But... what the hell man?

 

What do you mean "what the hell man"?  You wouldn't wear a space helmet in public?

post #24 of 71

I would seriously advice against getting the etymotics and dba they sound too thin in comparison to the senns. Get the um3x or the tdk as others have mentioned. You can't get any closer to the senns than those 2.

post #25 of 71
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by helljudgement View Post

I would seriously advice against getting the etymotics and dba they sound too thin in comparison to the senns. Get the um3x or the tdk as others have mentioned. You can't get any closer to the senns than those 2.

The Etymotic ER-4S and Fischer Audio DBA02 MKII have already been purchased. No return /refund policy. I just placed an online order for the TDK BA200 as well though. I just noticed I have spent over $600 and haven't used an IEM since the 90s. I'm terrified!
post #26 of 71
Quote:
Originally Posted by helljudgement View Post

I would seriously advice against getting the etymotics and dba they sound too thin in comparison to the senns. Get the um3x or the tdk as others have mentioned. You can't get any closer to the senns than those 2.
+1. I've always found etys thin and very finicky to get the fit and isolation right... Mind you I do have large canals and generally use large tips. Another point to consider, is when using any IEM or phone in noisy environments, you need a slightly emphasised bass because the surrounds will recess the bass a little. Etymotics never performed well of me in planes and so on. Quiet rooms are another thing altogether.

I too have not heard HD600s so I'm reluctant to make an alternate recommendation, and I think you will probably go through a few until you find the ones you like best. That said I have a few of the IEMs mentioned here and since I prefer neutral sounding phones, I absolutely love my W4Rs. Since stopping to use Comply tips, I don't find them muddy at all and I would have said that clarity and detail is quite accurate.

Just some things to consider....
post #27 of 71
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jpfe8851 View Post


+1. I've always found etys thin and very finicky to get the fit and isolation right... Mind you I do have large canals and generally use large tips. Another point to consider, is when using any IEM or phone in noisy environments, you need a slightly emphasised bass because the surrounds will recess the bass a little. Etymotics never performed well of me in planes and so on. Quiet rooms are another thing altogether.

I too have not heard HD600s so I'm reluctant to make an alternate recommendation, and I think you will probably go through a few until you find the ones you like best. That said I have a few of the IEMs mentioned here and since I prefer neutral sounding phones, I absolutely love my W4Rs. Since stopping to use Comply tips, I don't find them muddy at all and I would have said that clarity and detail is quite accurate.

Just some things to consider....

 

I have the 4r and while i do love them, i find them not near neutral without eq, no matter what tips i use.  thought he silicone improve the treble a good deal.  use accudio for a while with the hi-fi setting and then go back.  they'll sound muffled and boxed in.  not bad relatively speaking, but not studio neutral.  ironically, i've been using the hd600 simulation in the accudio app for my 4r.  i wanted to see what it sounded like, and it softens the treble a bit from the hifi, which i think is just a tad too bright, and it sounds so good.  I'm stuck on that now.  I hate eqing them, but they are the closest thing to a perfect iem.  everything else i've tried just sounds bad in one way or another compared to the 4r.

 

the etys for me were the same.  thin and i could never easily get a fit.  it was like i needed to spend 20 minutes to get them to sound right, and then i could move or i'd lose it. ha.

 

i'll have my hd600 monday probably btw ;)

post #28 of 71

Having owned the UM2 for 6 years, demoed the UM3X, and bought the Shures and Phonak instead, the greater eapansive soundstage of other IEM just pulls you away from the Westone UM series. They have a monitoring purpose but for general listening it is hard to recommend them once you hear a different approach

 

As a recommendation it veers this thread even more off course

post #29 of 71

Luisdent, I think our different sources may be the explanation. As you mention Accudio a few times, am I correct in assuming you are using an iPod Touch or iPhone? Accudio is a terrific app and a great way to get most any IEM or phone to sound like your preferred phone so long as you listen to an iDevice unamped. 

 

I recently purchased an iBasso DX100 and this has a far wider and consistent frequency spectrum than my iPhone 5 which I now rarely use for music. I never need to EQ my W4s or current crop of earphones with this DAP. But now all my phones sound either warm or dull out of the iPhone by comparison. And on the DX, my Shure 535s sound way too bright and the Limited Edition red ones are fatiguing now but the W4s just right. Probably sell both my Shures soon.

 

Anyhow, for the OP, I think this just emphasises my earlier comment that you will possibly go through a few different IEMs before you find the ones you like best for no other reason than everyone's ears and preferences are different and opinions are subjective. 

post #30 of 71

im a noob but i dont think it requires a pro to know that you probably wont get VERY good isolation if you are looking for a similar sound signature coming from an open back headphone.

 

the best and closest is probably a closed vented iem to match hd600's signature which wont give you the kind of extreme isolation in fully closed iems.

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