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Which come closer to AKG K 240 DF? - Page 3

post #31 of 44
Quote:
Originally Posted by amigomatt View Post

I think one would be hard pressed to find a more 'honest' headphone for the price.

 

The Yamaha HP-50 I graphed above cost me about 15 €. I'd rate them higher than the DF in all but soundstage and upper treble.


Edited by vid - 4/1/13 at 11:34am
post #32 of 44
Quote:
Originally Posted by vid View Post

 

The Yamaha HP-50 I graphed above cost me about 15 €. I'd rate them higher than the DF in all but soundstage and upper treble.

15Euro?  Wow!  I've just seen thesem the only pair on ebay for 259 Euros! 

 

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/YAMAHA-HP-50A-Vintage-High-End-Kopfhorer-Headphones-Neu-Ovp-1J-Gewahrleistung-/261192067206?pt=DE_TV_Video_Audio_Sonstige&hash=item3cd042a886

post #33 of 44

That person has been trying to sell them for quite a while. Probably waiting for a collector to stroll by.

 

From what I've seen, a typical going price is below 30 €. There are also other similar (and better) models in the Yamaha ortho line that are worth looking into. Many of them are equally cheap.

post #34 of 44
Quote:
Originally Posted by vid View Post

That person has been trying to sell them for quite a while. Probably waiting for a collector to stroll by.

 

From what I've seen, a typical going price is below 30 €. There are also other similar (and better) models in the Yamaha ortho line that are worth looking into. Many of them are equally cheap.

Having just invested in a pair of HE-400s, do you think I would still get some enjoyment/something different from such a pair of orthos?

post #35 of 44

I've not heard the HE-400, so can't say really. There's quite a bit of room for modding with vintage orthos, and the rewards can be very good considering the price, so I could see a person enjoying them in more than one way. I'd recommend keeping an eye on auctions and lowballing some bids based on your budget for entertainment. They probably won't wreck your economy in any case.

 

Be aware that some HP-50 models (there are three in total) are wired mono and need a soldering iron to convert to stereo. In that sense some of the other Yamaha HP models may be more convenient.


Edited by vid - 4/1/13 at 3:49pm
post #36 of 44
Quote:
Originally Posted by vid View Post

I've not heard the HE-400, so can't say really. There's quite a bit of room for modding with vintage orthos, and the rewards can be very good considering the price, so I could see a person enjoying them in more than one way. I'd recommend keeping an eye on auctions and lowballing some bids based on your budget for entertainment. They probably won't wreck your economy in any case.

Be aware that some HP-50 models (there are three in total) are wired mono and need a soldering iron to convert to stereo. In that sense some of the other Yamaha HP models may be more convenient.

Thanks for the info, I'll keep my eye out.
post #37 of 44
Quote:
Originally Posted by vid View Post

 other Yamaha HP models may be more convenient.

Doesn't the HP3 share it's driver with the HP50, or am I confusing it with another model? (or confusing it with something else entirely rolleyes.gif)

post #38 of 44
Quote:
Originally Posted by GREQ View Post

Doesn't the HP3 share it's driver with the HP50, or am I confusing it with another model? (or confusing it with something else entirely rolleyes.gif)

 

I don't think anyone knows. I do know that many know that there is big unit variation in HP-3 and HP-50.

post #39 of 44

I've found the drivers for the k240 DF available online. I was thinking about buying them to mod my k271. Would this be a upgrade do you think?

post #40 of 44

I really wish these 240 Dfs had more bass.  They might very well become my favourite headphone with a more substantial low end to them.  Does anyone know of any mods to get more bass response from these beauties?!  They are so revealing and musically engaging.  With small group orchestral stuff and any material with already plumped out bass, these are great, but with more neutral orchestral and acoustic/real instrument recordings, they are definitely wanting in the low end.  It's a really disappointing flaw for me.  I mean, I can't understand anyone who would have thought that this lack of bass is ok and acceptable/realistic.

post #41 of 44

If you've already got the pleather ear pads on, one thing that might have increased the bass for me SLIGHTLY was inserting a thin doughnut of foam underneath the earpad. Careful not to block the baffle vents. 

 

Many headphone companies already use this technique IN the earpad by leaving the inside that you don't see open to the foam with fabric. But the AKG pad is completely sealed.

post #42 of 44
Thanks, GREQ, I tried the spare foam rubber rings from my spare HifiMan HE400 velours and it definitely made an improvement both in comfort and sound! I tried the velours on the AKGs but they weren't great..
post #43 of 44

Having both the K-240DF and Monitor and Studio... They're nothing alike. The DF are co-o-old. And this is coming from other monitor headphones (ATH-M40). That is more or less all right really, they can get nice with the right type of music, but, there's that other quirk which is rather putting off. Everything in the DF sounds as if it were floating somewhere in the middle of space with no walls. Yes, this is how monitor speakers in an anechoic room might sound (or might've sounded, the new ones typically have a bit more presence in the very high frequencies, 10-20 KHz). That's my gripe with them. It can be a bonus, suppose if you're listening to classical music off CDs or MP3 files (gasp), then the DF will actually kill off the nastiest, harshest high frequencies above 11 KHz (that's low-res sampling for ya, 44100/11025=4 coordinates/cycle). Same about jazz, they might have a coldish tint, but they'll simply remove the harshest parts and present the more realistic midrange/low treble. Which is why many Head-Fi owners might love them. Maybe with the right "warmish" amp they're nicer, but here, straight out of a sound interface or mixer (or even tape deck), they're, well, clinical.

 

But with decent high-res sampling formats and vinyl and tape the DF are, well, cold. They're pretty useful as a tool, for editing, say. Some folks still swear by them as THE headphones that can replace monitor speakers (if you've ever mixed music, you'll know this is sort of a holy grail of pro headphones' owners). Listening for pleasure though? Mmm no, again, that soundstage out-in-the-middle-of-nowhere-with-no-walls is just too disembodied for me. It might work for some electronical music as a "fantastic space arena" maybe...

 

Frankly, of the three, the Studio and the Monitor are nicest. Recabled Monitor can give a realistic impression of anything (e. g. there's that part in Jarre's "Chants Magnetiques" that gives the impression of floating on top of a magnetic wave, to use an example from the era when K-240M were produced). Studio actually are the ones with the worst sound quality of all (in spite, or maybe because of the largest diaphragms). They're quicker, but they're also coarser than the Monitor (and DF) properly driven and recabled (older AKG headphones, like the Sextett and K-141 Mk. 1, can be stunning recabled, it's a 3-D kind of sound).

 

So... If there's anything to recommend to someone who's looking for a K-240DF replacement, it's either another DF-equalised headset (DT990?), or an AKG sibling like the Sextett or K-141 Mk. 1 (silver). These won't disappoint, the K-141/K-240 Sextett are warmer than the DF while having a similar spacey character.

post #44 of 44
Quote:
Originally Posted by amigomatt View Post
 

I really wish these 240DF had more bass. They might very well become my favourite headphone with a more substantial low end to them. Does anyone know of any mods to get more bass response from these beauties?! They are so revealing and musically engaging. With small group orchestral stuff and any material with already plumped out bass, these are great, but with more neutral orchestral and acoustic/real instrument recordings, they are definitely wanting in the low end. It's a really disappointing flaw for me. I mean, I can't understand anyone who would have thought that this lack of bass is ok and acceptable/realistic.

 

Wa-a-ay back then it was actually the kind of bass you'd get out of small, precise studio monitor speakers mounted correctly (with no obstacles or bass-reinforcing walls). It is, technically, rather realistic (what you get is what you hear in a mix, more or less, they're not really that "straight"). Also bear in mind that mixing/monitoring with less bassy headphones will make one boost bass in a mix. It's a rule of inverse returns. Using bassy headphones or speakers for mixing usually produces a bassless mix. What musicians, composers, sound engineers, etc. look for is therefore accuracy.

 

What you can do, like Greq suggests, is mould the pads to fit your ears better. Maybe plaster them slightly by pressing on the headphone cups, then see how they mould around the skull, and then use stuff like plastic fibre to mould the donuts from the inside. The aim is to prevent air from escaping from in-between the head and headphones. Any open space has to be covered by the moulded donuts. This improves bass response (bass needs a good seal).

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