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Which come closer to AKG K 240 DF? - Page 2

post #16 of 44

Could've been worse anyway, I've overpaid by much more on vintage AKG.

 

I wonder, did your pair come with either a small jack and an attachable big jack adaptor, or with a single big jack? The older models with the big jack seem to go for more money.

 

And I suspect one could make the ultimate DF by taking the drivers from a newer version and putting them in the older cup design. From the one pair I've seen, the cup is probably the weakest point of the more modern versions.

post #17 of 44

I've never heard the DF, but from what I gather (from lots of reading on headfi) it's fairly/very similar to most other vintage K240's (I own K240 Monitor and K241) - with that in mind, the vintage Beyer DT990 (which I also own) is a totally different headphone, and I'm a little surprised it's being compared to the K240 breed.

 

It's a much darker sound, with quite a lot more more bass and the soundstage is more impressive. 

It does most music very well especially if it needs bass, but I much prefer K240 for classical, acoustic and rock and critical listening. 

 

Still a great phone though. biggrin.gif

post #18 of 44
I only won them last night, so still waiting for them to arrive. I suspect about a week from Germany.


Looking at the photos, they are the ones with the adapter..

They look to be in nice condition to me.

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/AKG-K-240-DF-Kopfbugel-Kopfhorer-Schwarz-AKG-K-240-/350725764490?redirect=mobile&nma=true&si=xYpR5xHEqLei4Ih7N2zIYRUVHag%253D&orig_cvip=true&rt=nc&_trksid=p2047675.l2557
post #19 of 44
Quote:
Originally Posted by amigomatt View Post

Looking at the photos, they are the ones with the adapter.

 

Looks like a newer one, yeah. Though hard to say how new. Make sure you check out the baffle when you get the headphones - if it has a paper-like sound filter, you want to make sure there are no tears in it.

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by GREQ View Post

I've never heard the DF, but from what I gather (from lots of reading on headfi) it's fairly/very similar to most other vintage K240's (I own K240 Monitor and K241) - with that in mind, the vintage Beyer DT990 (which I also own) is a totally different headphone, and I'm a little surprised it's being compared to the K240 breed.

 

It's a much darker sound, with quite a lot more more bass and the soundstage is more impressive. 

It does most music very well especially if it needs bass, but I much prefer K240 for classical, acoustic and rock and critical listening. 

 

Still a great phone though. biggrin.gif

 

Compared to the DF, I found the K 241 more focused-sounding: quicker with better imaging. Though the DF had better details and treble, which some might find the more important aspects. I'm surprised the K 241 gets so little attention - their decay, though apart from two or three ugly peaks of ringing similar to the Sextett, measures about as fast as a good vintage ortho, and their sound isn't far from one either. Not as good in the mids nor bass, but still similar in quickness.

 

The vintage DT 990 does sound darker than the DF, but on the other hand the DF, unlike its name would have it, takes some liberties in how it goes about implementing diffuse field equalization. They've got an extra brightness peak at 5 kHz or so, while the vintage DT 990 have what some (or just I) might call a perfect diffuse field curve.

 

As far as what comes closest to the DF in actual frequency response, that would be the K 250.

 

 

But then, the K 250 is probably not what most people would like, so I wouldn't recommend them in this case.

post #20 of 44
i still consider DF a reference headphone. love mine. i would try orthos man if you like the DF. the t50rp if modded good can have wonderful midrange like the DF's. t50rp was probably my fav right next to the DF. that's of course if you don't mind modding(it's really easy. especially if you resist that playdoh crap people use.it'll just ruin the inside). you can try to find a vintage yamaha hp-1 as well. lot of the vintage orthos have killer clean midranges. they just won't have the air the DF's do.

if want to stick to akg. try the sextetts LP model. the lp models tend to have more upper registers and great bass extension. the sextetts probably closest you get the DF's in the akg range. never liked the 701/702 series.
post #21 of 44

As a DF owner, I'd get the K 241 for the $30 or so they cost used. Then, if the 241 didn't rock my world, I'd put the DF drivers into the 241 cups. Improves the sound by giving a faster decay - at least it did with my DF. Plus you get a better cable.

post #22 of 44
Quote:
Originally Posted by vid View Post

As a DF owner, I'd get the K 241 for the $30 or so they cost used. Then, if the 241 didn't rock my world, I'd put the DF drivers into the 241 cups. Improves the sound by giving a faster decay - at least it did with my DF. Plus you get a better cable.

The last few K241's I saw online went for around $60-70... either more people are taking notice and giving them the price they 'deserve', or they're getting confused with sextetts by the less knowledgeable.

post #23 of 44

One pair seems to have gone for 30 € or so not long ago, which is less than I paid a year ago. Past $50 is definitely paying too much.

 

Got the DF for 57 €, which is about as much as I'd comfortably pay.

 

(Also, despite the K 250 having a 16-page, 10000-view thread on here, their price has pretty much stayed at 30 € or less. So I'm not exactly sure how much hype one can give vintage cans before crossing the line.)


Edited by vid - 3/3/13 at 11:47am
post #24 of 44

I'm hoping that my Xonar Essence STX will drive these cans.  They do have 3 settings on the OSD,  Normal Gain 0db (0-64ohms), High Gain +12db (64-300ohms) and Extra High Gain +18db (300-600ohms).   I also have an Arcam Alpha 8 integrated amplifier, which I'm sure will do the job.  I'll be listening to my vinyls through that set up, but I do have one hell of a lot of music on my PC that I'd like to be able to enjoy properly without having to fork out for additional amplification.  I presume my Fiio E11 won't have the balls to run these from my portable devices?

 

Any thoughts?


Edited by amigomatt - 3/3/13 at 1:08pm
post #25 of 44

My thought is that my Auzen Bravura runs the DF ok. The Bravura should have a slightly better amp than the STX, but they're probably pretty similar anyway. Plenty of volume for the necessary bass boost.

 

My cheap integrated amp runs the DF a bit better, but not a huge difference.

post #26 of 44

Did a comparison of the DF to an electrostat in the same price range.

 

http://www.head-fi.org/t/650400/sennheiser-unipolar-2000/15#post_9223976

post #27 of 44
Quote:
Originally Posted by GREQ View Post

the vintage Beyer DT990 (which I also own) is a totally different headphone, and I'm a little surprised it's being compared to the K240 breed.

 

I agree! Just this weekend I have my friend's K 240 DF at home. I heard also the DT990. They are quite different headphones.

While DT990 has V-shaped character with emphasized bass and trebles, K240 DF is quite flat with a little bit bright sound.


Edited by bogi - 3/23/13 at 1:27pm
post #28 of 44
Quote:
Originally Posted by bogi View Post

I agree! Just this weekend I have my friend's K 240 DF at home. I heard also the DT990. They are quite different headphones.

While DT990 has V-shaped character with with emphasized bass and trebles, K240 DF is quite flat with a little bit bright sound.

 

Note that the vintage DT 990 and the modern DT 990 are also different headphones in that the vintage one has no emphasized treble. What I was driving at with my comparison is seen below (1/3 octave smoothing, to make the point clear).

 

 

This shows the raw frequency response of the vintage DT 990 (black) and DF (orange). In other words, here you can see (an estimation of) the type of equalization the phones are using. The DT 990 curve above 1 kHz is more or less a perfect diffuse field curve as used by e.g. Etymotic. The DF, on the other hand, uses a curve the sort of which I personally don't often see called diffuse field - i.e. with a brightness peak at 5 kHz. (AKG was wont to use this type of curve for diffuse field - for instance on the K 250 and K 241, and I think the K 260 may have had something like this as well.)

 

When the two raw responses are HRTF-compensated (using a diffuse field curve), the following results.

 

 

Again, black is the vintage DT 990 and orange is the DF. The DF's brightness peak remains, while the 990 comes to be more or less neutral in that range. For reference, I've included the Yamaha HP-50S (grey, modded) as well, since they seem to likewise be using a pretty accurate diffuse field curve.

post #29 of 44
Quote:
Originally Posted by vid View Post

As a DF owner, I'd get the K 241 for the $30 or so they cost used. Then, if the 241 didn't rock my world, I'd put the DF drivers into the 241 cups. Improves the sound by giving a faster decay - at least it did with my DF. Plus you get a better cable.

 

DF drivers with original baffle (i.e. with small sound ports).

 

DF drivers with K 241 baffle (i.e. with big sound ports).


Edited by vid - 4/1/13 at 8:09am
post #30 of 44
Well, I'm a couple of weeks into ownership of these headphones now, and I'd just like to remark on my experience.


At first, listening through either my Essence STX or my Arcam integrated (both which drive them sufficiently), I was very pleasantly surprised with their overall tonal character. The certainly are neutral, in that they don't lend much of their own colouration to the sound of recordings. This makes them great for 'analytical' listening. They are very enjoyable and musical too, but I immediately noticed the somewhat recessed bass response. I'm not a basshead my any means, but this was pretty obvious and I had be warned any this as well. It wasn't enough to make them disappointing, I just felt I had to choose my recordings wisely when listening to these.

Anyway, after some more research, I stumbled upon the idea of getting a cheap tube amp to drive these things. It was the best move I ever did. I bought the Bravo Audio Ocean amp and replaced the stock tube with a used Mullard from eBay. Wow! The warmth and slightly emphasised low end of that set up had complimented these AKGs perfectly. They sound much more lush now in the mids, with more low end, yet losing no detail up top. They have become less analytical and more musical. They'll never have killer bass, but they are now a unique and beautiful addition to my collection and I think one would be hard pressed to find a more 'honest' headphone for the price.

Just as a bonus, that little tube amp also smoothed away the tizziness in the top end of my HifiMan HE -400s as well, which stopped me from returning them. One happy camper here!
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