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What do great mids sound like? - Page 2

post #16 of 152
1/1/13 at 8:08am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mad Lust Envy View Post

Great mids sound like the HD650. biggrin.gif

 

Yet, you sold them. tongue.gif

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post #17 of 152
1/1/13 at 8:10am
Quote:
Originally Posted by mstark View Post

I'm quite new to all this, but this is my interpretation... am I right in that:

 

treble = high (frequency) range

mid-range = mid (frequency) range

bass = low (frequency) range

 

Bass heavy cans would emphasise the low range. This appeals to "bass heads", since they don't mind the extra "punch" at the loss of detail due to muddiness caused by an unnatural low frequency reproduction. (This effect is apparent in most cheaper cans?)

 

Mid-range cans emphasise the... mid-range. As has been mentioned, this is where "most of the music is". As far as I understand, an emphasised mid-range will make songs sound more natural, but may sacrifice some bass punch & clarity of high notes. (Audio-Technica signature sound?)

 

Now it's self explanatory what treble emphasising cans would sound like. (Grado signature sound?)

 

There's also neutral cans, but these seem to be referred to as "boring" nearly everywhere. People seem to want some "coloration", and "mid-range" seems to be the preferred one.

 

A truly great set of cans (usually $1000+ range) is one that can reproduce each of these ranges with distinction, a "clear" mid-range, "punchy" bass, and "sparkling" treble, without any of the trade off you may see in cheaper cans.

 

PLEASE CORRECT ME IF ANYTHING SOUNDS ODD! It's just my limited understanding from lurking around here for a few years.

 

Sorry if this isn't strictly on topic.

 

This is VERY ON TOPIC!

 

I think you have summed it up quite well.

I often find that my DT880s (I consider this a neutral can, some say they are too bright) will sound boring thru the wrong amp.

Other opinions may vary, for example, some folks say that Grados have a very warm midrange, and some folks just hate Grados. Which is cool.

I'm not trying to start an argument here, but my opinion is that HD650s sound muddy.  But they have tons of fans, so they certainly are doing something very right.

I will guess that Mr. Lusty Envy probably thinks Grados and Q701s are too bright. Which is cool. wink_face.gif

 

YMMV.

 

BTW, Red Car Moose, what does great Ice Cream taste like?

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post #18 of 152
1/1/13 at 8:19am

Funny how you (bow in respect) Headphonus Supremus' are drawn towards this thread.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mstark View Post

I'm quite new to all this, but this is my interpretation... am I right in that:

 

treble = high (frequency) range

mid-range = mid (frequency) range

bass = low (frequency) range

 

Bass heavy cans would emphasise the low range. This appeals to "bass heads", since they don't mind the extra "punch" at the loss of detail due to muddiness caused by an unnatural low frequency reproduction. (This effect is apparent in most cheaper cans?)

 

Mid-range cans emphasise the... mid-range. As has been mentioned, this is where "most of the music is". As far as I understand, an emphasised mid-range will make songs sound more natural, but may sacrifice some bass punch & clarity of high notes. (Audio-Technica signature sound?)

 

Now it's self explanatory what treble emphasising cans would sound like. (Grado signature sound?)

 

There's also neutral cans, but these seem to be referred to as "boring" nearly everywhere. People seem to want some "coloration", and "mid-range" seems to be the preferred one.

 

A truly great set of cans (usually $1000+ range) is one that can reproduce each of these ranges with distinction, a "clear" mid-range, "punchy" bass, and "sparkling" treble, without any of the trade off you may see in cheaper cans.

 

PLEASE CORRECT ME IF ANYTHING SOUNDS ODD! It's just my limited understanding from lurking around here for a few years.

 

Sorry if this isn't strictly on topic.

 

Your the OP so feel free to change the topic since we are (supposingly) helping you.

 

Neutral isn't necessarily borring, at least not if you pay enough, but on the other hand you often have to pay, say 200+ to get a can that is 'neutral'. Though, many are of the opinion that neutral cans does nothing real good, only mediocre... Not that I agree, even though it can be nice rocking out with some bassy cans.

But frequency response isn't all of course!

 

Im not sure midrange is the preferred coloration. Saw some poll somewhere and some 45 percent preferred their phones neutral.

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post #19 of 152
1/1/13 at 8:21am

Thanks Chris :)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris J View Post

I'm not trying to start an argument here, but my opinion is that HD650s sound muddy.  But they have tons of fans, so they certainly are doing something very right.

I've only had the chance to listen to HD598's, but they literally sound like a swamp to me after getting so used to the ESW10's (owned since launch), though it's probably not fair to compare a £150 can to a £500 one. If the HD598 compares to the HD650 like the ES7 compares to the ESW10, then I believe I would find the HD650 quite muddy, too. (Been considering a new set of full size cans recently, between HD650 and AD900/AD2000... I believe I will stay within the AT family).

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post #20 of 152
1/1/13 at 8:24am
I also found the HD650 muddy/veiled, I did not like it. Each to his own
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post #21 of 152
1/1/13 at 8:26am
Quote:
Originally Posted by MattTCG View Post

Yet, you sold them. tongue.gif

Had to choose the HE-400. The HE-400 is more versatile and a better all-rounder. The HD650 is amazing though...
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post #22 of 152
1/1/13 at 8:30am
Quote:
Originally Posted by mstark View Post

Thanks Chris :)

I've only had the chance to listen to HD598's, but they literally sound like a swamp to me after getting so used to the ESW10's (owned since launch), though it's probably not fair to compare a £150 can to a £500 one. If the HD598 compares to the HD650 like the ES7 compares to the ESW10, then I believe I would find the HD650 quite muddy, too. (Been considering a new set of full size cans recently, between HD650 and AD900/AD2000... I believe I will stay within the AT family).

 

Just my opinion here...

I have a pair of ESW10JP as well, they just don't do it for me.

I'm considering selling them.

Or maybe I should just listen to them non stop for a few hours to get my ears acclimatized to their sound signature.

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post #23 of 152
1/1/13 at 8:30am
Quote:
Originally Posted by davidsh View Post

 

 

Im not sure midrange is the preferred coloration. Saw some poll somewhere and some 45 percent preferred their phones neutral.

 

 

Hey!

 

That's my thread!

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post #24 of 152
1/1/13 at 8:49am

@davidsh,

I'm not the OP, I just entered the thread to look for understanding :P

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris J View Post

 

Just my opinion here...

I have a pair of ESW10JP as well, they just don't do it for me.

I'm considering selling them.

Or maybe I should just listen to them non stop for a few hours to get my ears acclimatized to their sound signature.

I'm likely biased towards them since they were my first, decently high-end, pair of headphones. They're just so much better than anything I'd ever used (mostly ~£100 cans). Now I've used them non-stop for 4 (5?) years, apart from sending them on a 6 month repair trip (during which I used HD25's instead). I've never used anything else in the same price range, but my friends own a number of £100-250 headphones and they just don't compare (understandably). I love them, but then, I'm just about to invest in full-size cans of the same price range (for more comfortable home listening), and my opinions might finally have a chance to change :). It does look like I'm pretty sold on the AT sound signature, though...

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post #25 of 152
1/1/13 at 9:13am

Nice thread cactus_farmer,

 

How about some examples of phones that represent great mids to have an overall mid thread...lol....

 

Beyer DT880


Edited by HeatFan12 - 1/1/13 at 9:15am
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post #26 of 152
1/1/13 at 9:24am
Quote:
Originally Posted by HeatFan12 View Post

Nice thread cactus_farmer,

 

How about some examples of phones that represent great mids to have an overall mid thread...lol....

 

Beyer DT880

 

I'll add a vote for the DT880, 600 Ohm. biggrin.gif

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post #27 of 152
1/1/13 at 9:47am
Quote:
Originally Posted by mstark View Post

@davidsh,

I'm not the OP, I just entered the thread to look for understanding :P

 

Ooops :P

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris J View Post

 

I'll add a vote for the DT880, 600 Ohm. biggrin.gif

Well, I own the dt880 250 ohms. Personally I would not say, that their mids are outstanding, though for the price... They just aren't as musical as I could wish, and they might be a bit slow and struggling at times, the PRaT is just not top notch. But they do represent very layered music quite good, as long as the track isn't to fast-paced.

But this is also compared to the HE-400/500's, which slaughter very fast paced metal. Still, I am wondering why their representation of multi-layered music aren't that good, when their seem to be VERY fast with a short decay?

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post #28 of 152
1/1/13 at 11:25am
Quote:
Originally Posted by MattTCG View Post

Now that funny considering you avatar. tongue.gif  

Even Head-Fi users must know there's more than one way to be beautiful. smily_headphones1.gif
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post #29 of 152
1/1/13 at 1:19pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by davidsh View Post

 

Ooops :P

Well, I own the dt880 250 ohms. Personally I would not say, that their mids are outstanding, though for the price... They just aren't as musical as I could wish, and they might be a bit slow and struggling at times, the PRaT is just not top notch. But they do represent very layered music quite good, as long as the track isn't to fast-paced.

But this is also compared to the HE-400/500's, which slaughter very fast paced metal. Still, I am wondering why their representation of multi-layered music aren't that good, when their seem to be VERY fast with a short decay?

 

I can only compare them to 'phones that I have heard extensively.

So take what I say in that context.

But I agree, they are far from the last word in transparency.

But for the price, no complaints, really.

Frankly, I'd like to get some better 'phones.

Like the Zen HD800, fer example.

And a better DAC.

And a better amp.

 

When does this stop? wink_face.gif

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post #30 of 152
1/1/13 at 1:46pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris J View Post

 

I can only compare them to 'phones that I have heard extensively.

So take what I say in that context.

But I agree, they are far from the last word in transparency.

But for the price, no complaints, really.

Frankly, I'd like to get some better 'phones.

Like the Zen HD800, fer example.

And a better DAC.

And a better amp.

 

When does this stop? wink_face.gif

It would be quite hard to settle, but if I have to, then I also know what the minimum fidelity I could be satisfied with is. 

For me, I could settle with the HE-400 and a proper amp/dac.

 

But ofc, it can always be better and more expensivewink.gif

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