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Project Sunrise/PS2 Tube Rolling Thread (and maybe even Project Horizon and Project Ember) - Page 23

post #331 of 398

has anyone tried the Project Sunrise with the Telefunken E88CC / 6922 tube from 1968 (made in Germany, Ulm). It retails around 120$ and I wonder if its worth getting it. 

 

Edit: ok I ordered one, will try myself :wink_face:


Edited by roamling - 5/12/14 at 4:36am
post #332 of 398

I have one.  At one point I considered it my best tube, and it probably still is, but every single tube I have (about 30) sounds excellent after I equalize volume levels.

 

It is not a cheap tube, but it is excellent in every way and you should not have to buy any more tubes.

 

You will like it.

post #333 of 398
Quote:
Originally Posted by chinook9 View Post
 

I have one.  At one point I considered it my best tube, and it probably still is, but every single tube I have (about 30) sounds excellent after I equalize volume levels.

 

It is not a cheap tube, but it is excellent in every way and you should not have to buy any more tubes.

 

You will like it.

 

great thanks for providing that insight. looking forward to get mine. 

 

by the way when you mention to equalize volume levels are you talking about different resistors? I am currently looking into getting 45k or 60k resistors with lower gain to make up for higher tube gain, but i am not sure which resistors to use with the sunrise

post #334 of 398

Referring to the sound level.  For a long time during tube rolling, when using headphones, I had noticed that the sound level changes many characteristics of SQ. Then recently I read a note by someone, whose judgement I trust, that after adjusting for sound level (equalizing it so the SPL is the same for both tubes) the difference between tubes is very hard if not impossible to detect (my paraphrase). 

 

Now, I don't have great ears, but I compared my best tube (TF E88CC) with my worst tubes (Shuguang 12AU7 and Mullard 6AQ6) and when comparing at the same volume level I could tell no difference.  I trust that many others can hear a difference, and I thought I did in the past, but during my brief experiment I couldn't.

 

I will do more testing, however, when I get a chance. 

post #335 of 398

Is there a reference comparison guide available on tube gain? I am currently using a vintage GE 6DJ8 ECC88 (smoked glass) tube recommended by Jeremy with my Sunrise III (in combination with a Sennheiser HD650).

 

Compared to the stock JJ ECC82 tube that came with the amp the gain of the GE seems to be much higher. With further tube rolling in mind I am looking for some comparison on how much gain certain types of tubes provide

post #336 of 398
Quote:
Originally Posted by roamling View Post
 

Is there a reference comparison guide available on tube gain? I am currently using a vintage GE 6DJ8 ECC88 (smoked glass) tube recommended by Jeremy with my Sunrise III (in combination with a Sennheiser HD650).

 

Compared to the stock JJ ECC82 tube that came with the amp the gain of the GE seems to be much higher. With further tube rolling in mind I am looking for some comparison on how much gain certain types of tubes provide


I'm not sure I've seen a comparison in one guide.  The following link has a video that is helpful for 12 volt tubes.

 

http://www.thetubestore.com/Gain-Factor

post #337 of 398
Quote:
Originally Posted by chinook9 View Post
 


I'm not sure I've seen a comparison in one guide.  The following link has a video that is helpful for 12 volt tubes.

 

http://www.thetubestore.com/Gain-Factor

 

This is a great video, exactly the kind of explanation i was looking for!

 

Currently a listen to a 30 gain tube which is giving me plenty of volume and i have the volume knob between 9-11 o'clock. With the ECC82 Tube which has the lowest gain of them all (around 17) I listen at 12-2 o'clock.

 

So judging by this there is really no need for me to use a very high gain tube, I guess I would be well below 9 o'clock on the volume knob with a 70 or even a 100 gain tube (even if the Sunrise can run these tubes). Is that a correct assessment? Correct me if I am wrong...


Edited by roamling - 5/15/14 at 2:20am
post #338 of 398

You've got it.

 

I have not experienced noticeable difference in sound quality between high gain and low gain tubes, however, I seem to remember that when I studied tubes, back in the mid 60s, I learned that high gain tubes had more potential to emphasize noise.  I don't believe any of my "favorite" tubes are high gain tubes.

post #339 of 398

Anyone have experience with these 6h6n?

And does anyone try the 6n27p? It's a low voltage tube with max plate voltage only under 30V so it will be perfect with the sunrise.

post #340 of 398

Went all the way to town and dropped some big money on 1955 MULLARD ..

 

cant wait to try it out :tongue_smile:

 

Processed By eBay with ImageMagick, z1.1.0. ||B2


Edited by roamling - 5/18/14 at 10:07pm
post #341 of 398

6N6P is a good one for the Sunrise.  I have never heard or even read about the 6N27P but I'd be interested in what you think.  According to my reference document, the logo indicates it is an older model from the Reflector plant, however, I'm not sure how accurate my source is.  Presently there are some of these tubes on eBay with what is reported to be the newer Reflector logo and these are 1969 vintage. Can you read the year on it?

post #342 of 398
Quote:
Originally Posted by roamling View Post
 

Went all the way to town and dropped some big money on 1955 MULLARD ECC82 12AU7 LONG PLATE SQUARE GETTER NOS...

 

cant wait to try it out :tongue_smile:

 

Processed By eBay with ImageMagick, z1.1.0. ||B2

 

Can you tell what factory it is from?  I'm not sure it matters, but for some reason I always thought the Blackburn factory was supposed to be best. 

post #343 of 398
Mullard's Blackburn factory, England, UK, in November, 1955
Edited by roamling - 5/18/14 at 10:10pm
post #344 of 398
Quote:
Originally Posted by roamling View Post
 

That was part of the listing on ebay UK, sellers seems to be very reputable:

 

Made at Mullard's Blackburn factory, England, UK, in November, 1955.

Emissions test results: 69/70

 

MICROPHONY TEST (ON TESTER): RESULT: 0

SLIGHT-MICROPHONY TEST (AUDIO): RESULT: 0 = Zero or negligible audible microphony at full volume)

 

Hope i did not overpay, but really wanted on of these tubes, I payed around 160$

 

That should be a good tube.  As far as the cost, if you want it, you just have to pay it and move on.  I have 30+ tubes ranging in price from $3 to $140 and the difference is very slight in any of them, however, I enjoy playing with them.  Also, we can always put them back up on eBay and get some of our money back. 

post #345 of 398
Quote:
Originally Posted by chinook9 View Post
 

 

That should be a good tube.  As far as the cost, if you want it, you just have to pay it and move on.  I have 30+ tubes ranging in price from $3 to $140 and the difference is very slight in any of them, however, I enjoy playing with them.  Also, we can always put them back up on eBay and get some of our money back. 

 

Yes, thats what I thought. I decided to get two very good tubes that I really wanted and thats it. So I got the Telefunken E88CC / 6922 (Ulm 1968) and the 1955 MULLARD ECC82. So I consider that sufficient and wont get any other tubes, for now...

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