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From Senn HD 555 to Hifiman HE400... not impressed - Page 3

post #31 of 98
Quote:
Originally Posted by aiacuone View Post

i listen to all music, but if i had to narrow it down..... id say more leaning towards 70s rock along with house/electro.
When i bought these i guess i was expecting this endless perfect deep profound bass when i chucked on a electro but also had clarity with the rock.

I dont think im going to get a very good balance with these cans. I dont to be able to get that massive thump from a drum kick but also get the gradual deep beats of a rnb song. The problem ive got at the moment is that ive adjusted my levels for everything pretty well, the i put something like this on (please dont attack the song... old favourite, love the bass line) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GsyJVv-9ygM, the cans just distort and i find myself either turning down or adjusting it.

In the back of my mind of got the idea that an amp would help that but theres also an element of doubt.

I think there is something wrong with your system. I get zero distortion even if I EQ bass quite heavily. Mayby you could try different source (mp3 player maybe?) or turn off all EQ settings. (like someone said, EQ only when you really know what you are doing).
post #32 of 98
Quote:
Originally Posted by Habu View Post


I think there is something wrong with your system. I get zero distortion even if I EQ bass quite heavily. Mayby you could try different source (mp3 player maybe?) or turn off all EQ settings. (like someone said, EQ only when you really know what you are doing).

 

What EQ are you using?  Some EQs (e.g. most EQs built into soundcard drivers and Poweramp for android) interface directly with the system volume and raise the system volume in response to a bass boost and does the "cut not boost" thing for you.  For EQs without this feature, you either have to lower a preamp setting to compensate or just cut all the bands except the bass to compensate, if no preamp setting is available.

 

He said VLC, which appears to be an equalizer with a preamp you can lower, but which doesn't appear to be linked to the system volume.


Edited by Joe Bloggs - 12/8/12 at 5:33am
post #33 of 98

Which files are you using for most of your music playback?

post #34 of 98
Quote:
Originally Posted by MattTCG View Post

 

Sorry but this is quite incorrect. The bass produced with the he400 on velours does not change from pleathers. I know that it sounds contradictory but it's true. Feel free to ask around of those using the velours. 

 

I found some frequency response graphs which are one better.  You're right, the velours don't reduce bass.

 

I was extrapolating from my experience exchanging pleather pads for cloth pads on another pair of cans, which did reduce bass dramatically.

post #35 of 98

^^ Okay got it. 

post #36 of 98
Quote:
Originally Posted by aiacuone View Post

Hello to all, new here but ill get straight into it

Lerked these forums for a bit because i was interested in an upgrade from my HD555 (had them for around 3-4 years) and was looking for something with a bit more bass and grunt.

Did the "upgrade" from a 555 to a 595, wasnt tooooooo impressed but i was still surprised at how much louder my headphones were. I was originally going to get a set of Denon 2K's but stock finished and i wasnt really up for someones hand me downs so i thought ill get a set of HE400's. Ive been using them for around 3 hours now and i have to say despite the reviews.... these headphones arent much "IN COMPARISON" to the HD555 (or 95)

Let me put it this way, if i went straight from just your average in ear hp's to the 400s i would be impressed but i paid 150 for the sennys, i just paid 420 for the HE400s and the difference... especially in treble is almost negligible.

Admittingly i dont have an amp, but due to its low impedance i thought that it wouldnt matter that much, especially seeing as though my research has told me that it only increases volume not quality.

WHAT AM I MISSING GUYS?!?! ok it sounds better, but not $270 better. Are my 555s good or are my 400s ****? Or do i need an amp?

Thankyou

Whats the output impedance of the device you are feeding your cans with?
post #37 of 98
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Docks View Post


Whats the output impedance of the device you are feeding your cans with?

 

Im using a current 15" Macbook Pro Retina model so it is at (quick research).... 24 ohms.

Quote:
Originally Posted by davidsh View Post

Which files are you using for most of your music playback?

So glad you asked this question. This has been such a KEY part of this whole process. My music collection is made up of from the napster, limewire and current era (i have the physical copy of course) along with ripped cds and concert videos... before i go on with that do you guys find music videos to be fairly average in sound? I LOVVEEE some of the doors concerts.. along with acdc, queen and hendrix and i find the audio very bland, might be just my ears. ANYWAY so my music collection is from different states of technological eras so everything is ALL OVER the place in regards to sound quality and volume. Do you have some free and easy ways to get everything onto the same level? A while back i posted about how i would just change the song and the volume/quality would die and all my adjustments were pretty much pointless. I use a mac, so ive looked at programs such as ivolume which is supposed to do the job fairly well.. but at price... and a price that i havent paid yet.

 

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Habu View Post


I think there is something wrong with your system. I get zero distortion even if I EQ bass quite heavily. Mayby you could try different source (mp3 player maybe?) or turn off all EQ settings. (like someone said, EQ only when you really know what you are doing).

If i turn off all eq settings i basically get a very damp and flat sound (no bass and sounds tinny). Ive tried from a different source, NO IDEA whether or not its used for headphones. The amp i tried from is a Pioneer SC-LX73 that i bought about 2 years ago, i know its got some incredible power and quality for speakers but in regards to how it powers headphones i wouldnt have a clue. See the idea im getting with these headphones.. most probably all headphones is that you have to work with them in relative to their strong points so just slipping them into my home amplifier without any adjustments is pointless. Ive been adjusting these more and more and i have to admit im starting to like the sound..... i tell you what, when i get this perfect i am taking pictures, screen shots and notes on the settings.

 

I appreciate the frequency response pics guys but ive got to tell you... i have absolutely no idea what that means (wish i did)... could someone briefly explain what they mean? atleast the important parts?

post #38 of 98
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by davidsh View Post

Which files are you using for most of your music playback?

i got so excited i didnt answer your question properly. Theyre mainly mp3s from a big collection ive kept for around 10 years now. Ive got a few albums made of flac files which i explained before were around 40 mb each. Those are the songs im basing the majority of my settings off.. its just annoying when i get to a favourite and the volume is much lower

post #39 of 98
Thread Starter 

Just to give you guys an idea of where my settings are at with utterly no research, just tweeked from a preset.... along with a few songs of my rnb/rap collections, and yes this thread has been opened to abuse ahha

 

http://img23.imageshack.us/img23/264/equaliser.png

 

servers not letting me upload the image btw

post #40 of 98

Well with settings like those (particularly the lowered preamp) you shouldn't be getting digital distortion, however you certainly may be getting distortion from your macbook's onboard amp if you're driving the HE-400 hard.  Dat bass boost eats a lot of power
 

post #41 of 98
Quote:
Originally Posted by aiacuone View Post

 

Im using a current 15" Macbook Pro Retina model so it is at (quick research).... 24 ohms.

 

 

24 ohms, in this case, would typically mean you would get 'flabby and uncontrolled bass'. 

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by aiacuone View Post

i got so excited i didnt answer your question properly. Theyre mainly mp3s from a big collection ive kept for around 10 years now. Ive got a few albums made of flac files which i explained before were around 40 mb each. Those are the songs im basing the majority of my settings off.. its just annoying when i get to a favourite and the volume is much lower

IF you use mp3's use at least 200+ kbit files, i only use 320 kbit and flac files.

 

The frequency response charts are representing the loudness of the different frequencies. Starting low with the bass, going up to vocals and guitars, and further to hi-hats and etc.

post #42 of 98
Quote:
Originally Posted by aiacuone View Post

Just to give you guys an idea of where my settings are at with utterly no research, just tweeked from a preset.... along with a few songs of my rnb/rap collections, and yes this thread has been opened to abuse ahha

 

http://img23.imageshack.us/img23/264/equaliser.png

 

servers not letting me upload the image btw

 

Obviously different headphones will require different EQ presets. Run a frequency sweep, find the offending frequencies that you hear to be emphasized or de-emphasized, adjust accordingly, add on later to suit whatever music.

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by aiacuone View Post

Im using a current 15" Macbook Pro Retina model so it is at (quick research).... 24 ohms.

So glad you asked this question. This has been such a KEY part of this whole process. My music collection is made up of from the napster, limewire and current era (i have the physical copy of course) along with ripped cds and concert videos... before i go on with that do you guys find music videos to be fairly average in sound? I LOVVEEE some of the doors concerts.. along with acdc, queen and hendrix and i find the audio very bland, might be just my ears. ANYWAY so my music collection is from different states of technological eras so everything is ALL OVER the place in regards to sound quality and volume. Do you have some free and easy ways to get everything onto the same level? A while back i posted about how i would just change the song and the volume/quality would die and all my adjustments were pretty much pointless. I use a mac, so ive looked at programs such as ivolume which is supposed to do the job fairly well.. but at price... and a price that i havent paid yet.

 

With that kind of stuff, it's not even about the bitrate (although it is usually quite low). The source for that stuff is horrible, I've even heard radio/video recorded versions of the audio, stripped and uploaded. Forget the music format wars, loudness wars, mastering wars, everyone can agree on that crappy online rips most often sound crappy.

 

Try a ReplayGain-capable player for normalizing volume.

post #43 of 98
Quote:
Originally Posted by Katun View Post

 

I doubt an amp is going to change your opinion toward the HE-400. Save your money and find another headphone.

This. If you thought the performance increase was so small for an extra 300 dollars, theres no need to convince yourself into spending more money to try to i. You'd be better off getting another headphone then trying to convince yourself that you like one that you don't. Or, if your fine with your hd555s, just keep them and save yourself a few hundred bucks. There's no need to spend more money if you're perfectly content with what you have.


Edited by jwusoccer - 12/8/12 at 10:55pm
post #44 of 98
Quote:
Originally Posted by aiacuone View Post

Hello to all, new here but ill get straight into it

 

Lerked these forums for a bit because i was interested in an upgrade from my HD555 (had them for around 3-4 years) and was looking for something with a bit more bass and grunt.

 

Did the "upgrade" from a 555 to a 595, wasnt tooooooo impressed but i was still surprised at how much louder my headphones were. I was originally going to get a set of Denon 2K's but stock finished and i wasnt really up for someones hand me downs so i thought ill get a set of HE400's. Ive been using them for around 3 hours now and i have to say despite the reviews.... these headphones arent much "IN COMPARISON" to the HD555 (or 95)

 

Let me put it this way, if i went straight from just your average in ear hp's to the 400s i would be impressed but i paid 150 for the sennys, i just paid 420 for the HE400s and the difference... especially in treble is almost negligible.

 

Admittingly i dont have an amp, but due to its low impedance i thought that it wouldnt matter that much, especially seeing as though my research has told me that it only increases volume not quality.

 

WHAT AM I MISSING GUYS?!?! ok it sounds better, but not $270 better. Are my 555s good or are my 400s ****? Or do i need an amp?

 

Thankyou

 

 

1) Not $270 better - Expensive doesn't automatically make them better.  You probably don't like the sound signature so it is best to find out what you like and research like crazy before buying if you don't have a chance to audition.

 

2) Using mp3s as your source - The source is very important the more detailed your headphone is.  So with bad quality source a better headphone will present the bad source very precisely, thus sounding perfectly bad.  A bad earphone wont be able to present the bad source perfectly bad thus making it not as bad .... if that makes any sense.  Using lossless files could be the biggest upgrade for you.

 

 

3) Regarding E11 vs E17 - The E11 is a better amp, but the E17 is an AMP+DAC (the DAC being very good) and overall a great all in one device.  I think most ppl would be satisfied with the E17 and if the HE-400 don't sound good via the E17, you can still use it with your next headphone.

post #45 of 98
Quote:
Originally Posted by davidsh View Post

 

24 ohms, in this case, would typically mean you would get 'flabby and uncontrolled bass'. 

 

IF you use mp3's use at least 200+ kbit files, i only use 320 kbit and flac files.

 

The frequency response charts are representing the loudness of the different frequencies. Starting low with the bass, going up to vocals and guitars, and further to hi-hats and etc.

I'm wondering if that's just the recommended headphone impedence?

 

 

I think a lot of us have a ton of mp3's from that era... and they are cr*p!  All do respect, but I don't buy the 'you need more than 200k to really get a good comparison' argument.  You can ABX via foobar with all kinds of encoding and see what you think for yourself.  If the OP doesn't know, it's a tool that you can test between two tracks (in this case compressed with different encoders ie, mp3 vs aac or 128 vs 192k etc).  It was a revelation to me, and maybe YOU might need more than 200k/s files, but I'm nowhere near that good in the current era of encoders.  

 

Plus, I can now fit 35% more music on my device after re-converting to aac and that's music to MY ears. smily_headphones1.gif

 

But, he said the FLAC playback wasn't good, so I don't think it's a source problem (assuming a good rip).

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