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Resonessence Labs Concero discussion/review thead - Page 85

post #1261 of 2247
Quote:
Originally Posted by daerron View Post
 

Thanks! I am sure that I will enjoy the Concero, after the disappointment which was the Nuwave DAC.

 

I am well aware that the DAC is only a small part of the total equation. I guess its just with all these entry level DACs featuring ES9023 chipsets that makes one feels its an entry level DAC chip. I have studied the Concero design quite a bit, having done a bit of electronics design myself and it is a top notch from a design perspective. Looking forward to trying out the different filters too and love the little remote as well.

 

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr.Sneis View Post
 

The NWD was disappointing for me too, weird considering PS Audio's reputation.  No one talks about it, but the Parasound ZDac is a much better buy at half the price to my ears (sacrificing asynch usb) for that kind of product. 

 

The Concero I am lead to believe has a great implementation of the Sabre, it was my first experience with a Sabre based dac and I expected the worst but walked away impressed.

 

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by project86 View Post
 

 

Bingo! I too would choose Parasound Zdac or Concero over the more expensive PS Audio device. I've liked some of their stuff in the past, but not all of it, and this seems like a definite miss for them. 

 

The interesting thing I found regarding the Concero and Nuwave, having owned them side by side, is that separately I preferred the Concero, however when using the Concero as a USB converter to the Nuwave I greatly preferred that combo.  This leads me to believe the real strength of the Concero is in it's custom filters and USB stage.  I really wish they would release a slightly more affordable USB converter only, keeping the FPGA custom filters and maybe add a bnc and i2s output or something.  I would snatch one of those up in a heartbeat.  I think the Nuwave on paper and hardware should be an excellent DAC but it seems to be crippled possibly by poor digital filter design.

 

I think my dream digital setup right now would be something like a Concero converter feeding a standalone Burson DAC in the same line as the Soloist/Conductor.  Though I have also recently been looking into the Meier Daccord also.  That could also be interesting to pair with the Concero and would be very flexible with the filter options, and built in crossfeed settings of the the Meier DAC.  Gungnir/Bifrost Uber + Concero could also be an interesting combo.

post #1262 of 2247

Well, that is another one of the reasons I settled on the Concero. The ability to use it as a high quality USB-SPDIF converter means its never going to really lose its value proposition, though most higher end DACs today place a lot more emphasis on the getting the USB stage right, but the Concero still has the ability to bring the digital filters into effect which could be very nice. I am pretty much settled on using the Mini-X for as long as I have the HE-500. If the Concero beats the Nuwave in sound quality then I will be very happy with it for some time to come. I'd rather save up my money for a new headphone like the LCD-X than spending any more money on DACs.

 

I am not sure what was wrong with the Nuwave. Initially I really liked the detail on offer, especially when I compared it side to side with the PWD2. The black background and great dynamics though could never really make up for the slightly flatter and "brightish" sound. When I switched the solid state Emotiva Mini-X, this just became worse as my tube-hybrid headphone amplifier could smooth it out a bit. It took some Madrigal Gel-Z interconnects to get rid of the brightness, till mine got killed by a lightning strike. I wonder whether PS Audio was worried about it encroaching too much on the PWD2? Unfortunately the PWD2 is way too bulky for me to ever consider it for a headphone rig, though I like its organic sound quality. The Invicta seems like the ideal DAC to upgrade to eventually.


Edited by daerron - 10/31/13 at 12:38am
post #1263 of 2247
Believe it or not, my favorite feature of the Invicta, missing in nearly all other desktop DACs, is a $10 part - the card reader!

But I'll never pay that much for a DAC...

:-)
post #1264 of 2247
Quote:
But I'll never pay that much for a DAC...
yea its not worth 5 grand :/
Quote:
This leads me to believe the real strength of the Concero is in it's custom filters and USB stage.
100% agree, the concero USB implementation is flawless
post #1265 of 2247
Quote:
Originally Posted by zilch0md View Post

Believe it or not, my favorite feature of the Invicta, missing in nearly all other desktop DACs, is a $10 part - the c. d reader!

But I'll never pay that much for a DAC...

:-)

Hmm thats a good idea.  A Concero "trasport" with a card reader that could play files and be controlled by phone or tablet.  We should shoot this idea to Mark.  I know Project86 is a big fan of using his Auriliti.  A Concero format transport could be a nice proposition.  


Edited by JWahl - 10/31/13 at 9:14am
post #1266 of 2247
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by zilch0md View Post

Believe it or not, my favorite feature of the Invicta, missing in nearly all other desktop DACs, is a $10 part - the card reader!

But I'll never pay that much for a DAC...

:-)

 

I definitely believe it! The SD Card playback function is one of my favorite things about the Invicta. I use it all the time, with a few different 64GB cards loaded with reference tracks of all types. It even works via Toslink output, although that puts one in the odd position of finding a DAC superior to Invicta that you'd rather listen to (I have yet to find one). But it is helpful when doing reviews of other DACs - I know it's an ultra-clean source which can't be said of most other Toslink feeds.

 

The Resonessence team actually did significant work behind the scenes to make the reader perform so well. It seems like a simple thing at face value, but they actually completely designed the platform from the ground up with audio performance in mind. The analogy would be building an entire new OS for your computer rather than running Windows or even a modified Linux. 

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by JWahl View Post
 

Hmm thats a good idea.  A Concero "trasport" with a card reader that could play files and be controlled by phone or tablet.  We should shoot this idea to Mark.  I know Project86 is a big fan of using his Auriliti.  A Concero format transport could be a nice proposition.  

 

I've mentioned it to them before. When their engineer was explaining the work involved in building the subsystems from scratch, I immediately brought up my Auraliti and all the other streaming players. It's a growing market for sure, and I'd love to see them get in on the action. Since then, QLS came out with their QA660 which uses the same concept - playback from SD cards rather than hard drives or network streaming. Seems to be well received in their home market.

 

So yeah, I've brought it up with them already, but everyone should definitely let them know if that's a product they might be in the market for. The more demand they see, the more likely it is to become a real product.

post #1267 of 2247

Basically a Concero HP w/smart card reader? Would be way cool as an all-in-one solution.

post #1268 of 2247

Damn. Some really interesting ideas being laid out on this page.

 

Completely new to me is the idea of using SD cards for music files. Very interesting. How is the SQ for the SD cards in the Invicta? Sounds like they've put a lot of effort into it. Wonder what the advantages and disadvantages would be of SD over hard drives and network streaming.

 

 

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nick Dangerous View Post
 

Basically a Concero HP w/smart card reader? Would be way cool as an all-in-one solution.

 

Plus some sort of remote capability for dealing with the music library. Or does HP already have that?

post #1269 of 2247

Wow, I thought I was nearly alone in my interest for a DAC with a card reader (and some sort of UI to navigate the files with.)  

 

I'm waiting for this critter to come to market sometime in "early 2014" - as my all-in-one solution.  I could see using it as my source for both portable and desktop rigs:

 

Sony PCM-D100   ($999)

 

 

 

This thing is a Sony Pro division handheld field recorder, but it ships with a wireless remote and plays gap-less DSD, WAV, FLAC, MP3, WMA (Non DRM), and AAC-LC (Non-DRM) files...

 

... at sampling frequencies of DSD 2.8MHz / 1-bit  -and-  192kHz / 176.4kHz / 96kHz / 88.2kHz / 48kHz / 44.1kHz at 16-bit or 24-bit

 

Its card reader supports SD, SD-HC,SD-XC, Memory Stick Pro Duo and Memory Stick Pro-HG.

 

And it has both analog and optical line outs!

 

I wants it!

 

 

More specs here:  http://www.head-fi.org/t/679589/leak-sonys-new-portable-linear-pcm-recorder-pcm-d100-upgrade-of-the-famous-d50s/30#post_9932805

 

Mike

post #1270 of 2247

 

i would actually love to get a balanced version of the concero with seperate power supply. 

post #1271 of 2247
Quote:
Originally Posted by angelo898 View Post
 

 

i would actually love to get a balanced version of the concero with seperate power supply. 

 

Yes, absolutely agree! I am thinking about upgrading from my Concero to an Ayre QB-9DSD but would love to stick with Resonessence. Give me a Mirus without the preamp features and I would buy in a heart beat.

post #1272 of 2247
Quote:
Originally Posted by Axiom05 View Post
 

Yes, absolutely agree! I am thinking about upgrading from my Concero to an Ayre QB-9DSD but would love to stick with Resonessence. Give me a Mirus without the preamp features and I would buy in a heart beat.


I had an Ayre QB-9 and found it thoroughly un-impressive and not even close to worth the price they ask. I was actually shocked at how plain and just generally boring it sounded.

I can't compare the Concero to it because I did not have them anywhere near the same time....but I did have them both within the exact same setup and I was much happier with the Concero HD.

I am sure price was a factor though and price/performance factor for sure was.

 

I have no idea what the dsd upgrade entails though maybe it makes it much better. After reading more about Ayre and their implementations I didn't feel right supporting them. Resonessence on the other hand, best "audiophile" type company I have ever dealt with personally.

post #1273 of 2247
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nick Dangerous View Post
 

Basically a Concero HP w/smart card reader? Would be way cool as an all-in-one solution.

 

The idea I suggested was more like the Auraliti PK90 music server, or the QLS QA660 (google it if needed). But a Concero HP with a smart card reader would be a different animal. Seems like a good idea but it would require some kind of interface to select tracks or skip, etc. Not sure how that wold work with the compact and simplified design it has. 

post #1274 of 2247
Quote:
Originally Posted by kcee View Post
 


I had an Ayre QB-9 and found it thoroughly un-impressive and not even close to worth the price they ask. I was actually shocked at how plain and just generally boring it sounded.

I can't compare the Concero to it because I did not have them anywhere near the same time....but I did have them both within the exact same setup and I was much happier with the Concero HD.

I am sure price was a factor though and price/performance factor for sure was.

 

I have no idea what the dsd upgrade entails though maybe it makes it much better. After reading more about Ayre and their implementations I didn't feel right supporting them. Resonessence on the other hand, best "audiophile" type company I have ever dealt with personally.

Kcee, thanks for your comments, re. QB-9. I auditioned a QB-9 (non-DSD) in my system as well and was not that impressed. Basically it was indistinguishable from my current set up at that time. Unfortunately, my DAC developed a problem shortly after that and I ended up buying the Concero as a temp solution. Although the Concero has truly impressive performance, especially considering price, I still would like something with balance design and linear power supply (will it sound better?). The QB-9 DSD using the ES9016 DAC is supposed to be a significant improvement over the previous version but still seems overpriced for what it is. I am in no rush to replace the Concero since I am very happy with it, so I will continue to wait to see if Resonessence develops something new that fits my criteria.

post #1275 of 2247

Not intending to go too far off track.  A QB9 owner I know just got his dac back from the dsd upgrade.  He says everything has improved and he is stunned by the sound.  I have had his dac (pre-dsd) in my system and was not as impressed as I am with my Blue Circle and Audiophileo.  And I would put the original Concero close to the QB9 in terms of absolute musical enjoyment.  The QB9 still did a few things better than the Concero, for about 3 times the price.

 

But every system is different and things can sound great in one and not so great in another.  Needless to say both the QB9 and Concero are both very special products in the market.

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