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Battle Of The Flagships (57 Headphones Compared) UPDATE: Ultimate Ears UERM added (4/14/13) - Page 93

post #1381 of 3794
11/27/12 at 3:00pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by donunus View Post

About the dt990 by the way guys, mine was a 32 ohms version. Those are supposedly the most offensive dt990 version. I definitely liked the 250 ohm dt880 much more than the 32 ohm dt990. The dt880s had much better bass and more tolerable highs. The mids are still a little recessed to me on the 880s but the 990s were too much on the V-shaped side of things to me. At the end of the day, the 880s are listenable cans while the 990-32s gave me tinnitus within a few seconds of music listening. Talk about the sibilance region being exaggerated, those cans are the worst offenders in the history of headphones.

 

 rolleyes.gif Me thinks you haven't tried Grado PS1000 or Ultrasone PRO900.

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post #1382 of 3794
11/27/12 at 3:11pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by pp312 View Post

 

I've already posted twice about the need to factor different listening levels into the equation of why we have such differing opinions of the same phones, and no one has taken up the point. I referenced the old loudness controls and how they boosted highs and lows, and how useful the adjustable Yamaha one still is (or was until recently).  However, no one listens to me.

 

(mumble...mumble...)

 

 

biggrin.gif  

I've heard you:)  I even comment specifically when I think a headphone excels at lower volume levels (such as the Edition 10) or louder such as the HE-6.  My standard listening level is not all that loud. 

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post #1383 of 3794
11/27/12 at 3:46pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by oyster View Post

I bet HE400 wont be able to make it to top 25. Their mids really do not complement the other talents of this headphone. 

 

David, dont forget to use velours with your pair. Velour pads make them quite listenable.

 

 

You might be right on this.  These are not your so called "classical music" type of headphone.  It's more of a fun, bass loving type of thing.  After I heard it.  I was glad I had my other HiFimans.  I might look into the HE-4 instead.  


Edited by preproman - 11/27/12 at 5:00pm
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post #1384 of 3794
11/27/12 at 4:11pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by DavidMahler View Post

HA! The New Yorker in me loves Pizza.  I admit the obvious, that in their price class, Grado has the least impressive packaging that I've seen.  I still say that this is opinion because for a certain group of people, their lack of sophisticated package may leave some with the impression that the customer is paying less for the fancy exterior and more for the craftsmanship.  You can't please everyone:)

I do think it would benefit Grado to redesign their packaging with their next flagship.  A simple thing like packaging can leave an impression.  It's like a person who dresses well.  Often it doesn't mean anything, but the initial impression is that the person has their act together.

 

You probably remember that the former Grado flagship the, RS1s use to come in a very nice wooden box, and, unless i'm mistaking, we can still get similar boxes, but now we have to pay extra to get it.

 

That beeing said, even if if the GS/PS1000s still came in a wooden box, i wouldn't use it, call me lazy, but i find my homemade stand much more convenient to use, especially since i use my headphones on a daily basis, altough i can understand that for some peoples a ''permanent'' box might be usefull.

 

I have even read that some peoples keep their HP1000s in Ziplock bags, again, i keep mine on a stand i made myself, ready to use, the only headphones i didn't make a stand for are my PS1000s, because of their weight and flimsy plastic blocks that hold the earcups,  i prefer to lay them down flat.

 

Finnaly David, i own four pairs of headphones and i find i have a ''beautyfull'' problem when it comes time to choose one, now i can only begin to imagine what it must be like for you, i know i'd feel like a kid in a candy store.

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post #1385 of 3794
11/27/12 at 4:27pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by preproman View Post

 

 

You might be right on this.  These are not your so called "classical music" type of headphone.  It's more of a fun, bass loving type of thing.  After I heard it.  I was glad I had my HiFimans.  I might look into the HE-4 instead.  

 

I currently have the HE400 in my possession. It's a loaner but it's been sitting there for weeks. I just don't find it that interesting. The HE-4 I really liked. I wish I kept it actually even though I have no space for it with the HD800 and HE6 taking up my time. If you ever heard a DT880/600 the HE-4 is similar but better.

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post #1386 of 3794
11/27/12 at 5:01pm
Are there any measurements available for HE-400 Rev 2 or Rev 3?
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post #1387 of 3794
11/27/12 at 5:11pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pianist View Post

Are there any measurements available for HE-400 Rev 2 or Rev 3?

 

or Rev 4 or Rev 5biggrin.gif

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post #1388 of 3794
11/27/12 at 5:12pm

Purrin has FR and CSDs of them.  I'm not sure if the ones inner fidelity has are rev 1 or not.  

 

 

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post #1389 of 3794
11/27/12 at 6:56pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pianist View Post

 

 rolleyes.gif Me thinks you haven't tried Grado PS1000 or Ultrasone PRO900.

 

rolleyes.gif Me thinks you havent either!

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post #1390 of 3794
11/27/12 at 7:02pm
Thread Starter 

Originally Posted by Pianist View Post


You wrote that a headphone can sound colored, yet very natural. But natural means that you can hear what was naturally on the original recording. At least, that's how I understand natural in the context of sound reproduction. When the sound of the original recording becomes colorized by listening equipment, then I can't see how the recording can remain natural sounding, because well - people can have all kinds of weird tastes and surely we can't say that a coloration that suits their tastes makes the sound natural to them, can we? That would be a really strange, twisted meaning of natural. As I understand it natural = true to the recording, not something that suits one's tastes. Even if you say that it's just a bit of extra coloration, I don't think that it affects my argument because what's a bit? It's too subjective - a bit for one person may be seem a lot for another. And just the fact that it is an audible alteration of the original sound automatically makes it not perfectly natural. So, sure - technically nothing is perfectly natural, because there is always some coloration present in the reproduction system. However, I think that a frequency response that closely matches that of the average, healthy human ear may be a necessary prerequisite for allowing the reproduction system to reproduce as much of the original recording as possible for the largest number of people possible.

 

 

You and I often agree on things, but the way we express the same opinion seems to contradict one another.  At least thats what I think.

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post #1391 of 3794
11/27/12 at 7:05pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by stacker45 View Post

 

You probably remember that the former Grado flagship the, RS1s use to come in a very nice wooden box, and, unless i'm mistaking, we can still get similar boxes, but now we have to pay extra to get it.

 

That beeing said, even if if the GS/PS1000s still came in a wooden box, i wouldn't use it, call me lazy, but i find my homemade stand much more convenient to use, especially since i use my headphones on a daily basis, altough i can understand that for some peoples a ''permanent'' box might be usefull.

 

I have even read that some peoples keep their HP1000s in Ziplock bags, again, i keep mine on a stand i made myself, ready to use, the only headphones i didn't make a stand for are my PS1000s, because of their weight and flimsy plastic blocks that hold the earcups,  i prefer to lay them down flat.

 

Finnaly David, i own four pairs of headphones and i find i have a ''beautyfull'' problem when it comes time to choose one, now i can only begin to imagine what it must be like for you, i know i'd feel like a kid in a candy store.

I loved that wood box! It made a difference I think, although its superficial.  

It can be tough not only picking the headphone, but the music too.  I gave up long ago.  I go through headphone and album phases.  This week, my headphone seems to be the HE-6.  Why not?  It's one of the best.  It doesn't make sense to have as many headphones as I have right now.  Most of us really don't need more than 2 or 3 if we were to be honest with ourselves.  Then maybe, a good pair of portable oriented headphones/earphones.

The main reason I collected was for collection purposes, but then as it grew and grew, I felt compelled to write the review.  And I'm really glad I did.  Eventually, I will probably part with the majority of my collection.

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post #1392 of 3794
11/27/12 at 8:03pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by stacker45 View Post

 

rolleyes.gif Me thinks you havent either!

 

Well, I have. I never judge headphones I haven't heard. To be fair - I heard them for maybe 5 minutes max, but both PRO900 and PS1000 immediately struck me as very unpleasant to listen to with a very peaky frequency response and lots of harshness in the treble. PRO900 was also unbearable in the bass - it had way more than DT990 and it was very uncontrolled and with crazy impact that gave me a headache. The treble on the PRO900 was not terribly overemphasized - maybe as much as DT990 - but it was of a lower quality and actually sounded harsh and sibilant with an unpleasant metallic tone to it. I couldn't stand it. The PS1000s are higher quality headphones than PRO900 IMO - probably much higher, but look at their frequency response graph. I turned up the volume pretty loud with them and the treble was so emphasized that it was actually painful to listen to. At lower volumes, they are OK though and, like I already wrote before, were apparently designed specifically for low volume listening. I actually think they may be great headphones for that purpose. But I am sure donunus will have a big problem with them if he found DT990 unbearable because PS1000 is quite a bit brighter than DT990.

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post #1393 of 3794
11/27/12 at 8:15pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by TMRaven View Post

Purrin has FR and CSDs of them.  I'm not sure if the ones inner fidelity has are rev 1 or not.  

 

 

 

Is this the Rev 2? Certainly looks a bit unbalanced with dips and peaks in the treble, but knowing that it's an Ortho, it shouldn't be too much of a problem, as long as those Ortho mids are intact. biggrin.gif And the bass looks great.

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post #1394 of 3794
11/27/12 at 9:38pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pianist View Post

 

Is this the Rev 2? Certainly looks a bit unbalanced with dips and peaks in the treble, but knowing that it's an Ortho, it shouldn't be too much of a problem, as long as those Ortho mids are intact. biggrin.gif And the bass looks great.

 

The CSD purrin measured (velour) looks a bit nicer. And yeah I think that's a rev2 he owns.

 

 

Notice both sharp dips in the FR are just ridges in disguise; AFAIK neither the 2.3kHz nor the 5~6kHz ridge are that apparent in actuality.

 

But yeah it's pretty obvious that these have a fairly coloured presentation from 2kHz upwards, quite a bit of deviation from neutrality. It's not bad at all though, quite a charming voicing IMO, great for certain genres, a bit weak for others.


Edited by jerg - 11/27/12 at 9:41pm
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post #1395 of 3794
11/27/12 at 10:01pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pianist View Post

 

Well, I have. I never judge headphones I haven't heard. To be fair - I heard them for maybe 5 minutes max, but both PRO900 and PS1000 immediately struck me as very unpleasant to listen to with a very peaky frequency response and lots of harshness in the treble. PRO900 was also unbearable in the bass - it had way more than DT990 and it was very uncontrolled and with crazy impact that gave me a headache. The treble on the PRO900 was not terribly overemphasized - maybe as much as DT990 - but it was of a lower quality and actually sounded harsh and sibilant with an unpleasant metallic tone to it. I couldn't stand it. The PS1000s are higher quality headphones than PRO900 IMO - probably much higher, but look at their frequency response graph. I turned up the volume pretty loud with them and the treble was so emphasized that it was actually painful to listen to. At lower volumes, they are OK though and, like I already wrote before, were apparently designed specifically for low volume listening. I actually think they may be great headphones for that purpose. But I am sure donunus will have a big problem with them if he found DT990 unbearable because PS1000 is quite a bit brighter than DT990.

 

I take no offence to the fact that you don't like the PS1000, to each they're own as we say, the important thing is that you find headphones that you are happy with.Like i've said before, they're are many variable at play, the fact we all hear differently, and have different sound systems, just to name those two, and to be honest, i prefer to listen to my PS1000s through my Musical Fidelity X-CAN V2  tube amp, wich i believe tames them a little, than straight from the headphone output of my vintage Yamaha CA-610II.Altough i have never found my PS1000s harsh, they're have been a few times when my GS1000s got a little peaky in the high frequencys, and even tough i don't use my GS1000s much anymore, i can't bring myself to sell them, i guess i like having the whole 1000 Grado family.

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