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The T50RP Paradox | reviews, discussion, & mini-tour impressions (index in second post) - Page 12

post #166 of 732
Quote:
Originally Posted by shotgunshane View Post

Flysweep’s Paradox arrived last week and I’ve spent several days with them to form some (noob to full-size) impressions. Gear used was an iPhone 5, Macbook Pro, Leckerton UHA-6s mk2 and the VentureCraft Go-Dap X.

 

Some additional things to be aware before said impressions:

I have zero experience with full size headphones.  I’m strictly a portable enthusiast who has stayed exclusively with IEMs, both universal and custom, and perhaps due to my lack of full size experience, I just don’t think I’m getting the isolation or fit I should be getting and feel like it is slightly affecting what I'm hearing- as I'll describe later.  None-the-less, the following are my abbreviated impressions.

 

Neutral. There are no other words, flowery or elaborate, to use on the Paradox, save this one.  The one IEM I’ve heard that is comparable is the Etymotic ER-6 (not 6i), of which I no longer own but share many characteristics from memory.  (For those that are not familiar with the ER-6, it is basically their Chinese outsourced version of the ER-4S - made for the sold purposes of being cheaper.  The parts were cheaper, yet it was designed to sound the same, without need of added impedance or an amp.  The result was an amazingly neutral IEM that practically gets swallowed in your ear, as its body is short and squat and completely opposite of the barrel shaped ER-4S.)

 

Basically the Paradox reminds me of the ER-6, especially from the mids through the treble - treble that is extended but never piercing or painful.  While not exactly airy, it’s effortless in its extension and never gets lost in the presentation.  Probably the one difference I could point to is the relative dryness I hear on the Paradox compared to my memory of the Ety; perhaps this the nature and tonality of orthos or maybe just the Fostex?  In any case, the Paradox does come across to me as ever so slightly dry and mid-centric.

 

I do perceive a slight roll off of deeper bass and here is where I think my inexperience with full size is coming into play.  I just can't seem to get the right fit to benefit deeper bass response.  This was confirmed using test tones via an iOS app and this site: http://www.phys.unsw.edu.au/jw/hearing.html.  In contrast, from memory, the ER-6 stayed more evenly balanced through deeper bass.  If I clamp the cups with my hands closer to my ears, it definitely improves both isolation and deep bass, bringing better neutral balance down through the deeper bass (<60hz).  

 

Most surprising, for me, was the soundstage.  I guess I had an expectation bias of a larger or grander soundstage due to being full sized cans.  Instead what I found was an average sized soundstage that felt neither closed in or expansive with excellent imaging and transparency.

 

Other than the issue I have with fit/clamping strength, I found the Paradox quite pleasing and easy to listen to.  I think I've also quenched any thirst I had to get into full-size; between the added bulk and sweaty ears, I'm pretty content to stay with IEMs.  LFF's review of the Frogbeats C4 sounds interesting… so many toys, so little time. Thanks for the audition time Flysweep!

 

The thing with the highs is NOT an ortho thing. LFF does something tricky to get the highs to sound that way. Out of the box, the highs are quite lively, definitely not dry.They are kinda bright and slightly intrusive. Kind of like a grado, actually.

 

I'm working hard to figure a good way to settle them down. If I could get somewhere in between the paradox and stock t50rp highs.. I'd be very happy :) He also works some other black magic by getting the paradox to sound so great closed.. when I close mine off, things get pretty wonky and the highs get even more prominent!


Edited by chrislangley4253 - 11/23/12 at 3:17pm
post #167 of 732

Hi everyone, I am fortunate enough to acquire a used Paradox (it's coming!). The previous user has it terminated in 4-pin XLR and it seems to be for balanced audio if my research serves me right. Coming from dynamic headphone, I don't have much experience with orthos and DIY orthos at that. Can anyone point me to an amp for this paradox, both budget and "dream" version? Or just amp for Paradox in general? Much thanks.

I'm currently using ODAC + Total Airhead.
 


Edited by nonamodnar - 12/2/12 at 8:02am
post #168 of 732
Quote:
Originally Posted by nonamodnar View Post

Hi everyone, I am fortunate enough to acquire a used Paradox (it's coming!). The previous user has it terminated in 4-pin XLR and it seems to be for balanced audio if my research serves me right. Coming from dynamic headphone, I don't have much experience with orthos and DIY orthos at that. Can anyone point me to an amp for this paradox, both budget and "dream" version? Or just amp for Paradox in general? Much thanks.

I'm currently using ODAC + Total Airhead.
 

Well, I don't know about the balanced connection, but I'm very, very happy with my O2 in a 1x/2.5x gain configuration with the ODAC. LFF uses the O2 or the Cavalli CTH.

post #169 of 732
Quote:
Originally Posted by nonamodnar View Post

Hi everyone, I am fortunate enough to acquire a used Paradox (it's coming!). The previous user has it terminated in 4-pin XLR and it seems to be for balanced audio if my research serves me right. Coming from dynamic headphone, I don't have much experience with orthos and DIY orthos at that. Can anyone point me to an amp for this paradox, both budget and "dream" version? Or just amp for Paradox in general? Much thanks.

I'm currently using ODAC + Total Airhead.
 

That's odd, I always thought that balanced didn't do anything for orthodynamics.

post #170 of 732
Quote:
Originally Posted by linuxid10t View Post

That's odd, I always thought that balanced didn't do anything for orthodynamics.

Balanced doesn't do anything for any application unless you are running long lengths and are having interference problems.. But, you know this :P

LFF builds the damn things folks.. If he thinks the thin flimsy v-moda cable is fine...

Not that you shouldn't go balanced if you have balanced gear, or if you just want to try it.. I don't care, go for it!

*edit*

 

What I meant to say was, "In my opinion running headphones balanced doesn't do much regardless of the type of headphone. In my opinion the use of balanced gear is only worthwhile in a studio setting. Specifically, I believe there is no difference between a headphone that has been wired balanced vs. single ended when using single ended gear."


Edited by chrislangley4253 - 12/2/12 at 3:15pm
post #171 of 732
Quote:
Originally Posted by chrislangley4253 View Post

Well, I don't know about the balanced connection, but I'm very, very happy with my O2 in a 1x/2.5x gain configuration with the ODAC. LFF uses the O2 or the Cavalli CTH.

Thanks Chris. I've heard about the combo ODAC + O2 + Paradox "disappearing" from the chain of audio. I'm gonna see how the TAH handles the paradox and move from there, probably to an O2 or maybe an ODA when it's released.

Quote:
Originally Posted by linuxid10t View Post

That's odd, I always thought that balanced didn't do anything for orthodynamics.

Well, me too. Not that I made that decision though. The paradox was at a good price and he threw in an adapter to mini. Only after 5 weeks into head-fi and I've already spent more than I could ever imagine. The whole venture nearly broke my bank so I'm not sure I'm ready for the next big purchase.confused_face.gif

post #172 of 732
Quote:
Originally Posted by chrislangley4253 View Post

Balanced doesn't do anything for any application unless you are running long lengths and are having interference problems.. But, you know this :P

LFF builds the damn things folks.. If he thinks the thin flimsy v-moda cable is fine...

Not that you shouldn't go balanced if you have balanced gear, or if you just want to try it.. I don't care, go for it!

The reason (and effect of) balanced output into your drivers is unrelated to the balanced conecting of source and amp, your  statement is therefore irrelevant and rather ignorant. Please do your homework before you make a fool of yourself and steer other people in the wrong direction.

Balanced signal from your amp into your driver provides double voltage swing and much better precision in the the translation of the electrical signal into physical movement of the driver. Especially hard to drive drivers (often high ohm, low dB) benefit from this.

post #173 of 732
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kees View Post

The reason (and effect of) balanced output into your drivers is unrelated to the balanced conecting of source and amp, your  statement is therefore irrelevant and rather ignorant. Please do your homework before you make a fool of yourself and steer other people in the wrong direction.

 

Take a chill pill, brah. Chris is correct for the most part. No need to be rude to such a nice guy.

 

For the record, I compared my HE-500's run balanced and single ended from the same HM-801 and it sounded identical either way. Yes, they sell that balanced amp for $250. All that money for no difference in sound quality. In case you doubt my opinion, my sound engineer friend scrutinized the sound and he couldn't tell a single difference either. That's my experience with balanced audio.

 

Apologies for the off topic. Looking forward to further impressions of the Paradox. Would like to buy one soon, maybe after christmas spending is over.

post #174 of 732
Quote:
Originally Posted by temporaryname View Post

 

Take a chill pill, brah. Chris is correct for the most part. No need to be rude to such a nice guy.

 

For the record, I compared my HE-500's run balanced and single ended from the same HM-801 and it sounded identical either way. Yes, they sell that balanced amp for $250. All that money for no difference in sound quality. In case you doubt my opinion, my sound engineer friend scrutinized the sound and he couldn't tell a single difference either. That's my experience with balanced audio.

 

Apologies for the off topic. Looking forward to further impressions of the Paradox. Would like to buy one soon, maybe after christmas spending is over.

He's wrong for the relevant part. HE500 were specifically designed to be EASY to drive, so no big surprise that balancing them didn't make a lot of difference....

But if you prefer to accept the misdirecting blanket statement of the nice guy who acts like he thinks he knows it all as truth, please be my guest.

post #175 of 732

Easy to drive in relation to what.  The earlier hifiman cans?  If so, a lot of things are easier to drive compared to them.  

post #176 of 732
Quote:
Originally Posted by nonamodnar View Post

Thanks Chris. I've heard about the combo ODAC + O2 + Paradox "disappearing" from the chain of audio. I'm gonna see how the TAH handles the paradox and move from there, probably to an O2 or maybe an ODA when it's released.

Well, me too. Not that I made that decision though. The paradox was at a good price and he threw in an adapter to mini. Only after 5 weeks into head-fi and I've already spent more than I could ever imagine. The whole venture nearly broke my bank so I'm not sure I'm ready for the next big purchase.confused_face.gif

Well, the paradox was one hell of a first choice. It'll sound good off the TAH, assuming the TAH isn't godawful (I only listened to one once... and the guy was listening to Lil Wayne on Youtube). The Paradox sound pretty proper off a sansa clip, I think you'll be happy with em if you like a neutral sound :)
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kees View Post

The reason (and effect of) balanced output into your drivers is unrelated to the balanced conecting of source and amp, your  statement is therefore irrelevant and rather ignorant. Please do your homework before you make a fool of yourself and steer other people in the wrong direction.

Balanced signal from your amp into your driver provides double voltage swing and much better precision in the the translation of the electrical signal into physical movement of the driver. Especially hard to drive drivers (often high ohm, low dB) benefit from this.

 

Warning: Off Topic! (Click to show)

LOL what?

Making a headphone balanced does nothing but remove the common ground. How does that allow double voltage swing? Excuse my "ignorance", I have actually read quite a bit about balanced audio.. But, never anything suggesting what you say. I think you might be confusing the difference between a balanced and singled ended amp with the difference between a balanced and single ended headphone.

Regardless, in my opinion balanced audio is a gimmick, a hard to implement and expensive gimmick at that (when it comes to headphones). It has its place in studio settings for rejecting interference with long cable runs. Some "balanced" headphone amps aren't even actually balanced, that is the icing on the cake for me. rolleyes.gif

Sorry for all the edits in quick succession guys. I kept finding grammatical errors :/


Edited by chrislangley4253 - 12/2/12 at 3:19pm
post #177 of 732
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kees View Post

He's wrong for the relevant part. HE500 were specifically designed to be EASY to drive, so no big surprise that balancing them didn't make a lot of difference....

Easy to drive when compared to the HE-6's. They're not what I would call 'easy to drive'. They're orthos with an impedance of 38z and a sensitivity of 89dB.

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kees View Post

But if you prefer to accept the misdirecting blanket statement of the nice guy who acts like he thinks he knows it all as truth, please be my guest.

I don't mind people correcting others. If someone is wrong or has some facts or details mixed up, I welcome corrections. It is your tone and attitude that is the problem here. You also make a lot of assumptions which, for someone who's correcting others, is very hypocritical behaviour. I'd appreciate it if you ceased making such baseless comments like the one bolded above. It damages your credibility.

post #178 of 732
Quote:
Originally Posted by chrislangley4253 View Post

Well, the paradox was one hell of a first choice. It'll sound good off the TAH, assuming the TAH isn't godawful. The Paradox sound pretty proper off a sansa clip :)
 

LOL what?

Making a headphone balanced does nothing but remove the common ground. How does that allow double voltage swing? Excuse my "ignorance", I have actually read quite a bit about balanced audio.. But, never anything suggesting what you say. I think you might be confusing the difference between a balanced and singled ended amp with the difference between a balanced and single ended headphone.

Regardless, balanced audio is a gimmick, a hard to implement and godawful expensive gimmick at that (when it comes to headphones). It has its place in studio settings for rejecting interference with long cable runs. Most "balanced" headphone amps aren't even actually balanced. That's the icing on the cake for me. rolleyes.gif

Balancing headphones does not  "just remove the common ground" . It feeds the ground wire for each channel (separately of course) with an inverse signal. So the driver gets instead of signal/ground signal/inverse signal. To make that more easy to visualise you could picture it like: the signal voltage pushes the driver, while simultaneously the inverse signal pulls the driver with the same, but inversely directed force.

post #179 of 732
Quote:
Originally Posted by temporaryname View Post

Easy to drive when compared to the HE-6's. They're not what I would call 'easy to drive'. They're orthos with an impedance of 38z and a sensitivity of 89dB.

 

I don't mind people correcting others. If someone is wrong or has some facts or details mixed up, I welcome corrections. It is your tone and attitude that is the problem here. You also make a lot of assumptions which, for someone who's correcting others, is very hypocritical behaviour. I'd appreciate it if you ceased making such baseless comments like the one bolded above. It damages your credibility.

It is Chris' tone and attitude that is the problem here, and I don't see where I made an assumption???? He made an "I'll tell you how it is" -statement that was beside the point, wrong and misdirecting.

Nothing baseless about stating that.

 

I couldn't care less about my credibility in these forums any more lately.

post #180 of 732
Quote:
Originally Posted by chrislangley4253 View Post

Balanced doesn't do anything for any application unless you are running long lengths and are having interference problems.. But, you know this :P

LFF builds the damn things folks.. If he thinks the thin flimsy v-moda cable is fine...

Not that you shouldn't go balanced if you have balanced gear, or if you just want to try it.. I don't care, go for it!

 

Chris' post below doesn't sound like he's attacking anyone. It's friendly, factually correct and maintains the attitude that whatever he says is his opinion (refer to the last sentence).

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kees View Post

He's wrong for the relevant part. HE500 were specifically designed to be EASY to drive, so no big surprise that balancing them didn't make a lot of difference....

But if you prefer to accept the misdirecting blanket statement of the nice guy who acts like he thinks he knows it all as truth, please be my guest.

 

Now your post is different. You mislead by claiming the HE-500 is easy to drive (which, in comparison to your average headphone, is false), you make the assumption that Chris believes he is intellectually infallible (I've only observed for the opposite to be true) and you suggest that I would prefer to accept false information from a nice guy than the truth from you (which is incorrect, immature and offensive).

 

I don't care if you're cynical or if you're having a bad day. When you decide to post something, please make it something worthwhile. Otherwise it's just irrelevant crap polluting potentially interesting threads. I'm all for interesting discussions but only if they're being debated in an intelligent, mature and respectful way.

 

As this is all off topic to this thread, this will be my final post on the matter. Looking forward to more Paradox impressions.

 

fin.


Edited by temporaryname - 12/2/12 at 2:45pm
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