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[REVIEW] Sony MW1 - Smart Wireless Headset pro - Page 6

post #76 of 175
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by NewForce View Post

ClieOS,

 

Thanks for the preview. 

Did you happen to try HS3000 with Samsung very own Galaxy S3 and Note2 cellphone?

 

Below some of my own conclusion for Samsung HS3000.

 

Coupled HS3000 with Samsung Galaxy S3/Note2, the default Music Player provide are much better sounding than any 3rd party software under default Nomral EQ setting both on the cellphone and the bluetooth unit. With S3/Note2 and HS3000 combined, it's by far the most cleanness, livelier and better sounds separation MP3 playback I've heard so far, when side-by-side comparing to Motorola S705, Sony MW600 with the my TDK-200. I've remembered my old and gone i.Tech MC803 did not sound that good too. The much better sounding I've think most probably was because the S3/Note2 default Music Player was streaming the audio with aptX codec. Switching to any other 3rd party music players, they did not sounded as clean and livelier.


No, I am moving away from Samsang and I am a Xperia user now (mainly due to Samsung 's really slow update over firmware). However, it shouldn't really matter what smartphone model it is since decoding is done on the BT unit itself and not on the smartphone, so whatever model has no real impact on the SQ. The only main difference will be apt-X support. As far as I know, most of the higher end Sumsang smartphone / tablet after Galaxy Tab 7+ (which is the first Samsung to support apt-X) already supports apt-X by default. Of course that includes S3 and Note2. The impression is done with my GT7+ with full apt-X support - and HS3000 still sounds no better than MW1.

 

I think there is an underlying assumption by many that apt-X support is a must for good SQ, which is not true. apt-X is indeed better than SBC in most way, but that's because most company implement really bad variation of SBC. Though Sony still hasn't fully implement apt-X (they already have the license), at least they are implementing a really goods version of SBC (which as demonstrated by MW1, can be exceptionally good). There are also assumption that apt-X is lossless, which is also not true. The lossless version of apt-X is not being used on Bluetooth device. It is still a lossy codec, but better than most generic lossy implementation out there. Another part of the equally important thing to look at is the hardware - in this section alone, MW1 is crushing HS3000. While HS3000 might edge out better on transmission compression, it doesn't have good enough DAC and amp to drive the earphone. Of course, HS3000 also comes with the worst stock IEM ever. Samsung should have packed a better sounding IEM.


Edited by ClieOS - 3/28/13 at 9:02pm
post #77 of 175
Quote:
Originally Posted by ClieOS View Post

Another part of the equally important thing to look at is the hardware - in this section alone, MW1 is crushing HS3000.

 

No offense, but that doesn't strike me as an overly balanced judgment. Rin (udauda) measured my HS3000 and told me all he'd wish for was more bandwidth in the low end. So, in my understanding, its DAC is fine and its amp has bass roll-off. That's it.

 

I actually bought the MW1 as a potential upgrade some time ago and listened to both side by side, but in the end returned the MW1. Both were close in sound quality, but the HS3000's better usability and aptX support made me stay with it.

 

You know what, the rolled-off HS3000 may in fact even be the better pairing for the MW1's bass-heavy earpiece, because the MW1 is about 12db up @50Hz and the HS3000 is about 5db down. wink.gif

 

post #78 of 175
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by james444 View Post

 

No offense, but that doesn't strike me as an overly balanced judgment. Rin (udauda) measured my HS3000 and told me all he'd wish for was more bandwidth in the low end. So, in my understanding, its DAC is fine and its amp has bass roll-off. That's it.

......

 

 

I have measured both as well, and MW1 has no roll off at all (flat from end to end), and offer higher current output on around same voltage. I am not talking about synergy here, but from the hardware performance. It simply drives headphone with more authority. Even if we were to involve synergy, a flat FR with better current output is still going to pair better with more headphone than a bass roll-off device with lower current output. After all, not all headphone are bassy or everyone want compensating. apt-X is great in theory but I didn't notice any significant SQ difference in listening. Functionality wise, MW1 offers more (including a stand alone mp3 player) - except perhaps for EQ. But we both know that the EQ on HS3000 isn't exactly great. Last but not least, as I have mentioned before, the stock IEM on HS3000 really sucks. Thus come my conclusion that 'MW1 is crushing HS3000' hardware wise. I can rephrase 'crushing' with something softer in tone - but MW1 is still the better of the two IMO.

 

I do however want to point out that I never think of HS3000 as a bad BT headset. The BT unit itself is still some of the best I have ever heard. It is just not the best.

post #79 of 175

Can you get these earphones without the bluetooth unit. Are they similar to the MH1c without the control buttons?

post #80 of 175

Each to their own, but "MW1 crushing the HS3000" and "HS3000 not having a good enough DAC" just sounds biased to me, as it completely skews the picture for prospective buyers. I won't dispute that the Sony's stock earpieces are superior (even said so in my own listening impressions), but considering the fact that the MW1 costs two times the price of the HS3000 where I live, that's not surprising in my book.

 

Few Head-Fiers will probably be content with the stock earphones anyway, and thus it's not irrelevant how both units fare with higher quality IEMs, where aptX has a small, but noticeable advantage in sound quality to my ears. Don't you wonder why Sony has licensed aptX and is about to implement it (your own words) when is offers no significant advantage? Sorry, I don't wanna give you a hard time and actually have no skin in this game, but "if you want The Best, then buy the MW1" sounds simply not right to me. jm2c.

 

Btw, there's another contender, the HTC BH S600, which I'll be gettin soon. If it's ok with you, I'm going to post my impressions vs. the HS3000 here. Sadly, I don't have the MW1 any longer.

post #81 of 175
Quote:
Originally Posted by ClieOS View Post


No, I am moving away from Samsang and I am a Xperia user now (mainly due to Samsung 's really slow update over firmware). However, it shouldn't really matter what smartphone model it is since decoding is done on the BT unit itself and not on the smartphone, so whatever model has no real impact on the SQ. The only main difference will be apt-X support. As far as I know, most of the higher end Sumsang smartphone / tablet after Galaxy Tab 7+ (which is the first Samsung to support apt-X) already supports apt-X by default. Of course that includes S3 and Note2. The impression is done with my GT7+ with full apt-X support - and HS3000 still sounds no better than MW1.

 

I think there is an underlying assumption by many that apt-X support is a must for good SQ, which is not true. apt-X is indeed better than SBC in most way, but that's because most company implement really bad variation of SBC. Though Sony still hasn't fully implement apt-X (they already have the license), at least they are implementing a really goods version of SBC (which as demonstrated by MW1, can be exceptionally good). There are also assumption that apt-X is lossless, which is also not true. The lossless version of apt-X is not being used on Bluetooth device. It is still a lossy codec, but better than most generic lossy implementation out there. Another part of the equally important thing to look at is the hardware - in this section alone, MW1 is crushing HS3000. While HS3000 might edge out better on transmission compression, it doesn't have good enough DAC and amp to drive the earphone. Of course, HS3000 also comes with the worst stock IEM ever. Samsung should have packed a better sounding IEM.

 

Oh my.. you moving away from Smasung just because slow update over firmware? I've thought the story was the other way round. Even Galaxy Note 1 are getting Jelly Bean 4.1.2 this month and same 2011 year Sony model wasn't. Well that doesn't matter ywe are not talking OS here.

 

Btw, ClieOS when you said your impression on GT7+ and HS3000, which IEM did your use to audit them? Also, which IEM did you audit GT7+ with MW1? I hope it was orange to orange comparison, otherwise they might cause difference sound impression.

 

To me, aptX are the key and the main source to guarantee better sounding, to no matter what SBC version used. Now the different that affecting the final sound are the amp and DAC. With your good MW1 impression, I do believed it does have a good amp and DAC in it. I'm sure if it was equipped with aptX it will be even better. Too bad it doens't come with one.

 

As my impression of Sony stereo BT unit, as with my older Sony MW600, it just sounded so rough when side-by-side comparison to Samsung HS3000. Even i.Tech MC803 and Motorola S705 sounded cleaner than MW600. Maybe I put it this way, my impression about Sony BT was they always sounded too Hi-Fi to me as I've always prefer better musical sounding device.

 

Btw, to me HS3000 output was loud enough most of the with time, even with low volume CD directly rip to MP3 or FLAC without boosting volume by 150%. So I've think ClieOS you must be liking to play your music at much louder levelthan I am.

 

Your mentioning of Sony MW1 FR was flat (well james444 objected..), so pairing it with stock bass heavy IEM you think they offered better sounding. No offence, that lead me to think you are a bass heavy fan. Maybe if you pairing MW1 stock IEM to HS3000 you will a more neutral, cleaner and balanced sound. Just my guess.

 

Last but not least, Sony MW1 cost around $110 vs. Samsung HS3000 around $70 that was just about $40 different. If we ripped away the better IEM by $10, FM receiver $5, SD reader $5, better amp + DAC$10, OLED display circuitry $10, basically both stereo BT unit now are off the same cost. So I don't think Sony MW1 sound quality components have much advantage over Samsung HS3000.

 

Most of us who that buying this type of Stereo BT unit with a 3.5mm jack was to enable us to use it with a better sounding IEM. Normally we will stored away the stock IEM for good and for long long time.So the advantage of MW1 having better sounding stock IEM was irrelevant, to most of us.

post #82 of 175
Quote:
Originally Posted by NewForce View Post

Your mentioning of Sony MW1 FR was flat (well james444 objected..)

 

Just to clarify, I didn't object the MW1 receiver's flat response, that bass-heavy graph is the earpiece's response. Sorry for the confusion.

post #83 of 175
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by james444 View Post

Each to their own, but "MW1 crushing the HS3000" and "HS3000 not having a good enough DAC" just sounds biased to me, as it completely skews the picture for prospective buyers. I won't dispute that the Sony's stock earpieces are superior (even said so in my own listening impressions), but considering the fact that the MW1 costs two times the price of the HS3000 where I live, that's not surprising in my book.

 

Few Head-Fiers will probably be content with the stock earphones anyway, and thus it's not irrelevant how both units fare with higher quality IEMs, where aptX has a small, but noticeable advantage in sound quality to my ears. Don't you wonder why Sony has licensed aptX and is about to implement it (your own words) when is offers no significant advantage? Sorry, I don't wanna give you a hard time and actually have no skin in this game, but "if you want The Best, then buy the MW1" sounds simply not right to me. jm2c.

 

Btw, there's another contender, the HTC BH S600, which I'll be gettin soon. If it's ok with you, I'm going to post my impressions vs. the HS3000 here. Sadly, I don't have the MW1 any longer.

 

It is a comparative statement. If I were to compare HS300 to the older Sony DRC-BT15 or Nokia BH111 that I have, I would have made the same conclusion and I would think you won't have any problem with that. Also, I didn't just saying the DAC on HS3000 - I said 'DAC and amp', as referring to the whole hardware package.

 

As for apt-X, I never dispute the fact the it is a superior compression codec - but having a better tool doesn't make for a better craftsman, It is how the tool is used and the end result that counts. Adding racing fuel to a family sedan certainly doesn't equal to a F1 sport car. In this case, as I have said it several times, I heard no distinct advantage from HS3000. If there is any, it is overshadowed by its 'DAC and amp' / hardware section in comparison to MW1.

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by NewForce View Post

 

Oh my.. you moving away from Smasung just because slow update over firmware? I've thought the story was the other way round. Even Galaxy Note 1 are getting Jelly Bean 4.1.2 this month and same 2011 year Sony model wasn't. Well that doesn't matter ywe are not talking OS here.

 

Btw, ClieOS when you said your impression on GT7+ and HS3000, which IEM did your use to audit them? Also, which IEM did you audit GT7+ with MW1? I hope it was orange to orange comparison, otherwise they might cause difference sound impression.

 

To me, aptX are the key and the main source to guarantee better sounding, to no matter what SBC version used. Now the different that affecting the final sound are the amp and DAC. With your good MW1 impression, I do believed it does have a good amp and DAC in it. I'm sure if it was equipped with aptX it will be even better. Too bad it doens't come with one.

 

As my impression of Sony stereo BT unit, as with my older Sony MW600, it just sounded so rough when side-by-side comparison to Samsung HS3000. Even i.Tech MC803 and Motorola S705 sounded cleaner than MW600. Maybe I put it this way, my impression about Sony BT was they always sounded too Hi-Fi to me as I've always prefer better musical sounding device.

 

Btw, to me HS3000 output was loud enough most of the with time, even with low volume CD directly rip to MP3 or FLAC without boosting volume by 150%. So I've think ClieOS you must be liking to play your music at much louder levelthan I am.

 

Your mentioning of Sony MW1 FR was flat (well james444 objected..), so pairing it with stock bass heavy IEM you think they offered better sounding. No offence, that lead me to think you are a bass heavy fan. Maybe if you pairing MW1 stock IEM to HS3000 you will a more neutral, cleaner and balanced sound. Just my guess.

 

Last but not least, Sony MW1 cost around $110 vs. Samsung HS3000 around $70 that was just about $40 different. If we ripped away the better IEM by $10, FM receiver $5, SD reader $5, better amp + DAC$10, OLED display circuitry $10, basically both stereo BT unit now are off the same cost. So I don't think Sony MW1 sound quality components have much advantage over Samsung HS3000.

 

Most of us who that buying this type of Stereo BT unit with a 3.5mm jack was to enable us to use it with a better sounding IEM. Normally we will stored away the stock IEM for good and for long long time.So the advantage of MW1 having better sounding stock IEM was irrelevant, to most of us.

 

It took a year (well, over a year) for Samsung to go from Honeycomb to ICS on GT7+. They also promised Jellybeam (4.1.1, not 4.1.2) about 6 months ago with no fixed day of release. I am just not going to wait for another 6 months like last time I did to find out that all I get is something outdated. The thing about Samsung is that they care only about their flagship and current models, and everything else get push back on the waiting list. Even the current GT7 2, which has inferior hardware compared to GT7+, already has its Jellybeam update a few months ago. In comparison, I just updated my Xperia TX from ICS to Jellybeam 4.1.2 two days ago and it was only on my local market for less than 3 months (less than 6 months internationally). Sony actually keep their promise of Q1 2013 update as they announced early this year. As you can see, it is an easy comparison to make.

 

HS3000 impression is done with stock IEM, as well as RE0 (my usual audition IEM). Same goes for MW1. I also listen to HS3000 with MH1 (the MW1 IEM) as well, but not the HS3000 IEM on MW1 since HS3000 stock IEM is really low quality and not worth paying attention to.

 

Yes, I agree apt-X will become more and more important as a factor to develop real, audiopile level BT headset. However, it will take other factors to come together as well. For once, HS3000 would have been a much better package with Samsung doesn't cheap out on the stock IEM. Bass roll-off, which I believe is an side effect of using coupling caps, can be easily fixed by having a larger caps. These are all the little things that add up to affect the end result of the device.

 

Current has nothing to do with loadness, but voltage does. As I have said, for around the same voltage (meaning around the same volume), MW1 has higher current output. Having higher output current mean higher total power output on the same volume, and it gives the source more control over the headphone. It is the same idea of using a 1W headphone amp to drive a 100mW max headphone - you can't actually put the whole 1W to the headphone (unless you want to burn it), but it gives more room for the amp to control over the headphone driver. You can still drive the same 100mW max headphone with a 200mW amp, but it will offer less control and often higher distortion. That's why higher current is better, and it doesn't meant it will be very loud.

 

The idea of storing away the stock IEM is common for HF'er. But there are more people who stick to stock headset than you think. Just think of how many iPhone user still stick to iBud, and they could have easily replaced it with better stuff without costing too much. I believe Steve Jobs once commented that, the fastest way to improve SQ is to replace the stock earphone. Plus, stock IEM actually ain't all bad. If Samsung had have chosen to include the EHS64 instead of EHS44, I would have said they did quite a good job.


Edited by ClieOS - 3/29/13 at 8:13pm
post #84 of 175
Quote:
Originally Posted by james444 View Post

 

Just to clarify, I didn't object the MW1 receiver's flat response, that bass-heavy graph is the earpiece's response. Sorry for the confusion.

 

james444, thanks and I appreciate your additional clarification.

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by ClieOS View Post

It took a year (well, over a year) for Samsung to go from Honeycomb to ICS on GT7+. They also promised Jellybeam (4.1.1, not 4.1.2) about 6 months ago with no fixed day of release. I am just not going to wait for another 6 months like last time I did to find out that all I get is something outdated. The thing about Samsung is that they care only about their flagship and current models, and everything else get push back on the waiting list. Even the current GT7 2, which has inferior hardware compared to GT7+, already has its Jellybeam update a few months ago. In comparison, I just updated my Xperia TX from ICS to Jellybeam 4.1.2 two days ago and it was only on my local market for less than 3 months (less than 6 months internationally). Sony actually keep their promise of Q1 2013 update as they announced early this year. As you can see, it is an easy comparison to make.

 

HS3000 impression is done with stock IEM, as well as RE0 (my usual audition IEM). Same goes for MW1. I also listen to HS3000 with MH1 (the MW1 IEM) as well, but not the HS3000 IEM on MW1 since HS3000 stock IEM is really low quality and not worth paying attention to.

 

Yes, I agree apt-X will become more and more important as a factor to develop real, audiopile level BT headset. However, it will take other factors to come together as well. For once, HS3000 would have been a much better package with Samsung doesn't cheap out on the stock IEM. Bass roll-off, which I believe is an side effect of using coupling caps, can be easily fixed by having a larger caps. These are all the little things that add up to affect the end result of the device.

 

Current has nothing to do with loadness, but voltage does. As I have said, for around the same voltage (meaning around the same volume), MW1 has higher current output. Having higher output current mean higher total power output on the same volume, and it gives the source more control over the headphone. It is the same idea of using a 1W headphone amp to drive a 100mW max headphone - you can't actually put the whole 1W to the headphone (unless you want to burn it), but it gives more room for the amp to control over the headphone driver. You can still drive the same 100mW max headphone with a 200mW amp, but it will offer less control and often higher distortion. That's why higher current is better, and it doesn't meant it will be very loud.

 

The idea of storing away the stock IEM is common for HF'er. But there are more people who stick to stock headset than you think. Just think of how many iPhone user still stick to iBud, and they could have easily replaced it with better stuff without costing too much. I believe Steve Jobs once commented that, the fastest way to improve SQ is to replace the stock earphone. Plus, stock IEM actually ain't all bad. If Samsung had have chosen to include the EHS64 instead of EHS44, I would have said they did quite a good job.

 

 

As your comment about Android OS upgrade, what I can say was different company have different approach/policy.
 
On your comments, Xperia TX considered as Sony last year flagship vs GT7+ Tablet which are not a flagship was a little off the line. If you see things the other way round, Sony Xperia U, Xperia Sola, Xperia Arc S(2011 flagship) all of which does not have JB upgrade.
 
And if you compare again, Samsung has much greater list of JB 4.1 upgrade than Sony did. Galaxy Tab 7.0 Plus, Galaxy Tab 2 7.0, Galaxy Tab 2 10.1, Galaxy Note 10.1, Galaxy S II LTE, Galaxy S II, Galaxy Note, Galaxy S Advance, Galaxy Music, Galaxy Chat, Galaxy Ace 2, I8530 Galaxy Beam, Galaxy Ace Plus, Galaxy Mini II, Galaxy S Duos. One thing to take note, older devices upgrade to new OS does not always mean it will be better. Some eventually became slow in response due to older hardwares speed and integration.
 
Well enough side line story, let us go back to Bluetooth discussion.
 
Good to know that your HS3000 vs MW1 test condition was indeed orange to orange. I would pretty much agree with you, if Samsung paired HS3000 with EHS64 should be the idea couple. But let's not forget, Samsung was not serious into IEM/headphone business, so I've believed they end up choosen the lesser price IEM to go along with HS3000 just to keep it at competitve pricing.
 
About the voltage vs current, well I must say you are half right about them. It's pretty much the same debate between voltage vs impedance, current vs impedance, just like a voltage driven output tube amp vs current driven output transistor amp story. Then there's peak power clipping character that make difference to the sound too. So sometime you'll see a high current 100W transistor amp not neccessary able to drive a high impendance low sentivity speakers resulting rough Hi-Fi sound, where a high voltage 10W tube amp does it easily and produces much better musical sound. So a designed power state determine better sound, not just higher voltage or higher current. Same thing apply on the very tiny IEM
 
Oh.. ClieOS you can pretty much stop talking about what Steve Jobs said. He's a typical bad businessman. Basically make his statements purely for his business advantages, trying hard to keeping those more than 70%+ profit margin. And for iphone users, they are just a bunch of people wanting a phone look chic and the rest stucked with basic component sold to them and pretty much they don't care what they are missing. To call iphone stock IEM (especially those before EarPod), ain't bad at all was a comment too overrated for me.
post #85 of 175
Thread Starter 

It doesn't matter who has a bigger list of update. It only matters to me when I am getting my update. In fact, by your logic it is exactly because Samsung has a bigger list of update that pushes me away. I am not saying Sony did a much better job on firmware, but it has a better track record in keeping promise (my past three 'phones were Samsung). I am also not talking about which models are or ain't getting updated, but the time waiting for the promised update. I am not that unreasonable to expect Samsung to update my old Ace to JB (it is do-able, someone did port a semi-workable JB onto Ace), but I don't want to spend a year waiting for an update that is promised but takes so long to deliver. All I am asking is a fixed date so I don't have to keep checking on Kies every week for a whole year. Sony said it will deliver in Q1, and it does - end of story. If Sony (or Samsung in the matter) said it is not going to update, I am fine with that as well. It is the waiting that is killing me.

 

The whole EHS44 vs. EHS64 to save price is a moot point, as both are dirt cheap. But you are right about one thing - Samsung does fail to see the important of SQ of a headset they are making, yet they are emphasizing SQ on the back of the HS3000's box - that kind of an irony.

 

As for hardware, of course other factors matter. But since no one has the time or money to measure every pair of IEM to every devices, the only logical way to decide what to get is to go with whatever information we do have and make the best possible choice. In that case, MW1 still comes out as a better choice, at least that what RMAA has shown me.

 

I don't personally like Steve Jobs either, nor how Apple is run. But I am not going to disagree with him just because I happen not to like him. If he speaks the truth (or at least some partial truth) to what I have seen, I see no wrong of quoting him about it.

post #86 of 175

I'm ok with Sony was good to provide fixed date on firmware update. Think we've dragged too much on this side line story. It's irrelevant and not healthy to all. And yes, some time small amount dollar and cents may seem nothing to us, but they do make impact on corporate final decision.

 

With your much good impression with MW1 i'm sure it's good device. Once Sony decide to release a version with aptX codec streaming, I'll definitely get one to try. Hopefully it won't sounded too Hi-Fi like the passed typical Sony stereo bluetooth.

 

No i didn't said I was disagree with Steve Job about what he said, "the fastest way to improve SQ is to replace the stock earphone". That's was simple logic even for a newbie. Just like you don't have to be a F1 driver to drive a car, so it's just a simple logic I'm trying to emphasize. Maybe I did not put it directly and the words I've choosed make wrong impression. Sorry about that.

post #87 of 175
[quote name="ClieOS" url="/t/633873/review-sony-mw1-smart-wireless-headset-pro/75#post_9313042"... I am not that unreasonable to expect Samsung to update my old Ace to JB (it is do-able, someone did port a semi-workable JB onto Ace)...
[/quote]

Galaxy Ace S5830? That phone is over 2yrs old. Its also a 800mhz single core, with not a lot of ram. Even if there was a JB update I wouldn't put it on it. It would probably be too slow. You might point to custom roms but they may introduce problems that don'rt ex

I don't really get the Sony vs Samsung debate here. They all drop support for older handsets on a regular basis. The budget handsets first, the high end handsets get support for longer. The best for updating old handsets is ironically Apple which update its 3GS which is nearly a 4yr old phone. That said with Android 2.3.6 you can still install most of the Apple. Unlike Apple once the apps get updated you can't install them on older OS version.

Anyone know the part number for these headphones. (Just the headphone part)
post #88 of 175

Sparky - If you're talking about the Sony's, they are the MH1 - there is a big thread about them - which can be found here...

 

However. as per the warning in the first post, be sure to get the right version for your device - however, all isn't lost, if you do get the wrong version, there are pin reversal cables such as the Fiio LU1...

post #89 of 175
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sparky191 View Post

Galaxy Ace S5830? That phone is over 2yrs old. Its also a 800mhz single core, with not a lot of ram. Even if there was a JB update I wouldn't put it on it. It would probably be too slow. You might point to custom roms but they may introduce problems that don'rt ex

I don't really get the Sony vs Samsung debate here. They all drop support for older handsets on a regular basis. The budget handsets first, the high end handsets get support for longer. The best for updating old handsets is ironically Apple which update its 3GS which is nearly a 4yr old phone. That said with Android 2.3.6 you can still install most of the Apple. Unlike Apple once the apps get updated you can't install them on older OS version.

Anyone know the part number for these headphones. (Just the headphone part)

 

Not that I'll actually want to put JB on Ace, but it is there to prove a point. I actually don't dislike iPhone as purely a smartphone, but I am just against a closed system. I do enjoy the freedom that I can move from Samsung to Sony or any other Android phone without having to lose all the software I paid for as well as able to sync between 'phone under the same Goggle account. With Apple, you have to stick to Apple or start all over. One thing that you need to know about Apple is that cellular networks (carrier) have to keep paying Apple money as long as the 'phone is still in use, and that's the extra motive Apple has to keep their phone updated to maximize profit. Android doesn't generate money for the manufacturer from cellular usage so the incentive to get more money is to sell new hardware. A good example is Singtel (Singapore based cellular network) - before iPhone was introduced to Singapore, Singtel has a decent record on yearly profit. After Singtel got the iPhone exclusive distributing right, their sale increased as expected, but the yearly earning actually dropped in ratio. This was because they had to pay Apple more money with more iPhone user they had. Apple not only made money on the hardware (the 'phone itself), the software (iTune / appstore), but also tapped into cellular usage.

 

Oh, the shorten version of MH1 (that comes with MW1) is not sold separated, as far as I know.


Edited by ClieOS - 3/31/13 at 5:38am
post #90 of 175
Jobs was many things, but a bad businessman he was not... In fact, that may have been the only thing he was really excellent at. Not sure how you can call him a bad businessman and admit he was netting huge profit margins, heh... If Apple tanks ten years from now, no one's gonna remember their devices after five years, but a lot of people will remember the one man that ever got the music studios to agree on something and had them by the balls. They'll remember the one guy that helped Pixar get off the ground by re-focusing them, etc etc. I don't particularly admire Jobs, but if I was a businessman I'd sure study him.

Now if by bad you meant cutthroat or capitalistic, that's a whole other subject... biggrin.gif I'm a died-in-the-wool Android fanboy btw...
Edited by Impulse - 3/31/13 at 10:22pm
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