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HD800 vs HE500 - Page 52

post #766 of 1025

I hope to one day go analog all the way. By that I mean just hire the artists to perform live in front of me, no reproduction equipment needed, just plain human voicebox and hands. Only electronics allowed are ones required in instruments like electric guitar. High fidelity the Amish way!

post #767 of 1025
Quote:
Originally Posted by froger View Post


It is not the first time you offended people by bringing the price in for your agrument, so hopefully it will be the last time if you are really sorry about it. And stop telling others to "agree to disagree" when you fighting for your stance all day long. Perhaps you should learn to agree to disagree first.


Oh really?  too bad if you have a problem with how I think about pricing affects people's thinking and evaluation of any product.  About offending people, I don't give a rat a...  You think how you like.  I'll do the same.  When needed, I apologize to people who misunderstood my intention and took what I said the wrong way.  Finally, I am not telling anyone to agree to disagree.  "let's" = suggestion, if you wanna do it, then fine.  If not, pretend you didn't hear it from me.  To me, anything that you have to use $ to buy is dictated and influenced by $.  I don't give a damn if you agree or not.  Fair and clear enough for you?  Now you can go get offended if you want. Omfg.

post #768 of 1025
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kyle 491 View Post
 

I've tried the HE-500 on a bunch of different speaker amps, piano never sounds entirely natural. The biggest change is the bass control.


This is the reason we can never agree on what we hear cuz we all hear differently.  I have a 6.5' grand piano sitting in my living room and I can tell you that the HE500 is not anywhere as nasty as you make it out to be.  To me, the HD800 sometimes injects too much detail/timbre into the sound. You don't hear this level of detail from a normal audience perspective.  So which one is more natural?  It really depends on who you ask.  For me when it comes to piano, HD800 = the player sit, HE500 = regular audience sit at a further distance away.  But I do agree that the HE500 smooths out a little too much of details sometimes.  I do prefer HD800 for violin and guitar, especially flamenco.


Edited by koiloco - 1/11/14 at 10:33pm
post #769 of 1025
Quote:
Originally Posted by koiloco View Post


Oh really?  too bad if you have a problem with how I think about pricing affects people's thinking and evaluation of any product.  About offending people, I don't give a rat a...  You think how you like.  I'll do the same.  When needed, I apologize to people who misunderstood my intention and took what I said the wrong way.  Finally, I am not telling anyone to agree to disagree.  "let's" = suggestion, if you wanna do it, then fine.  If not, pretend you didn't hear it from me.  To me, anything that you have to use $ to buy is dictated and influenced by $.  I don't give a damn if you agree or not.  Fair and clear enough for you?  Now you can go get offended if you want. Omfg.
Thanks for clarifying.
post #770 of 1025

On the argument of the graphs showing the HD800 to have more bass than the HE-500, I finally got around to looking at the graphs on HeadRoom. While I do see the HD800 (2013) being slightly higher than the HE-500, especially in midbass, I noticed something else that could be at play for this perceived more bass from the HE-500. I noticed that the HD800 graph seems to be higher in most frequencies compared to the HE-500. Perhaps, people are listening to the HE-500 at a volume level higher than what is measured in comparison to the HD800? Maybe what we judge to be equal volume, actually has the HE-500 playing louder due to the more forward mids or brighter treble of the HD800? Also, the graph shows both to be about the same on the lower bass frequencies (<70 Hz), and the argument for the HE-500 to have more bass slam or impact are terms that really are defined by sub-bass. And back to my comment on use for movies that really started all of this, it's this sub-bass rumble effect that I like the HE-500 for. After all, why are sub-woofers necessary for a good home theater experience, when many floorstanding speakers can go as low as 50 or 60 Hz? If you couple this theory that people are listening to the HE-500 louder than the HD800, it makes sense the sub-bass of the HE-500 seems more impactful. Another way to look at this is that the HE-500 sub-bass is higher that the HD800 relative to the rest of the frequency graph for each headphone.

post #771 of 1025

^ Sonido, are you drunk again tonite, bud?  :p 

Anyway, don't forget that HD800 reaches just as low or even lower than HE500 according to some owners.  I ran a 30hz test tone on the 2 HPs and could hear clear audible rumbling in both.  For me, that's as low as I care for the music genres to which I listen.

post #772 of 1025

^ Nope, just making a point on how a certain frequency relative to the rest of the graph is what defines elevated or recessed. If I were to take the HD800 graph and lower the entire frequency range by 10 dB, would you say it's a horrible headphone that's recessed throughout?

 

I'm about to watch another movie, and I'm planning on using the HD800 because of the weight advantage. It's late here, but if I were watching during the day, I'll probably just use HD800 from now on, and turn on the subwoofer in the background as well.

post #773 of 1025
^ got it.
post #774 of 1025
post #775 of 1025

Trust your own ears and not something which is written in the internet ;)

For me the bass on Audeze and some Hifiman as well are to much to being neutral.

post #776 of 1025
I wish bottlehead cracks sold for a cheaper price. Fully built used models are like $450-$550. It's crazy. I could buy the kit for $279 and if I mess up the wood part I would have money left over to get wood at Home Depot. Lol biggrin.gif
post #777 of 1025
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sonido View Post
 

On the argument of the graphs showing the HD800 to have more bass than the HE-500, I finally got around to looking at the graphs on HeadRoom. While I do see the HD800 (2013) being slightly higher than the HE-500, especially in midbass, I noticed something else that could be at play for this perceived more bass from the HE-500. I noticed that the HD800 graph seems to be higher in most frequencies compared to the HE-500. Perhaps, people are listening to the HE-500 at a volume level higher than what is measured in comparison to the HD800? Maybe what we judge to be equal volume, actually has the HE-500 playing louder due to the more forward mids or brighter treble of the HD800? Also, the graph shows both to be about the same on the lower bass frequencies (<70 Hz), and the argument for the HE-500 to have more bass slam or impact are terms that really are defined by sub-bass. And back to my comment on use for movies that really started all of this, it's this sub-bass rumble effect that I like the HE-500 for. After all, why are sub-woofers necessary for a good home theater experience, when many floorstanding speakers can go as low as 50 or 60 Hz? If you couple this theory that people are listening to the HE-500 louder than the HD800, it makes sense the sub-bass of the HE-500 seems more impactful. Another way to look at this is that the HE-500 sub-bass is higher that the HD800 relative to the rest of the frequency graph for each headphone.

 

usually, the midrange is the frequency  the human ear is more sensitive to.

HD800 is definately more upper-midrange oriented, so when someone set the preferred listening volume, he usually do it untill the mids/uppermids are at the right level.

There are people that are more sensitive to those frequencies, and people that are less....that's why someone says the bass is right and someone says they are recessed.

 

how the bass in hadled is a different story, we are not talking about volume....even with a bass boost, the HD800's bass is different than HE500's, it's airier and with less body.

 

why a subwoofer is needed? because it can go as low as 30hz....50/60hz should be the frequency crossover...and because it can move much more air with a bigger woofer


Edited by Blasyrkh - 1/12/14 at 4:35am
post #778 of 1025
I always thought midrange ended at just over 5khz. And the 800s midrange is recessed up to that point then it starts rising into the treble up to 6-9khz. http://people.ucsc.edu/~ilusztig/170b/handouts/frequency%20handout.pdf
post #779 of 1025
When we get into stratospheric headfi levels, these cans are much like very high end speaker/amp systems.

They will often sound amazing, holographic, with the correct recordings but anything not up to par sounds far worse than if you heard it through a $100 'giant killer' bargain can.

I auditioned several systems back in the day and tunes I knew and loved often sounded terrible on very high resolution systems.

The HD800 likely makes acoustic, jazz, live, classical, romantic and baroque sound amazing, but I bet that if I played the Beatles that the soundstage would be as narrow as a pencil and lack life, zest and bass.

These very top line components do that - they exaggerate in both directions; If the chain and source are excellent, it's a moving experience. If the chain and source are not excellent, it will sound worse than something costing 1/50th the price. One can make a very strong argument that hi-end components distort the sound in favour of higher quality recordings a stretching, if you will, at the quality ends.

My stance, naturally, is that one must have multiple headphones to bring out the best in everything ! biggrin.gif
post #780 of 1025
Quote:
Originally Posted by James-uk View Post

I always thought midrange ended at just over 5khz. And the 800s midrange is recessed up to that point then it starts rising into the treble up to 6-9khz. http://people.ucsc.edu/~ilusztig/170b/handouts/frequency%20handout.pdf

 

yes that's the point.....the human ear is more sensitive around 1-5Khz....but sometimes is sensitive to higher frequencies too.

 

if you have a "normal" ear, HD800 would sounds fine...due to the recessed mids

 

if you are more sensitive , then that upper midrange (above 5khz to be clear) would stand out too much

 

i think that's why many can be bothered by sibilance, others not


Edited by Blasyrkh - 1/12/14 at 4:20am
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