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Analog Squared Paper Discussion Thread. - Page 91

post #1351 of 3704

ianmedium - if you do this, it is important that you place the marble plate itself on oak cones to decouple the marble from the undergound and then again use oak cones to put smaller marble pieces onto the first marble plate to decouple player / amp from the base and each other.

 

good dampers can be made out of tennis balls, just cut them into half, then you have two excellent full rubber dampers per tennis ball.


Edited by GermanGuy - 7/29/13 at 10:35am
post #1352 of 3704
GG,
Thanks for all the great advice!

I too just found the same going back to my Marconi's sadly though they make Lorenz's look plentiful in comparison so I will have to be extra careful with them.

I am very excited to try the amp flat. I just went to my local stone mason and got for the princely sum of zero $ biggrin.gif a lovely large slab of 2cm thick black granite so this afternoon will be spent rigging all of this up. I think I will have to put the metal tube plate on the bottom of the amp so as to give mor surface area for the oak cone.

The slab is more than big enough for the amp and DAP!
post #1353 of 3704
Ahh, home, by heck that granite is heavy!

So, a spot of lunch then put on my nuttty professor coat and to work, will post pictures and thoughts a little later. So glad that I can use this amp horizontally, was not sure if it affected tube performance or not so thanks GG for your knowledge on that!
post #1354 of 3704
OK.
WIthout a shadow of a doubt this has been one of the most significant improvements since I got this amp! I mean, truly significant in terms of sonic improvement.

I glued for oak cones onto the granite slab (the base of the slab rest on wood covered by a woollen blanket. I experimented with that but the granite is so dense it made no difference so I have kept it as it is ( I listen to music in my easy chair at the end of my bed. My bed is made of wood and the end pieces are flat wood about 4 inches wide on which is a blanket for decoration and on to which rests the granite)

So the amp rests on the four oak feet, one at each corner of the amp and I have used one of the RF plates to cover the tubes on the bottom so as to give more area for the oak cones to rest.

After much experimentation I now have my 801 back in its cradle as for this application there was no sonic benefit now to the oak cone feet underneath it and this is more secure and isolates the player from the amp more. So the platform for the player is a solid oblong of oak with cork sheet underneath and on top. I have also glued extra oak strips around the edges so as to keep the player more firmly in place.

The whole lot rests on this large slab of granite.

So, what differences does this make.. Very substantial and my already high regard for this amp has just gone through the roof! I promise, this is not hyperbole, truly.

For a start. You would think that the amp resting on oak feet on solid granite would exacerbate the ting ting noises and make a harder sound.. Quite the opposite has occurred!

MId range has become even more defined and creamy, bass has deepened by what I would call a considerable margin and treble extension and air is off the scale. Decay of notes that have a long sustain seem to go on forever where as notes that snap now snap to a stop immediately, there is simply no smearing of the acoustic whatsoever.

Orchestra is even deeper and richer and yet has so much space, it feels like it is outside of my headphones!

I simply am scratching my head with all of this. I always thought this is a great amp but give it a good foundation and it goes way beyond that. To treat this amp as a portable does it a huge disservice I feel.

This amp needs, no, HAS to be treated as you would a high quality home amp.

What really really surprises me and validates the work of still points and of Russ Andrews is the sonic gains to be had by decoupling the amp not by soft materials and thus damp out vibration but by directly allowing the vibration to pass from the amp via the cones directly into the granite which then dissipates the energy without taking the energy out of the music.

I always try to be a little cautious with my comments on improvements but truly, I cannot with this!

For the price of pennies from my local wood store for the oak feet and free granite from my local kitchen counter store I feel I have added double the value to this amp and I really truly mean that.. Quite astonished!

Here are some quick and bad pictures to illustrate how this all looks now!

AppleMark
AppleMark
AppleMark
Edited by ianmedium - 7/29/13 at 1:35pm
post #1355 of 3704

okay, here are some pictures of the baking dish surrounded by the balsa wood glued together, cutted and shaped, one time painted with mahagoni wood stain as base for my amp:

 

 

 

 

 

there are some white spots left (glue on the wood), so i maybe have to polish and apply the wood stain again or use real paint instead.

post #1356 of 3704
Looking good GG, how does it sound?
post #1357 of 3704

this is just - how to say - the outfit, the packaging, nothing inside, no feet, no dampers, no mass (i.e.sand, metal, whatever to make it heavy enough), also no second plate and dampers for the amp, so no need or sense to listen to at the moment.

 

i will try to get it finalized this week.


Edited by GermanGuy - 7/29/13 at 2:12pm
post #1358 of 3704
I really recommend the granite, just amazing the differences, still can't quite get my head around the sound of this with this base!
post #1359 of 3704

i agree that marble or granite are great for this purpose. the problem for me is that they are hard to treat, to cut, to shape. i prefer materials i can handle at home, for example concrete or something like this to fill the base with a heavy material.

post #1360 of 3704

ianmedium - by the way - any differences in sound using the amp vertically or horizontally?

post #1361 of 3704
I tried the amp without the base but on my wooden table to test to see if there was any difference and I felt there was a small sonic improvement with the amp horizontal but tiny to the point of hardly noticeable but on the base there was a large difference sonically having the amp horizontal on the wooden cones over vertical on the wooden cones.

Also, it just feels nicer to use horizontally and this means I can get shorter interconnects as well. I always like to use the least amount of interconnect as possible.

What I find the oddest thing is that it damps the tinging noise down (which the Marconi's are susceptible to ) greatly. But it is the air around the notes and the depth in soundstage that is the biggest difference. The acoustic the recording was made in is much ore noticeable with this type of support.

I am very lucky having this stone mason so close by, they not only gave the granite to me they even offered to cut it for me for free, really nice folks.
post #1362 of 3704

Guys a subject a little out of topic: I am often disapointed by the quality of the downloaded files, and mainly by the fact that they have quite some hiss or noises in the background. In the same album, some audio files can be dead silent, and some show anowing noise that can be clearly heard when the music is playing pianissimo.

 

It is my ear that is over sensible to this problem or do you also experience this often ?  I have may be more than 50% of my hi-res files that are not dead silent !

 

This ruin the "black background" sound of the TU-05 !

 

PS:  I try to download 24/96 files when they are available, botherwise I get 16/44-48 reedbook files. I consider anything above 96 kHz useless, so I avoid 24/192.  What do you think about this ?

post #1363 of 3704

Guys, In my quest for Philips DL92, I have been proposed "DL92 Philips old type D Getter under Telefunken brand" !! blink.gif 

 

The vendor says :

********************

 

"They are in original Telefuken's never opened boxes, sealed in celophane. I've opened one box and then I carefully inspect internal structure and codes.

It's made in Mullard Radio valve Co., Mitcham tube plant, division of Philips in 1951. It's an old type d getter, later Philips tubes from 60s have ring getter.

 

So it's Philips D getter DL92 rebranded Telefunken and those tubes were sold like original Telefunken tubes."

 

 

 

--> Does that makes sense to you ? Are they interesting tubes ?  Are they really the same than the one GG is using in his "telefunken df904/1U4 + philips dl 92 combo" ?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

post #1364 of 3704
Those tubes look great and it sounds like the seller knows his or her stuff. The description sounds identical to my phillips in the manufacturing place. I would have those in a heartbeat personally. GG's phillips are Belgium from what I remember, mine are Mitcham but we both have had the same sonic experience. I cannot see yours being any different in that respect.

The most important thing is the place and who they were made by, as I have said before, what is printed on the glass and what box they come in is less important than the codes as to where they are made as re-branding is a common thing!

As to your download question. I wonder, the hiss your experiencing. Might it be tape hiss? If that is the case that is perfectly normal, it is the hiss from the master tape and for me it shows that whomever has transferred the music from the tape to digital has left it intact. They have not applied noise reduction in other words... This is a GOOD thing! It means the recording retains the dynamic range of the master tape hiss and all. You would have experienced the hiss on the Vinyl version or tape version or hopefully if well done, the CD version as well.

The only time you should not hear that is if it is a DDD recording where the master is digital.

I purchase a lot of historic classical recordings from HDTT. They do not get rid of the hiss and warn the listener that there will be artifacts left as they have not compressed them out to retain the original dynamic range... This is the lifeblood of the recording and is why so much modern music or remastered music sound so lifeless. They compress it at mastering stage. A good example of what I regard sonically an unlistenable album because of that compression is Adel.

Anyone using that album in a review of equipment has a fatally flawed review from the get go as the recording is so heavily compressed that it renders any serious thoughts of the equipment redundant I feel.
post #1365 of 3704

Well... that is a very "positive attitude" way to look at this !

 

Still, I find this hiss annoying in the pianissimo part of my music, but... thanks to you now I know why I am annoyed wink_face.gif

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