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Fostex TH600 Dynamic Headphones - Page 59

post #871 of 2351

Thanks MLE, words of reason.

post #872 of 2351
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mad Lust Envy View Post

Remember kiddies, A/B comparisons aren't valid unless you spend $2000 on a dac that doesn't send out garbage.

Because everything has to be high priced for it to be good.

Give me a break.

The TH-600 comparison to the TH-900 earlier is still valid because depsite how good a dac is or not (in this case, I'm willing to bet it's good dac vs better dac), there is still a measure of improvement from driver to driver. The most important thing is the transducer. The drivers tell the story, not the DAC.

I'm so sick of the head-fi hyperbole.

 

Oh boy someone jumps into a conversation late and completely swings and misses.

 

I certainly didn't say you need a 2000 dollar dac/amp to do comparisons. I was simply highliting the fact that he has probably 2+ Grand invested in TWO headphones and he is utilizing a good but in that scheme (alot of money) of things a cheap dac. When he could have bought one of those headphones and invested in a more capable deserving dac. He since has said that he has bought a different more expensive dac.

 

Did anyone say he could not make comparisons about how he perceived the differences between the 2 headphones using that dac....no ! Maybe he can comment now, possibly in another thread about the differences between his older dac and his newer dac.

 

Also when someone says something arbitrary like "higher end dacs" how do you or i know what they mean by higher end ? Higher end could mean 750 dollars or it could mean 3 grand. Who knows but putting a figure like 2k on someones arbitrary statement is silly.

 

I wasn't even going to reply to this post, but the huffyness and inaccuracy is ridiculous.

 

Last time I comment on anything but the headphones in this thread.

post #873 of 2351
Quote:
Originally Posted by plakat View Post

Thanks MLE, words of reason.

More like words of anger. LOL

 

I of course agree that using the same source/amp to compare two similar headphones is great so we know they're being fed the same way. So I have nothing against you doing that plakat.

 

I think the point that MLE missed was that we were discussing the importance of source in general and that sources do scale higher than $200, and keep on scaling noticeably past $1000 and $2000 dollars. Just like amps/headphones. While you, plakat and Jibzilla were saying there is very little difference if any between sources $200+

 

I'm right and you guys are wrong of course. LOL. But yeah let's get back to the awesomeness of the TH600. Every point we need to make has been made yesterday.

post #874 of 2351

So... where to begin?

 

I think when one wants to check out the absolute (for what its worth) quality of some gear I concur that the rest of the equipment used should be of the best quality possible. For a passing comparison equipment of middle pedigree is IMO sufficient. And we seem to agree about that.

 

@kcee I know what you mean by the slight imbalance in money spent. Everyone has to start somewhere... and there is a very specific reason for me owning both Fostex models. Plus an HP-P1. And of today an HP-A8 :-)

 

While I still lack the resources to do a proper (i.e. blind) comparison I'll of course look into the differences between the Meridian+Lake People vs. HP-A8 combinations and even cross them out to try to isolate DACs and amps. I do have a knack for discrete amps, so that might influence my impressions...

 

A first short listen with the TH-900 connected to the A8 shows impressive detail and a very spacious presentation, leaner but more controlled and better structured bass. Voices are presented in a very natural way and seem more forward compared to my memory of the Meridian/Lake People combination.

 

The differences between TH-600 and TH-900 are present as described before, though both seem to win with the A8.

 

Both are incredible headphones and surprise me time after time with details and, especially, vicious bass attacks (when called for by the source material). And I'm quite happy to be able to pair them with the amp their maker intended for their operation.

post #875 of 2351
ive noticed quite a bit of difference upgrading my dac and likewise, my impressions perceptions and opinions of different headphones has changed. source is quite important imo
post #876 of 2351
Quote:
Originally Posted by plakat View Post

So... where to begin?

 

I think when one wants to check out the absolute (for what its worth) quality of some gear I concur that the rest of the equipment used should be of the best quality possible. For a passing comparison equipment of middle pedigree is IMO sufficient. And we seem to agree about that.

 

@kcee I know what you mean by the slight imbalance in money spent. Everyone has to start somewhere... and there is a very specific reason for me owning both Fostex models. Plus an HP-P1. And of today an HP-A8 :-)

 

While I still lack the resources to do a proper (i.e. blind) comparison I'll of course look into the differences between the Meridian+Lake People vs. HP-A8 combinations and even cross them out to try to isolate DACs and amps. I do have a knack for discrete amps, so that might influence my impressions...

 

A first short listen with the TH-900 connected to the A8 shows impressive detail and a very spacious presentation, leaner but more controlled and better structured bass. Voices are presented in a very natural way and seem more forward compared to my memory of the Meridian/Lake People combination.

 

The differences between TH-600 and TH-900 are present as described before, though both seem to win with the A8.

 

Both are incredible headphones and surprise me time after time with details and, especially, vicious bass attacks (when called for by the source material). And I'm quite happy to be able to pair them with the amp their maker intended for their operation.

 

 

Often I was thinking of buying an A8, but to me is is price-wise a very huge step.

 

Where did you get your A8? Is ther any possibility to get it below 1000€

post #877 of 2351
Quote:
Originally Posted by RAFA View Post

 

 

Often I was thinking of buying an A8, but to me is is price-wise a very huge step.

 

Where did you get your A8? Is ther any possibility to get it below 1000€

 

PJ's

post #878 of 2351
Quote:
Originally Posted by Greed View Post

 

PJ's

 

Yeah, but PJ's website says it is 100v only! Either it is still possible to switch between 100V and 230V it or, I would have to buy some kind of transformer.

post #879 of 2351
Quote:
Originally Posted by RAFA View Post

 

Yeah, but PJ's website says it is 100v only! Either it is still possible to switch between 100V and 230V it or, I would have to buy some kind of transformer.

 

Probably still cheaper than 1000 euro, yes? If not, sometimes I see them on Headphone.com B Stock for around 899. 

post #880 of 2351
Quote:
Originally Posted by kcee View Post

 

 

Did anyone say he could not make comparisons about how he perceived the differences between the 2 headphones using that dac....no ! Maybe he can comment now, possibly in another thread about the differences between his older dac and his newer dac.


Edited by jibzilla - 6/3/14 at 6:00am
post #881 of 2351
Again, unless you spend money on high end equipment, your comparisons are null and void. Because everything is crap unless its worth so much money
Again, give me a break.

Comparisons are valid, regardless of price bracket. If you want to dismiss the comparison because it doesn't live up to your ridiculous standards, go ahead, but there are others who don't have that kind of cash and upgraded what actually puts off sound first, the headphones. Yiu can hear the difference between hewdphones even off the basic of sources. It may not be ALL the differences, but it's still worth mentioning. No need tk tell others that their equipment isn't up to snuff.

Can't stand when others pretty much tell someone that buying a high end headphone is a waste because they dont have a hugh end dac. So much hyperbole.

That is all.
post #882 of 2351
I agree with Mad Lust Envy

Firstly most DACS are over rated - I mean $4000 for a dac only?

Also most headphones scale up.

I would think source eg good CD player or well set up Turntable or well set up computer music server plus the amp would have a greater impact than most DACs. Feel free to disagree.

Source, decent amp & Headphones should be your priority followed by a recommended DAC that suits your budget. Both the TH600 & TH900 scale extremely well. So they would very lightly shine with a budget & high end DAC assuming both DACs are well made.

Case in point I own the Grace M903 and the CLAS both are at different price points however they are not that different when used as pure DACs. I have used both as a DAC going into my Leben CS300xs with TH900 as my H/P and the difference was not night and day.
post #883 of 2351
Quote:
Originally Posted by mrtim6 View Post

I agree with Mad Lust Envy

Firstly most DACS are over rated - I mean $4000 for a dac only?

Also most headphones scale up.

I would think source eg good CD player or well set up Turntable or well set up computer music server plus the amp would have a greater impact than most DACs. Feel free to disagree.

Source, decent amp & Headphones should be your priority followed by a recommended DAC that suits your budget. Both the TH600 & TH900 scale extremely well. So they would very lightly shine with a budget & high end DAC assuming both DACs are well made.

Case in point I own the Grace M903 and the CLAS both are at different price points however they are not that different when used as pure DACs. I have used both as a DAC going into my Leben CS300xs with TH900 as my H/P and the difference was not night and day.

 

a good CD player is a DAC....except the file is stores on the CD instead of on your computer. source matters. i don't believe the super expensive stuff out there is worth the price, but yes a nice dac in the 1000-3000 dollar range does improve your setup quite a bit.

post #884 of 2351
Quote:
Originally Posted by jibzilla View Post

Probably catch some flac for this but I think the whole "source is the most important" argument is getting quite dated. Encoders are soo much better nowadays and while I'm using dj carts my 320kbps mp3's sound just as good as my real vinyl. I also can not tell any difference between lossless and 320kbps and have bought the same track from beatport in both formats. No difference running what I think is pretty highend headphone equipment. If this were 5 years ago I would say yeah a dac is important but now I think you will see more performance for your dollar out of an amp, ear pad swap, headband swap. Plus the ear pad and headband swap will also improve the comfort. Technology has come a long way from the days of napster and most of the labtops I have tried at least in the last 2 years have great (for the most part) sound cards already installed.

Also price is only part of the equation. Plenty of great and dud dac products in their respective price ranges.

In my experience would have to disagree - I have Apollo Vibes on vinyl and lossless my well tempered simplex turntable with zu Dennon 103 cart into a basic phono stage (clearaudio nano) sounded so good - emotionally engaging is maybe a better description. When played through zu audio super soulflys, even my wife a non audiophile said wow that sounds great.
post #885 of 2351
Quote:
Originally Posted by mrtim6 View Post

I agree with Mad Lust Envy

Nobody was disagreeing with him as far as I can see. He just came out swinging. evil_smiley.gif

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