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Fiio E18 - Page 59

post #871 of 1747
Quote:
Originally Posted by bunnyfluffy View Post

Hmm I just read that the E17 actually can do 300 ohms.. and it has a dac. So I guess that's my best option. 

I can explain you why they are marketed different if you want, but I can tell you they both are fine amp wise for 300 Ohm. Fiio just decided to be more conservative when specifying the E18 in the data sheet.

EDIT:

In fact... From Fiio's web page:
Fiio E18 >300mW@32Ω
Fiio E17 >220 mW@32Ω />290 mW@16Ω
Edited by Ashade - 1/2/14 at 7:44pm
post #872 of 1747
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ashade View Post


I can explain you why they are marketed different if you want, but I can tell you they both are fine amp wise for 300 Ohm. Fiio just decided to be more conservative when specifying the E18 in the data sheet.

EDIT:

In fact... From Fiio's web page:
Fiio E18 >300mW@32Ω
Fiio E17 >220 mW@32Ω />290 mW@16Ω

 

I just checked their page, and the E17 actually says 150 ohm. That's weird, cuz I've seen 300 ohm written in on retailer websites.

 

I am interested in why they're fine amp wise, and why they would be conservative, if you have the time to explain it. Thank you.

post #873 of 1747
Quote:
Originally Posted by bunnyfluffy View Post

I just checked their page, and the E17 actually says 150 ohm. That's weird, cuz I've seen 300 ohm written in on retailer websites.

I am interested in why they're fine amp wise, and why they would be conservative, if you have the time to explain it. Thank you.

Fiio used to say the E17 was able to drive 300Ohm. They changed that when the E18 came out because E17 and E18, while they can get pretty loud volumes with 300 Ohm headphones, they might be slightly in the limit regarding the current.

This is just my opinion but, while both might be in the limit to drive them properly, we are talking about a portable device, which means that the DAC part is going to be the one providing the of sound. In other words, if your computer has a crappy DAC, it doesn't matter if the headphones are properly driven because they are going to still sound like crap. Now, if you add the DAC in the equation, it doesn't matter if the headphones are slightly underpowered because the sound is going to be good (not perfect but much much better). That's why if you are thinking in mostly portable use you should go the Amp/DAC combo way.

E12 is more meant for orthodynamic headphones, and I highly doubt the HD650 are really that much underpowered (if any) on a E17 or E18. Even more, the difficulty of being driven doesn't relate with the impedance. For example, HE-500 or Q701 are difficult to drive, and the impedance is fairly low (less than 100 Ohm).
Edited by Ashade - 1/2/14 at 10:19pm
post #874 of 1747

Thanks, that marketing ploy makes sense. It's confusing because people are always saying a DAC helps a lot with a computer connection, but I guess some phones have decent DAC's and some don't?

post #875 of 1747
Quote:
Originally Posted by bunnyfluffy View Post
 

 

I just checked their page, and the E17 actually says 150 ohm. That's weird, cuz I've seen 300 ohm written in on retailer websites.

 

I am interested in why they're fine amp wise, and why they would be conservative, if you have the time to explain it. Thank you.

 

150ohm or 300ohm is just a number game. A headphone has other parameters beside impedance, and manufacturer just lists down one number that they think they can "safely" recommend, but it doesn't mean that it the limitation of what it can do and it also doesn't mean connecting a 300ohm headphone to a 150ohm rated amp will break anything.

 

You also want to take note that E18 is really designed to be used as a Android smartphone DAC first and a PC DAC second, while E17 is just designed for PC and it might not work with many Android smartphone out there.

post #876 of 1747
Quote:
Originally Posted by bunnyfluffy View Post

Thanks, that marketing ploy makes sense. It's confusing because people are always saying a DAC helps a lot with a computer connection, but I guess some phones have decent DAC's and some don't?

I would say most of the time you will benefit from an external DAC. I use the Note II known for being fairly good and it benefits of an external DAC. In general, unless you are using Apple products, go the DAC route, and even if that 's the case it's not a bad idea.
Edited by Ashade - 1/2/14 at 10:31pm
post #877 of 1747
Hi.
I have a LG G2 and Sennheiser HD600.
Which one is best choise for portable amp? Fiio E12 or E18. LG G2 with stock rom.
post #878 of 1747
Just got an email from MP4 nation saying they carry the E18 for $159.50. Comes with 2 day FedEx and some free earphones. Thought some of you would like that.
post #879 of 1747
Quote:
Originally Posted by asdfvtn View Post

Just got an email from MP4 nation saying they carry the E18 for $159.50. Comes with 2 day FedEx and some free earphones. Thought some of you would like that.

Nice! Do we know if it's the new revision?
post #880 of 1747
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ashade View Post

Nice! Do we know if it's the new revision?

Miccastore has it as well. Rev B.

And amazon.
Edited by Ashade - 1/3/14 at 3:56am
post #881 of 1747
Quote:
Originally Posted by bunnyfluffy View Post
 

Thanks, that marketing ploy makes sense. It's confusing because people are always saying a DAC helps a lot with a computer connection, but I guess some phones have decent DAC's and some don't?

 

I think in your case, the E18 is the most bang for the buck. I don't think the E17 or the E18 out run one another much (performance wise) but the fact the E18 is comaptible with most android devices (considering the fact your S4 is the primary source) wil make it a win i guess...

side note: as mentioned before, the e12 is an amp thats different from an amp/dac combo. The DAC part of the E18 will enhance the performance of your S4.

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ashade View Post


Thank you. I mean the new version though. I suppose that what these guys have in stock is still the first release, which is the one I have. Time to upgrade. smily_headphones1.gif

they do have it now (they confirmed it, but how can you tell the difference)? it's out there  :)

post #882 of 1747
Quote:
Originally Posted by Posmentis View Post

they do have it now (they confirmed it, but how can you tell the difference)? it's out there  smily_headphones1.gif

Yeeiihhhh!
post #883 of 1747
Quote:
Originally Posted by Posmentis View Post

 

I think in your case, the E18 is the most bang for the buck. I don't think the E17 or the E18 out run one another much (performance wise) but the fact the E18 is comaptible with most android devices (considering the fact your S4 is the primary source) wil make it a win i guess...

side note: as mentioned before, the e12 is an amp thats different from an amp/dac combo. The DAC part of the E18 will enhance the performance of your S4.

 

they do have it now (they confirmed it, but how can you tell the difference)? it's out there  :)

 

Since the E17 works with every iteration of the S4, while the E18 seems only to tolerate S4s that have been updated to 4.3, I wonder whether compatibility is the reason for S4 owners to choose the E18. 

 

I'd love to see a comparison review between the E17 and E18 sound-wise, since I have as much experience with the latter as your average neutered malamute. 

 

Also:

 

In the previous Hey-the-S4-and-E18-now-work-with-Android-4.3! titter-fest, I read posts confirming Sprint and Verizon S4s but none in which I recognized the T-Mobile variant.  And while I see no logical reason for a TM S4 running 4.3 to work differently from the rest, it's always reassuring to read a gleeful affirmation from some foont who's tested the phone in ques and is now doing cartwheels and jiggling his or her left spleen. 

post #884 of 1747
Quote:
Originally Posted by bunnyfluffy View Post
 

 

I just checked their page, and the E17 actually says 150 ohm. That's weird, cuz I've seen 300 ohm written in on retailer websites.

 

I am interested in why they're fine amp wise, and why they would be conservative, if you have the time to explain it. Thank you.

 

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ashade View Post


Fiio used to say the E17 was able to drive 300Ohm. They changed that when the E18 came out because E17 and E18, while they can get pretty loud volumes with 300 Ohm headphones, they might be slightly in the limit regarding the current.

This is just my opinion but, while both might be in the limit to drive them properly, we are talking about a portable device, which means that the DAC part is going to be the one providing the of sound. In other words, if your computer has a crappy DAC, it doesn't matter if the headphones are properly driven because they are going to still sound like crap. Now, if you add the DAC in the equation, it doesn't matter if the headphones are slightly underpowered because the sound is going to be good (not perfect but much much better). That's why if you are thinking in mostly portable use you should go the Amp/DAC combo way.

E12 is more meant for orthodynamic headphones, and I highly doubt the HD650 are really that much underpowered (if any) on a E17 or E18. Even more, the difficulty of being driven doesn't relate with the impedance. For example, HE-500 or Q701 are difficult to drive, and the impedance is fairly low (less than 100 Ohm).

You've left out an important factor. The sensitivity of the headphones in combination with the amp's impedance, drive power and max V-p-p determine how successfully an amp can drive a particular set of cans. The HD600 is more sensitive than the HD650's and even though they are both 300 Ohms, the HD600's will be louder and easier to drive.

post #885 of 1747
Quote:
Originally Posted by scrypt View Post
 

 

Since the E17 works with every iteration of the S4, while the E18 seems only to tolerate S4s that have been updated to 4.3, I wonder whether compatibility is the reason for S4 owners to choose the E18.

 

I'd love to see a comparison review between the E17 and E18 sound-wise, since I have as much experience with the latter as your average neutered malamute.

 

Also:

 

In the previous Hey-the-S4-and-E18-now-work-with-Android-4.3! titter-fest, I read posts confirming Sprint and Verizon S4s but none in which I recognized the T-Mobile variant.  And while I see no logical reason for a TM S4 running 4.3 to work differently from the rest, it's always reassuring to read a gleeful affirmation from some foont who's tested the phone in ques and is now doing cartwheels and jiggling his or her left spleen.

For what it's worth, I chose the E17 over E18 mainly because it works with Galaxy S4 and I can (and did) pair it with the E09 for my computer and the reviews I read mention that it has the same sound signature as the old E7 (which I own), which I really like.  I also, wasn't that interested in the compatibity features of the E18 with Android (e.g. - play, forward/reverse track buttons).  Not at all saying one is better than the other, just giving you my two cents.

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