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Fiio E18 - Page 72

post #1066 of 2231
Quote:
Originally Posted by nway View Post
 

 

I don't know if you've already received your E18 and perhaps already tried it with a C&C BH2 that you already own, but anyway, I tried my E18 with my BH2 and the combo works quite well. My ears are not very sensitive to high fidelity, and I must admit it's sometimes hard for me to discern the improvement in sound quality between the E18 alone or the BH2 alone compared to using no external DAC or amp; however, the improvement in sound quality using the E18 and BH2 together is just barely enough that I can definitely discern an improvement in sound quality over plugging my headphones straight into my MacBook Pro. The two most apparent changes I can discern are the stronger bass (likely due in no small part to the E18's bass boost function) and a more spacious soundstage (probably more thanks to the BH2 rather than the E18). So if you already own a BH2, they'll play together quite nicely. However, I've just recently purchased both new, and as the difference in sound improvement is so subtle, I think I'm actually going to be returning both, as, for my purposes, neither are worth the $106/$160, and the two combined definitely aren't worth the $266 for me. It's a shame, because I feel like I lucked out with my E18 working 100% flawlessly with my T-Mobile HTC One, but I suppose I'll save money in the long-run by not being a meticulously discerning audiophile. :)

I really appreciate your honesty there though the HTC One is a very good sounding phone.

post #1067 of 2231
Quote:
Originally Posted by ForceMajeure View Post
 

I really appreciate your honesty there though the HTC One is a very good sounding phone.

I had a similar experiences from my trials. maybe I don't have golden ears, but dac/amps don't drastically improve the sound for me. I personally don't recommend spending more than 25-50% of the price of your headphones on an amp/dac. really you can find lots of solid portable options sub-$200. also, the differences between the equipment I've tried is very very hard for me to distinguish personally.

 

I feel like a lot of the recommendations being throw out there for more expensive equipment isn't really practical unless you have really expensive $1k+ headphones. Also, a lot of the sound signature (frequency response) improvements you get with an amp/dac can be achieved for free using an equalizer. ymmv

post #1068 of 2231

You may be right, when (for instance)  using the Viper4Android equalizer on the S4 (i9505). There the E18 contribution is more marginal, but still present.

With my Cowon D20, its another story, the E18 shines there.

 

I play via the Shure SE846.

post #1069 of 2231
Quote:
Originally Posted by money4me247 View Post
 

I had a similar experiences from my trials. maybe I don't have golden ears, but dac/amps don't drastically improve the sound for me. I personally don't recommend spending more than 25-50% of the price of your headphones on an amp/dac. really you can find lots of solid portable options sub-$200. also, the differences between the equipment I've tried is very very hard for me to distinguish personally.

 

I feel like a lot of the recommendations being throw out there for more expensive equipment isn't really practical unless you have really expensive $1k+ headphones. Also, a lot of the sound signature (frequency response) improvements you get with an amp/dac can be achieved for free using an equalizer. ymmv

Amping will be required for headphones costing far less than $1K. One example is the very popular Sennheiser HD600 which will reveal details from a better DAC than one from a substandard device/phone. It will require amping unless you are willing to listen at low volumes. There is a long list of cans below $1K that can reap benefits from using DACs and Amps not costing thousands of dollars.

post #1070 of 2231
Quote:
Originally Posted by StanD View Post
 

Amping will be required for headphones costing far less than $1K. One example is the very popular Sennheiser HD600 which will reveal details from a better DAC than one from a substandard device/phone. It will require amping unless you are willing to listen at low volumes. There is a long list of cans below $1K that can reap benefits from using DACs and Amps not costing thousands of dollars.

hahaha... yes, amping is required for headphones that need more power (eg. high impedance over 32ohms) to listen at appropriate volumes. however, for low impedance headphones, I have found that that amping does not significantly improve the sound quality as many people here suggest. the portable fiio e18 is geared for portable headphones that are usually low impedance & I have personally have not found any drastic upgrade in sound quality using portable amps for the low impedance portable headphones that I have tried. Sorry if I wasn't clear.

 

Also, for DACs, I have found that the improvements in sound quality is extremely subtle & imo usually not worth their retail price for the headphones that I have tried at $400 & below mark. considering that most dacs start at $100-200+, I don't see it being really worth it unless you have more expensive equipment. how significant of a sonic upgrade you get with a dac is also dependent on what kind of sound card/audio playback device you are using, so ymmv.


Edited by money4me247 - 2/7/14 at 6:34am
post #1071 of 2231
Quote:
Originally Posted by money4me247 View Post
 

hahaha... yes, amping is required for headphones that need more power (eg. high impedance over 32ohms) to listen at appropriate volumes. however, for low impedance headphones, I have found that that amping does not significantly improve the sound quality as many people here suggest. the portable fiio e18 is geared for portable headphones that are usually low impedance & I have personally have not found any drastic upgrade in sound quality using portable amps for the low impedance portable headphones that I have tried. Sorry if I wasn't clear.

 

Also, for DACs, I have found that the improvements in sound quality is extremely subtle & imo usually not worth their retail price for the headphones that I have tried at $400 & below mark. considering that most dacs start at $100-200+, I don't see it being really worth it unless you have more expensive equipment. how significant of a sonic upgrade you get with a dac is also dependent on what kind of sound card/audio playback device you are using, so ymmv.

So now you're lowering the bar to $400, lol.

I have a pair of HE-500's and the E18 can barely drive them and not to satisfaction. I'm sure that it's not the only pair of low impedance cans below $1K that need proper amping. I'll bet you the HD600's which retail at $400 can benefit from a better DAC but the differences are more subtle, and yes I have a pair as well.

post #1072 of 2231
post #1073 of 2231

 

By purposely putting caps in the signal path? Not sure that can be quality as an improvement. At most it is just coloration.

post #1074 of 2231

 

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by ClieOS View Post
 

 

By purposely putting caps in the signal path? Not sure that can be quality as an improvement. At most it is just coloration.

I would never do such a thing. Direct coupling of outputs is the best possible choice, no introduction of nonlinearity or phase shifts by use of caps which have nothing to contribute. In fact if the value of capacitance isn't large enough you will experience bass roll off.

post #1075 of 2231
Quote:
Originally Posted by StanD View Post
 

So now you're lowering the bar to $400, lol.

I have a pair of HE-500's and the E18 can barely drive them and not to satisfaction. I'm sure that it's not the only pair of low impedance cans below $1K that need proper amping. I'll bet you the HD600's which retail at $400 can benefit from a better DAC but the differences are more subtle, and yes I have a pair as well.

naww... i still think that $200+ dac paired with a $300+ amp really only benefits super high end headphones. I have a $400 pair of HE-400s and they sound amazing with my sub-$150 dac/amp combo. Tried more expensive equipment with em and personally didn't really notice any significant sound quality improvements. i say that because i haven't had a chance to really play around with really flagship stuff, so i am speculating that there would be a more noticeable improvement with equipment upgrades than what i've experienced at the sub-$400 headphone price range.

 

i have tried the hd600 and i've heard they do scale up well with nicer equipment. personally though, i would throw the majority of my budget into the headphones rather than the dac/amp. i feel like the sonic upgrade from getting a better pair of headphones is more significant than upgrading your equipment and a better value for your money.


Edited by money4me247 - 2/7/14 at 10:41am
post #1076 of 2231
Quote:
Originally Posted by money4me247 View Post
 

naww... i still think that $200+ dac paired with a $300+ amp really only benefits super high end headphones. I have a $400 pair of HE-400s and they sound amazing with my sub-$150 dac/amp combo. Tried more expensive equipment with em and personally didn't really notice any significant sound quality improvements. i say that because i haven't had a chance to really play around with really flagship stuff, so i am speculating that there would be a more noticeable improvement with equipment upgrades than what i've experienced at the sub-$400 headphone price range.

 

i have tried the hd600 and i've heard they do scale up well with nicer equipment. personally though, i would throw the majority of my budget into the headphones rather than the dac/amp. i feel like the sonic upgrade from getting a better pair of headphones is more significant than upgrading your equipment and a better value for your money.

I've always said that once you have a decent Amp/DAC, put your money in Headphones to get the most bang for your buck. The HD600's sound great without spending a grand on an amp. They even sound very good on an E18, I've got both. The E18 really can't drive the HE-500's, but the E12 can get away with it. Yep, got that stuff as well. The HE-500's really need about 1W, which I believe is what HifiMan says and my Asgard 2 definitely does great with them. They also do great hanging off of speaker taps on my vintage receiver.

A "$200+ dac paired with a $300+ amp" can easily skyrocket into thousands of dollars. I think about $500 to $1000 should cover just about anything other than dealing with electrostatics and do very well and that you can do well enough for less if you are not as discerning or have other priorities. Although some folks just might be after bragging rights and want a Giga Watt Flux Capacitor, power to them.

post #1077 of 2231

Just wanted to get something straight...
You can use the e18 as a DAC only for android phones right???
If so could someone tell me how???
I wanted to get a DAC for my Note 3 to use with the fiio e12DIY...

post #1078 of 2231
Quote:
Originally Posted by akash neagi View Post
 

Just wanted to get something straight...
You can use the e18 as a DAC only for android phones right???
If so could someone tell me how???
I wanted to get a DAC for my Note 3 to use with the fiio e12DIY...

The E18 works fine with my laptop as well, running Windoze 7.

post #1079 of 2231

I get that but does it have a line out to use with another amp????
I found a thread where it said that the line out of the fiio has a low volume but i done see any line out options in the website....

From what I get does the analog 3,5mm input act as a line out as well???

post #1080 of 2231
Quote:
Originally Posted by akash neagi View Post
 

I get that but does it have a line out to use with another amp????
I found a thread where it said that the line out of the fiio has a low volume but i done see any line out options in the website....

From what I get does the analog 3,5mm input act as a line out as well???


If I'm understanding your question correctly, you can use the 3,5mm headphone output as a line out to another amp.

 

This is the setup I'm using now: DAP » E18 » amp » headphones


Edited by nway - 2/10/14 at 11:16am
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