Head-Fi.org › Forums › Misc.-Category Forums › Members' Lounge (General Discussion) › PC Enthusiast-Fi (PC Gaming/Hardware/Software/Overclocking)
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

PC Enthusiast-Fi (PC Gaming/Hardware/Software/Overclocking) - Page 450

post #6736 of 6749
Lol torrent 8.1, or tell him how Linux gaming is actually getting decent.
post #6737 of 6749
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by DonutDeflector View Post

Hello, one of my friends wants a PC for gaming. He already has a laptop for gaming but..... IT'S A LAPTOP! I made this list for him as he wants to build it himself. What should I keep and change? He wanted to spend $530 including Windows 8.1.

http://pcpartpicker.com/user/DonutDefector/saved/V8ZWGX

 

I wanted to reach out of my screen and ********** you for including a 750W 'good' powersupply with this rig. 

 

But the price...is not bad.. So I'll withold from it. I would have suggested a differnet one, but it would have been $5 saving, and non modular. So keep it. 

 

 

The Source 210 is on sale very often for $20

 

He is buying windows? My god, what a thing. I mean, I buy mine too but I rarely see people with lists featuruing it. 

 

 

I would down the ram to 4GB for now so that he can get a better graphics card. You can always add more RAM without making the previous investment go to waste. You can't do that for a GPU when you are on a budget. 

 

If he doesn't need space. Get an SSD, otherwise you can keep the HDD. It's just harder to get an SSD after you get a computer set up with an HDD. 

 

 

 

There are Intel G3258 (or equivalent) CPU and motherboard combos on sale for sub $100 often

 

http://slickdeals.net/f/7271342-msi-b85m-p33-matx-motherboard-intel-pentium-g3258-cpu-at-newegg-81-24-after-5-rebate-free-shipping?v=1

http://slickdeals.net/f/7263584-intel-pentium-unlocked-g3258-haswell-dual-core-processor-55-free-shipping

 

 

However initial reviews are indeed reporting the new AMD Athlon to be beating the **** out of the same MSRP (but regularly found cheaper) Pentium.

 

Up to you.

 

 

The FX 6300 is also on sale right now at the same price as the Athlon. Mobo cost should be the same. This should be a much better CPU than both above listed

 

 

 

It's just that shaving off money to not get crap components but get a great GPU matters to a desktop built for gaming. 

post #6738 of 6749
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by gopanthersgo1 View Post

Lol torrent 8.1, or tell him how Linux gaming is actually getting decent.

Getting decent. Not there yet. 

 

Don't ever let a newbie that wants to get into PC Gaming to play 'games' download and run Linux as his gaming rig. 

post #6739 of 6749
Quote:
Originally Posted by bowei006 View Post

Getting decent. Not there yet. 

Don't ever let a newbie that wants to get into PC Gaming to play 'games' download and run Linux as his gaming rig. 
no but let's look at it in 2 years, I feel like windows might finally start to have competition soon
post #6740 of 6749
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by gopanthersgo1 View Post


no but let's look at it in 2 years, I feel like windows might finally start to have competition soon

Nope. Not in two years

 

the problem with that idea is that Linux isn't a collective under a main corporation. It isn't competition but rather another choice for 'PC' users.

 

Linux can never be competition to Windows for this reason in the pure sense of corporate competition. It's rather an alternate choice that some are making.

 

but in terms of having the library power of Windows in two years? Even if the Big Thing from Valve came true and the steambox got full attention, Linux wouldn't be anywhere close in two years.

 

It has a lot of indie under its belt, but mainstream game adoption is very slow. 

 

Maybe 5+ years if Valve and other factors contribute vibrantly to its ecosystem. It could happen. Linux adoption in the corporate setting is growing rapidly (for good reason), but its kinda stagnant with consumers with analysts expecting it to drop unless more incentives happen to convert. Game and mainstream application support would be one of the main ones. And when I say mainstream. I literally mean all those professional desktop tools that only work on OSX and Windows

post #6741 of 6749
Quote:
Originally Posted by bowei006 View Post

Nope. Not in two years

the problem with that idea is that Linux isn't a collective under a main corporation. It isn't competition but rather another choice for 'PC' users.

Linux can never be competition to Windows for this reason in the pure sense of corporate competition. It's rather an alternate choice that some are making.

but in terms of having the library power of Windows in two years? Even if the Big Thing from Valve came true and the steambox got full attention, Linux wouldn't be anywhere close in two years.

It has a lot of indie under its belt, but mainstream game adoption is very slow. 

Maybe 5+ years if Valve and other factors contribute vibrantly to its ecosystem. It could happen. Linux adoption in the corporate setting is growing rapidly (for good reason), but its kinda stagnant with consumers with analysts expecting it to drop unless more incentives happen to convert. Game and mainstream application support would be one of the main ones. And when I say mainstream. I literally mean all those professional desktop tools that only work on OSX and Windows
I meant for the consumer market, and although it wont be used from the majority of people with nicer computers, its getting some hold. If a company would market netbooks for Linux like they do chromebooks there could easily start having more consumers with Linux as an incentive for developers. Also if more and more studios start adding Linux support it'll have a nicer library in a few years from triple A games. The new boarderlands coming out on release date with windows really excited me.
post #6742 of 6749
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by gopanthersgo1 View Post


I meant for the consumer market, and although it wont be used from the majority of people with nicer computers, its getting some hold. If a company would market netbooks for Linux like they do chromebooks there could easily start having more consumers with Linux as an incentive for developers. Also if more and more studios start adding Linux support it'll have a nicer library in a few years from triple A games. The new boarderlands coming out on release date with windows really excited me.

That bolded statement is the massive pro and massive con of Linux. 

 

The collective of main devs and people behind modern day Linux distros recognize this. There isn't a main corporate body that would have benefit, resources to do such a thing. There are various non-profits, but they are largely too divided, small, and without enough power to effect more change. 

 

 

And the part with studios adding more linux support is also a problem. They have little incentive to do so right now. Most major games that are AAAs have a bit of difficulty going to Linux due to the engines and code that are used. And not all use OpenGL which would make the porting a bit easier but not fully. 

post #6743 of 6749
Quote:
Originally Posted by bowei006 View Post
 

 

I wanted to reach out of my screen and ********** you for including a 750W 'good' powersupply with this rig. 

 

But the price...is not bad.. So I'll withold from it. I would have suggested a differnet one, but it would have been $5 saving, and non modular. So keep it. 

 

 

The Source 210 is on sale very often for $20

 

He is buying windows? My god, what a thing. I mean, I buy mine too but I rarely see people with lists featuruing it. 

 

 

I would down the ram to 4GB for now so that he can get a better graphics card. You can always add more RAM without making the previous investment go to waste. You can't do that for a GPU when you are on a budget. 

 

If he doesn't need space. Get an SSD, otherwise you can keep the HDD. It's just harder to get an SSD after you get a computer set up with an HDD. 

 

 

 

There are Intel G3258 (or equivalent) CPU and motherboard combos on sale for sub $100 often

 

http://slickdeals.net/f/7271342-msi-b85m-p33-matx-motherboard-intel-pentium-g3258-cpu-at-newegg-81-24-after-5-rebate-free-shipping?v=1

http://slickdeals.net/f/7263584-intel-pentium-unlocked-g3258-haswell-dual-core-processor-55-free-shipping

 

 

However initial reviews are indeed reporting the new AMD Athlon to be beating the **** out of the same MSRP (but regularly found cheaper) Pentium.

 

Up to you.

 

 

The FX 6300 is also on sale right now at the same price as the Athlon. Mobo cost should be the same. This should be a much better CPU than both above listed

 

 

 

It's just that shaving off money to not get crap components but get a great GPU matters to a desktop built for gaming. 

 

I could have sworn I put 4GB of ram and an R9 270 in there.... I must have deleted it or something.


Edited by DonutDeflector - Yesterday at 6:14 pm
post #6744 of 6749

 

Aw yea! Old laptop FTW!

post #6745 of 6749
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by DonutDeflector View Post
 

 

I could have sworn I put 4GB of ram and an R9 270 in there.... I must have deleted it or something.

If you shave a little more off. You can try for a 270X! The 760's price isn't low enough for a recommendation so there goes that. 

 

See if he wants to go for the 6300 FX or the Pentium. If he wants a pure gaming rig. Using the pentium will allow him to get a 270x

 

 

Otherwise, the 6300 FX is a pretty smart upgrade for no cost addition. (need to change motherboard as well of course)

post #6746 of 6749
Quote:
Originally Posted by bowei006 View Post
 

 

This is MUCH better than the Intel HD graphics option that SAGER provides for $850 laptops marketed as gaming laptops. 

 

The fact that Lenovo's lowest cost entry level option even has a 275 is wow and at $650-$680 (corporate discount)

 

 

The i5 mobility will handle without an issue for current physics. Physics optomizations in games arne't that good yet in the term and sense of CPU based physics calculations (I'm not talking to GPU based physics) but they aren't an issue. 

 

The 275 and 860 are pretty much the baseline dedciated gaming cards to get if you want to play games on a laptop. Not bad by any means. All most players are looking for is to get steady framerates. The 275M can deliver that without an issue. 

 

The 860M out performs the R9 M275 by a lot.

Sadly AMD doesn't have a R9 M280.

 

Honestly at that pricing, I would rather get a desktop instead.

 

One issue is the i5 being the low power variant and not the standard power variant.

Games are very un-optimised.

 

The physics end up being scaled down by a lot to compensate for current hardware power.

Or it's so un-optimised it becomes horrible.

My old i7-2860QM with 6770M was barely able to handle the physics on Alice Madness Returns.

When StarCraft 2 first came out, all gaming hardware was bottlenecked by the physics.

 

When you look at the fidelity of simulation physics, you will then realise that game physics is nothing.

 

Unless you are able to max out every game or play them on ultra, the physics would probably be scaled down a lot, enough for the i5 to handle. (Example: High graphics = more particles = more physics)

 

If you were using the low powered i5 with a 980M it would definitely bottleneck the system.

But with a R9 M275 it won't.

 

Apart from physics, there many other things like parallelism, artificial intelligence (A* path finding, etc...), environmental effects, dynamic lights and shadows, etc...

post #6747 of 6749
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by lbbef View Post
 

 

The 860M out performs the R9 M275 by a lot.

Sadly AMD doesn't have a R9 M280.

 

Honestly at that pricing, I would rather get a desktop instead.

 

One issue is the i5 being the low power variant and not the standard power variant.

Games are very un-optimised.

 

The physics end up being scaled down by a lot to compensate for current hardware power.

Or it's so un-optimised it becomes horrible.

My old i7-2860QM with 6770M was barely able to handle the physics on Alice Madness Returns.

When StarCraft 2 first came out, all gaming hardware was bottlenecked by the physics.

 

When you look at the fidelity of simulation physics, you will then realise that game physics is nothing.

 

Unless you are able to max out every game or play them on ultra, the physics would probably be scaled down a lot, enough for the i5 to handle. (Example: High graphics = more particles = more physics)

 

If you were using the low powered i5 with a 980M it would definitely bottleneck the system.

But with a R9 M275 it won't.

 

Apart from physics, there many other things like parallelism, artificial intelligence (A* path finding, etc...), environmental effects, dynamic lights and shadows, etc...

 

 

Water is wet. 

 

The idea wasn't that the 860M outperforms the 275M. It was rather a $680 laptop having a graphics card like the 275M when $850 laptops marketed as gaming class sport Intel HD GPUs. 

 

Again. 

 

It wasn't get a desktop. The whole discussion was on laptops and performance on laptops. It would be like going to an enviromental conference on altneratives to CFCs and making a speech about 'Just using CFC's when the whole topic was clearly on an alternative. 

 

We understand that a desktop is cool for $700 and that most would like one. That wasn't the topic or point on hand. 

 

 

Ibbef, I recommend you focus on the topic on hand. The comment with the i5 being a mobility edition instead of a desktop edition is again. Ignoring the topic on hand. The whole discussion has mobility CPUs and GPUs in mind. 

post #6748 of 6749
Quote:
Originally Posted by bowei006 View Post
 

 

 

Water is wet. 

 

The idea wasn't that the 860M outperforms the 275M. It was rather a $680 laptop having a graphics card like the 275M when $850 laptops marketed as gaming class sport Intel HD GPUs. 

 

Again. 

 

It wasn't get a desktop. The whole discussion was on laptops and performance on laptops. It would be like going to an enviromental conference on altneratives to CFCs and making a speech about 'Just using CFC's when the whole topic was clearly on an alternative. 

 

We understand that a desktop is cool for $700 and that most would like one. That wasn't the topic or point on hand. 

 

 

Ibbef, I recommend you focus on the topic on hand. The comment with the i5 being a mobility edition instead of a desktop edition is again. Ignoring the topic on hand. The whole discussion has mobility CPUs and GPUs in mind. 

 

Maybe I wasn't that clear:

The idea wasn't that the 860M outperforms the R9 M275.

The idea was that the R9 M275 shouldn't be considered the baseline.

If there was a R9 M280, it would probably be on the same level as the 860M in terms of performance and be considered the baseline.

 

My conclusion is as such:

Mobile gaming is expensive. Unless you got a very good reason why you want to play games on the go, you should get a desktop for gaming instead.

Or you play games just for the sake of playing and don't care about fidelity etc...

If you don't have a budget to get a decent gaming laptop (860M), play less games and study or work harder.

 

By the way, I was not comparing the mobility i5 with the desktop i5.

I was comparing the low powered variant with the standard powered variant.

There is no comparison at all. The only mobile chips able to match the desktop i5s in performance are the mobile quad i7s (i7-4700MQ+ | i7-4700HQ+)

Low power i5-4210U: 15W TDP | 2 cores | 4 threads | 1.7GHz > 2.7GHz | HD 4400 | $281

Standard power i5-4210M: 37W TDP | 2 cores | 4 threads | 2.6GHz > 3.2GHz | HD 4600 | $225

post #6749 of 6749
Quote:
Originally Posted by bowei006 View Post

If you shave a little more off. You can try for a 270X! The 760's price isn't low enough for a recommendation so there goes that. 

See if he wants to go for the 6300 FX or the Pentium. If he wants a pure gaming rig. Using the pentium will allow him to get a 270x


Otherwise, the 6300 FX is a pretty smart upgrade for no cost addition. (need to change motherboard as well of course)

He would explode if he got the 270X!
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
Head-Fi.org › Forums › Misc.-Category Forums › Members' Lounge (General Discussion) › PC Enthusiast-Fi (PC Gaming/Hardware/Software/Overclocking)