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AKG K702 65th Anniversary Edition - Page 202

post #3016 of 3188
Quote:
Originally Posted by tdockweiler View Post
 

Ok, these are some crappy photos but my lighting sucks and so does my camera.

 

This is the memory foam in AKG Anniversary pads. It's not hard at all and definitely "real" memory foam, but not as hard as the Tempur Pedic kind. Exact same size as a CD!

 

 

 

This piece is underneath the memory foam itself. It's a round piece that goes all the way around. You can see it underneath the "clips" of the Annie pad. On the Q701 it's just lighter foam and that's it.

This stuff is much harder and my guess is what seals in the bass. So both this and the memory foam itself.

 

I couldn't remove the entire circle unfortunately. I wasn't planning on destroying the pads but I did anyway.

 

That yellow foam looks identical to what I found within Hifiman's pleather earpads, which was not really REAL memory foam, more like heat-activated foam.

post #3017 of 3188

Anyone know where I can order new foam O-rings for the Annies? Lately I noticed that I may have mismatched ones... cause the sound absorption is noticeably different in one ear than the other.

 

http://www.head-fi.org/t/564427/k701-vs-k702-vs-q701-which-one-considering-recabling-among-other-things/15#post_7755190

 

I think mine might have different ones cause one side is more "muffled sounding. I tried switching the foam rings and noticed that the sound difference was consistent. Whichever side had the more "muffled" sounding ring had the less airy sound... even when wore them backwards to listen... it was consistent on one side.

 

EDIT: Anyone also able to provide me with the part number for the foam ring??


Edited by joebobbilly - 9/12/13 at 9:24am
post #3018 of 3188
Quote:
Originally Posted by chicolom View Post
 

I can't follow your logic.  Your saying the depth, the angle, and the "hard foam" are changing the signature:

 

I didn't say it WAS and there is no way to prove anything we say. The only thing the angle does IMO is fool the brain and then give you a little more air inside the pads perhaps. I also think that angle and the extra distance helps the mids not sound so forward. Since the Q701 pads don't compress as much that really helps retain the airy sound, sound clarity and treble. 

 

So basically what I was saying is that if you had as much air inside the K712 and Annie pads as the Q701 pads and your ears were the exact same distance away they would sound closer to the Q701's sound yet still have extra bass.

 

I really don't think it's JUST the memory foam causing the decreased treble. I think the only reason the Annie and K712 have less treble is due to the distance and not JUST due to that extra bass and warmth. I'm not buying it that it all just because of the extra bass and something else has to decrease in volume. If you hear the K601 pads you'll probably agree.

 

So I think it would have been easy to have bass like found on the Annie with a standard Q701 pad WITH some internal modifications. The Q701 foam actually feels much harder than Annie foam that has warmed up.

 

As for depth, I already said the K712 has deeper pads than the Anniversary, but your saying that doesn't count because it's not the exact same depth as the Q701?   So what.  They're two different pads - they're not going to be exact. With both the Q701 and K712 my ears barely touch on either pad, while they do touch with the Anniversary pads.  That's close enough.  Regardless of the depth, both the K712 and Anniversary pads affect the signature the same way.  What's different between them is how intimate the sound is Vs. how distant they sound.  That's basically it. 

 

I don't think the difference in depth between the two is enough for there to be much of an audible change. I imagine the K712 pads also compress a lot especially when warm. It totally makes sense why the K712 would be more distant and less forward sounding. I think maybe it's due to your ears being slightly further away from the drivers than with the Annie pads.

 

The K712 pads don't look that much deeper and they still compress and are flat. My point was that any pad with more air between the driver and your ear is going to have more treble and a clearer sound. The difference in sound between the K712 and Annie pads is probably very very subtle. Then who knows is different inside the K712 pads.

 

 

As for flat vs angled pads, I've worn the Q701 with the angled pads flipped in reverse and it doesn't really change the signature (the imaging changes a little, but that's not what we're talking about here).  Some people use them with the pads flipped the wrong way all the time! 

 

Yep, it's because they still have the same amount of air between your ear and the driver. Same treble quantity.

 

So from my experience neither the depth or angle really affect the signature that much.  They DO affect the presentation and imaging. 

 

You should try some K601 pads and you would probably disagree. I know the K601 pads are softer and it's not a fair comparison to Q701 pads. K601 pads due to the depth (IMO) give you more shouty mids, smaller and less airy soundstage and less treble. The sound is more muffled/congested yet it's not any warmer! Oh and it's also smoother with harsh/fatiguing tracks with forward upper mids/treble. Weird. I already mentioned this but with Q701 pads you get more warmth/bass, less forward low mids and still get that airy soundstage.

 

So I think Annie pads are probably like K601 pads but with better bass.

 

I wonder what FLAT Q701 pads would sound like? I used to think the Q701 pads were bad but they're actually way better than K400 and K601 pads.

 

The only thing left is that harder foam behind the pad.  Maybe that does something, maybe it doesn't (it's a layer behind the pad, so it can't do that much sealing).  Regardless, I still say it's 95% the memory foam material changing the sound.

 

You could be right, but who knows? I think with modified Q701 pads (at the factory!) you can get an even better sound and no loss of bass from the Annie sound.

 

Also..here's a thought. Why do you think there are "vents" on the baffle behind the clips? I wondered this myself.

My new K400 pads on the back have no holes (no leakage) on the clip areas and give me more bass than the old K400 pads that have foam exposed. The new K400 pad clip "holes" are just plastic and seal everything better.

 

 

BTW, did you see my impressions on the K712?  I said it was darker/less airy and had less upper mids than the Anniversary.  The K712 is further away in sound from the Q701 than the Anniversary is (signature-wise).  Do you still think you'd prefer the K712 over the Anniversary??

 

I would have to hear it for myself. I did read all your impressions. I don't know if the differences are great enough for me to like it. The main reasons I don't love the Annie is that it's darker and less airy than even my HD-650. Yet it's sound is too forward in some areas like the low mids (K601 pads cause the same thing to occur, but without adding warmth). If the K712 pushed things back a tad I might prefer that sound. I don't know for sure if the reason I dislike the Annie is due to it's upper mids like I originally thought.

 

I think a headphone can be very full sounding in the mids and have very good bass yet not be as dark as the Annie. AKG just needs to experiment with pads more! The HD-650 I have has very full mids, good treble and still has some airiness left somewhere. That's quite an accomplishment! It's very forgiving though and it's upper mids are not as forward as the Q701 though. HD-650 doesn't sound dark to me, but very close. Smooth sounding and a little colored, but duh. It's quite forgiving of harsh material probably due to it's upper mids and treble.

 

I wonder if the K712 is darker and bassier than the HD-650? BTW I think the Annie might have been even warmer/darker than my HD-650!

 

 

post #3019 of 3188
Quote:
Originally Posted by jerg View Post
 

 

That yellow foam looks identical to what I found within Hifiman's pleather earpads, which was not really REAL memory foam, more like heat-activated foam.

 

I don't know what "real" memory foam is like.

I just know that when you press down on this stuff is takes awhile for it to come back to it's original shape.

You can compress it down to nothing and it will slowly expand back. It's definitely not hard at all.

 

I bet AKG could come up with an over-stuffed pad that had as much depth as the Q701 pads when compressed.

They could maybe use a combination of different types of foams inside.

 

I want an HD-650 killer!!

 

Maybe AKG could experiment with the harder memory foam that doesn't compress as much.

Some memory foam seems to turn into a brick during winter. I wonder if the Annie pads will? Doubt it.

post #3020 of 3188

Since I don't own any AKG's, I can't say for sure, but dampening vents (or holes) on the underside of a pad (i.e. Beyerdynamic velour pads) help tame the treble significantly (jergpads for the HE-400 and HE-500 for example). I'm not sure if the vents you are referring to are what I am picturing, but exposing the foam on the driver side of the pad should decrease treble, I would think.

post #3021 of 3188
Quote:
Originally Posted by tdockweiler View Post

 

The main reasons I don't love the Annie is that it's darker and less airy than even my HD-650. Yet it's sound is too forward in some areas like the low mids (K601 pads cause the same thing to occur, but without adding warmth). If the K712 pushed things back a tad I might prefer that sound. I don't know for sure if the reason I dislike the Annie is due to it's upper mids like I originally thought.

 

I wonder if the K712 is darker and bassier than the HD-650? BTW I think the Annie might have been even warmer/darker than my HD-650!

 

 

Well, if the Anniversary is darker and warmer than your HD650, than the K712 will be for sure since it's darker than the Anniversary.  The K712 does push things back a little (less intimate), which was one of the main reasons I bought it.  This is 100% due to the deeper pads, as when I put the Anniversary pads on the K712 it then sounds more intimate than the Anniversary due to its fuller signature.

post #3022 of 3188

I must be a real nerd if I just posted a 10 page commentary on headphone pads. Ugh. I need to get another hobby!

I guess I'm just all for perfecting my idea of the best sounding Q701 variation. I'll hear it maybe sometime. Q701 is good enough.

A little more low bass without much else changing is ALL I need.

 

It really is interesting how pads an alter a headphone's sound so dramatically. It's sometimes enough to ruin the sound of a headphone with the wrong pads.

 

My darker K400 EP is pretty awful with Q701 pads but my LP (more trebly) sounds great with them.

 

Can't wait to try those Gel pads. I just asked the parts guy at AKG about them. I imagine it will be 6 months before we see them here in the USA!

Took me nearly 3 months to get Annie pads.

 

OK, off to listen to my Q701 for once. I haven't listening to that in nearly a week. That must be a record.

Actually I used them for Zelda: A link to the past on the SNES. Felt like listening to speakers :biggrin:

 

It's not bad with my new O2, but Micro Amp is way better with the Q701/Annie. Not because it's colored. I actually think it's more transparent.

Yep, I said it..I need to find a Micro Amp killer for under $500. Nothing too warm or dark, but good with everything. Maybe I can try the Asgard 2 sometime.

Not a fan of the Asgard1.

post #3023 of 3188
Quote:
Originally Posted by Thujone View Post
 

Since I don't own any AKG's, I can't say for sure, but dampening vents (or holes) on the underside of a pad (i.e. Beyerdynamic velour pads) help tame the treble significantly (jergpads for the HE-400 and HE-500 for example). I'm not sure if the vents you are referring to are what I am picturing, but exposing the foam on the driver side of the pad should decrease treble, I would think.

 

That is weird. I would have thought it'd be the complete opposite with the AKG headphones.

I just know that with my K400 EP pads they are less open (totally closed off vents) and are much darker. Bass seems a little more present on the EP but not by much. The K400 LP, K601 and Q701 pads all have the foam exposed in the back around the "vents". I think the Q701 pads have more bass than K601 pads because the foam is harder.

 

Thought when the pads are clicked in place they're basically 75% closed off I would think.

post #3024 of 3188

Can anyone please tell how the Annie does classical (solo) piano, chamber music and big orchestral music like Mahler and Shostakovich?

 

Any thoughts? thanks!!

 

-edit- I guess what I really want to know is would it be worthy to own this HF besides my K501, considering I mainly listen to the genre's I mentioned


Edited by Quinto - 9/16/13 at 2:42am
post #3025 of 3188

I'm also interested to know how the Annies compare with the Shure SRH1840

post #3026 of 3188
The Annie is a fantastic all rounder. I don't see them doing ANY genre any injustice.
post #3027 of 3188

I just jumped on a pair of Annies. A 3rd party seller was selling a single pair for $365 yesterday and I couldn't pass it up! I'm hoping that these fit somewhere between the DT880 and the X1. I love the bass on the X1, but they could definitely be a little overpowering at times. The DT880's have the same issue with treble. I'm shooting to have the bass of the X1 (though slightly less quantity) and the highs of the DT880 (though slightly less metallic sounding). Hopefully these will be a good match!

post #3028 of 3188
The Annies have less treble than the X1 and DT880...
post #3029 of 3188
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mad Lust Envy View Post

The Annies have less treble than the X1 and DT880...

 

Well, I'm sure I'll still enjoy them. Not sure where I had interpreted them as having better treble than the X1... oh well. Do you mean that the treble doesn't extend as well or that they are more laid back like the HD600/580?

post #3030 of 3188
They're more laid back/less emphasized/smoother.
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