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The diary entries of a little girl in her 30s! ~ Part 2 - Page 418  

post #6256 of 21760

 

Now that would make a great avatar. Add it screaming DEATH TO HEAD-FI and it would be perfect

post #6257 of 21760
Quote:
Originally Posted by DigitalFreak View Post

 

 

Now that would make a great avatar. Add it screaming DEATH TO HEAD-FI and it would be perfect

 

Pretty sure jgray already made it his avatar.

post #6258 of 21760
Quote:
Originally Posted by 28980 View Post

A bit out of the blue, but would someone like to explain in layman's terms the difference between dynamic, electrostatic, and planar magnetic drivers to me? I tried reading the innerfidelity article on orthos and that just when whoooooooooosh.

Dynamic or "moving coil":

A fixed stationary magnet produces a permanent static magnetic field. Diaphragm is attached to a coil of wire situated within the static magnetic field. As a signal passes through the coil of wire the electromagnetic field of the coil moves against the static magnetic field and in turn moves the diaphragm, producing sound.

 

Electrostatic:

Thin, charged diaphragm is suspended between two electrodes(perforated metal plates). The signal applied to the electrodes sets up an electric field, which depending on polarity attracts the diaphragm to one or other of the plates. The moment of the diaphragm produces sound waves (hence the perforations in the electrodes). The extremely thin and light diaphragm and lack of heavy moving metal bits(ie, voice coil) gives electrostats a very good upper frequency extension, much of the distortion is in inaudible regions of the audio spectrum as well as allowing the diaphragm to respond very rapidly to changing frequencies.

 

Orthodynamic or "planar magnetic":

A thin metal film or film with a metal wire inlay is suspended in a highly uniform permanent magnetic field and acts as as the diaphragm. The electrical signal is applied to the metal film, which moves against the stationary magnetic field. Technically only a full metal film is a ribbon driver and a wire embedded diaphragm is a planar magnetic. As the driving force acts over a large fraction of the diaphragm there are less resonance artefacts compared to dynamics. Like an Electrostat, the diaphragm is very light an results in similarly excellent high frequency response and low recovery time between moments.

post #6259 of 21760
One more:
post #6260 of 21760
Quote:
Originally Posted by MuppetFace View Post

 

I don't mind being the one to come up with themes for the playlists, but if you guys would rather change it up every week or two that's fine as well. Only problem with that I foresee is not everyone wanting to be in that position or being around all the time.

  • Artist - Title; youtube link
  • Whatever text you associate with your song
  • Larger theme that MuppetFace decides

 

smile.gif

 

Let's hope err'body wants to participate all day err'day. I guess that should be it. All that's needed now is for you to make up a theme and off we go.

post #6261 of 21760
Being a non-anime thread reader, I just got done reading the conversation MF had with a couple of the posters that someone linked here.

That's exactly the type of conversation that I find myself having with "objectivist" zealots on other forums that I've mentioned once or twice about here in this thread. They basically say that "O2 is the best amp/dac you can get, nothing can be better, only just as good." Yet they don't really support their argument with any evidence except "flat FR curve, math, nwavguy".

However, I always thought that the reason I couldn't have a conversation with them was because I was inexperienced in the ways of amps/dacs. Seeing MF struggle with those guys completely shutting down all her experience has opened my eyes. These people don't WANT to have a discussion. They just want to preach and feel superior...

For a fun fact, this guy "b1o2r3i4s5" has talked about how he wanted to "build his first amp, an O2" which leads me to believe that he's pretty much got no idea what other amps sound like...
Edited by compoopers - 2/18/13 at 3:08pm
post #6262 of 21760
Quote:
Originally Posted by ardgedee View Post

Elaborating on what I wrote yesterday: It's not a one-or-the-other thing, they're complementary hobbies. I like gadgets generally, and I like music generally, so of course I'm going to like music gadgets. I'm not going to avoid talking about audio hardware for fear it will distract me from music appreciation.

 

If anything, having a lifelong fascination with both music and gadgets is complementary. Being able to appreciate how the voicing and technology of a given system affects how I perceive the music has affected how I enjoy music.

Quote:
Originally Posted by MuppetFace View Post

Yeah, I tend to agree with this. Though I must admit, the fixation on gear can detract from just sitting back and enjoying music at times.

 

The best analogue I can compare it to is photography. People can love gears and love the way that certain lenses render certain flaws, or they can chase after the very best in terms of definition and clarity (pixel peepers and the like). But I find that the people who are most fixated on the gear tend to take rather artificial photos. (ie: All their photos seem to give off the impression that they are trying to show off their techniques with high key lighting or ultra-sharp contrast.)

 

One of my favourite lenses is this lens originally made for CCTV cameras and adapted for use on my Sony NEX. It's a horribly flawed lens that causes light bleed and makes everything seem like a Sofia Coppola movie at night. The headphone equivalent for me would be like a T50RP or something lol.

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by MuppetFace View Post

Also you absorb some substances very well directly through the lining of your bowels, which is why some drug addicts will "plug" to get their fix. I get the feeling that these people are getting a rush both from the sensation of the act, but also because they're getting a "direct shot" of caffeine. I suppose it's less dangerous than mainlining it LOL.

 

This is also why may people stupid die from alcohol poisoning.

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by jgray91 View Post

One more:

 

I feel like this could be made into an amusing animation.

post #6263 of 21760
Quote:
Originally Posted by compoopers View Post

For a fun fact, this guy "b1o2r3i4s5" has talked about how he wanted to "build his first amp, an O2" which leads me to believe that he's pretty much got no idea what other amps sound like...

The O2 just happens to be a nice first amp to build if you're already a confident DIY circuit builder. I don't think you can judge a persons character based on what they pick to build for a first amp. Boris is now making a B22 having had some fun with the O2 design.

post #6264 of 21760

I just finished reading MF's exchange with boris in the anime thread. I had a similar exchange with another member of the O2 religion yesterday that culminated in the shutting down of the X3 thread. The guy was asking for the moon (Tera Player/DX100 performance), but for $300, in a product that was meant to appeal more to a broader consumer base. At the end he finally admitted that it was caused by the O2. I then proceeded to rage quit.

 

http://www.head-fi.org/t/528916/the-fiio-x3-thread-update-project-back-on-read-the-first-post-for-information/3570#post_9173354

 

Start there and read the next 2 pages.

 

TLDR:

 

 

 

Quote:

Originally Posted by eke2k6 View Post

This is getting annoying. People wonder why manufacturers don't typically accept customer feedback, and this is it. If you're all already whining about a product that isn't even on the market yet, then what's the incentive for Fiio to continue to do what they've done in the past?

 

Their main philosophy is to provide the best experience to their customers, giving them the best hardware within certain price constraints.

 

This reminds me of a lesson I learned early in my childhood, perfectly illustrated by this story: http://www.experienceproject.com/stories/Am-Through-With-Trying-To-Please-Everyone/1214451

 

So, quit bitchin, and let Fiio continue to provide products that will prove useful to their intended market. If you want something that performs like a DX100, go buy a DX100.

 

End rant

 

 

 

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gorillaz View Post

well Thanks God I am my own boss and a Big businessman as you mentioned and I can afford some of the things I want! and did you read how this discussion started and what's has been talked about in the last posts? and if you travel and camp why you just don't take your laptop with you, we have the opportunity to exchange ideas with Fiio and you come up with wanting to have most of you library with hi-rez albums included in the a budget portable dap  and I can't comment that focusing in the SQ would be better?

 

so it's impossible to have a good dap for less than $600-$700, I see why you are not your own boss nor a business owner!

 

 

Quote:

Originally Posted by eke2k6 View Post

 

 

You know what, it seems you don't understand Fiio's philosophy. Let me help with that

 

How I see it, they create a product lineup, with each one at a different price point. At each point, they look at what they can/can't accomplish within that budget, and do market research to discern what the consumers need the most. The X3 was designed to take on the ipod, by better overall SQ, while trying to maintain Apple's magical UI. The component choices are dictated by price, above all else. When you decide on - for instance- a DAC, you design almost everything around it, like the power components, capacitors, and the amp chip to some extent. In other words, schiit adds up quickly.

 

The key here is the business model. I sincerely doubt the company would change something like that because of a few outliers.

 

I haven't even glanced twice at the Tera Player because I see it as a glorified ipod shuffle. The DX100 is a buggy cement block, and the AK100 is just expensive. Fiio has done a great job in the past of making affordable gateway drugs into this maddening hobby, all without "help" from you all. I'm also sure they've made a suitable profit from it, or they wouldn't be in business.

 

Leave them alone, or start your own company. If you find that magic combination, I may be your third customer (the first two would be guinea pigs).

 

 

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gorillaz View Post

can you all undestand is just an opinion, and I am going to requote my quote for you

 

so eke2k6 it's impossible to come up with a magic combination to come up with an excellent dap for around $300 without making any profit, I see why you are not your own boss nor a business owner!

 

do you know something about the O2 and its designer?

 

I wonder also who invented the Mont Blanc E12?

 

I see that you know a lot about how to run a business, but do you actually own one and  know to manufacture and sell products? or you are like the fan who watches all the games of his team and then thinks he can be a coach?

 

 

Quote:

Originally Posted by eke2k6 View Post

 

Don't talk to me about "owning a business." There is a stark difference between owning a business, and running a successful one.

 

I was the president of my undergrad university's student programming association. I had a massive budget every year, and it was my job to allocate those resources to different committees, all of which I supervised. My own pet committee was the International Committee, since I'm a Jamaican studying in the US. I brought talent from all over the world to perform at my university, managed their expenses, as well as actually paying them.

 

I know about nwavguy, and I occasionally refer to his blog when I need resources outside of this community. I really don't see why you brought him up, or the E12.

 

You're the one being unreasonable about the costs of a product. Nwavguy could do what he did because his only role was the actual design of the product. He didn't need to make a profit, nor did he have to deal with distribution, or any of the like. If you really understood "running a business" you'd know that the cost of the product reflects everything the company has to do to get the item in your hands, not just the design.

 

Like kova4 brought up, Apple can do what they do because they already have massive resources, and they basically monopolize entire factories to get their products made. I'm not even upset at products like the DX100 or Tera Player because I know that their products are, despite popular belief on this site, very niche and boutique in nature. They have to be at their price points to justify the effort.

 

Like I said, the only way for you to have any credibility in the matter is for you to come up with your own Sabre 9018 oriented DAP, and bring it to market for the $300 you've proposed. Just know that the PCB alone alone already cost 1/3 of your budget

 

(http://www.ebay.com/itm/ES9018-32bit-Audio-DAC-PCB-kit-/330849729368?pt=US_Amplifier_Parts_Components&hash=item4d082e3b58)

 

 

This is where I realized what was going on:

 

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gorillaz View Post

so JDS Labs and the others companies are not making a profit with the O2 and still selling an amp at an affordable price that rivals in SQ against ones that sell for thousands of $

 

once again

Can you all understand that someone else was asking for more features and better SQ for the little money and I said if you were not asking for those all features maybe he could concentrate on the SQ and thus lowering the price, so it was just an Opinion just like you all have one.

 

did I say hey Fiio make this dap like this and that, did I? no, I said it would be a better idea to make a dap with less unnecessary features but better SQ.

 

Do you all understand!!!! lol

 

 

 

Quote:

Originally Posted by eke2k6 View Post

 

The misconception is that you think replacing a tiny part here and there, and subtracting a little here and there will keep the prices about even.

 

No.

 

I mentioned earlier that once you change the major component, everything else changes, including the very circuitry. The prices on the correct components go up as well.

 

"Th O2 rivals amps costing thousands of dollars"??? Ah, ok. I think that sentence alone cleared up everything for me, as far as your mindset goes. 

 

It's been fun.

 

Eke out beerchug.gif

 

 

 

 

So, it's virtually impossible to argue with them. It's a waste of energy, and will only needlessly accelerate the development of Carpel-Tunnel. It's best just to leave the conversation the moment you discover what they're really saying.

post #6265 of 21760

I just pan-fried about a dozen Korean, Thai, Peruvian, and jalapeño peppers in olive oil with some garlic and salt, and am eating it as a tapenade on toasted naan.

post #6266 of 21760

eke: Notice that most of the people who argue in this way are university students. I remember how it was in university with friends and friends of friends arguing that way about their preferred choice of religion or politics. Everyone thinks they are right and everyone else is wrong.

post #6267 of 21760

Yep, I walked in after that exchange and typed out a page long retort aimed at the dude you banged heads with then decided I better not post it and avoid the wrath of the head-fi mods. In the end I just posted the following....

 

 

Quote:Yours truly

Oh brother, I step out for a few days and wind up reading 10 pages of ranting arguing unrealistic demands and a lot of complaining about a product that hasn't even hit the market yet. On top of all that one dude attacks an online buddy of mine for trying to talk sense into him and if that wasn't enough the same dude then brings up the O2 and rudely taunts the rest of the thread about being a business owner and having no boss. I could punch some serious holes into the last few statements made by such individual but why bother. It's not really worth the effort after all.

 


Ladies and gentlemen, how about you all stop feeding the trolls and start answering by hitting the report button and letting Currawong deal with the undesirables. I can guarantee you he is quite good at such a task. I know if said individual harasses me about my post that's exactly what I will be doing. Now can we please get back to the X3 please.

A couple of posts later Currawong shut the thread down and recommended someone start a new thread. I understand where Currawong was coming from but it still bites an amusing and informative thread was shut down because of one bad apple. Good one on you eke2k6 for giving him a piece of your mind. I'm starting to wonder if the Lord Mordo troglodytes have their own special club. Seems like they've been popping up in force more and more all over the various audio boards annoying everyone. I like what I've read about the O2 and the fact Mordo showed off some of the big names known for overpricing their gear but the O2 is not the final answer to anything. By the way what ever happened to Lord Mordo? He hasn't updated his blog in ages and has been nowhere to be found in ages. I'm surprised he hasn't bothered to at least make the occasional appearance and amuse himself by stirring up his troglodyte hoard.

post #6268 of 21760
Quote:
Originally Posted by DigitalFreak View Post

Yep, I walked in after that exchange and typed out a page long retort aimed at the dude you banged heads with then decided I better not post it and avoid the wrath of the head-fi mods. In the end I just posted the following....

 

 

A couple of posts later Currawong shut the thread down and recommended someone start a new thread. I understand where Currawong was coming from but it still bites an amusing and informative thread was shut down because of one bad apple. Good one on you eke2k6 for giving him a piece of your mind. I'm starting to wonder if the Lord Mordo troglodytes have their own special club. Seems like they've been popping up in force more and more all over the various audio boards annoying everyone. I like what I've read about the O2 and the fact Mordo showed off some of the big names known for overpricing their gear but the O2 is not the final answer to anything. By the way what ever happened to Lord Mordo? He hasn't updated his blog in ages and has been nowhere to be found in ages. I'm surprised he hasn't bothered to at least make the occasional appearance and amuse himself by stirring up his troglodyte hoard.

I just unsubbed. I don't want email updates about that sort of thing, I wanted updates on the X3.

post #6269 of 21760

A lot of people did. Who wants to read someone being overly stubborn and intentionally picking fights.

post #6270 of 21760
Quote:
Originally Posted by Currawong View Post

eke: Notice that most of the people who argue in this way are university students. I remember how it was in university with friends and friends of friends arguing that way about their preferred choice of religion or politics. Everyone thinks they are right and everyone else is wrong.

 

I'm a student, and I find this offensive  smile.gif

 

I understand what you're saying though. It seems that the ability to distinguish between opinion/fact, and knowing that there are gray areas between right and wrong, is one of the last hurdles one has to overcome before reaching maturity.

 

DF, that wasn't even close to giving him a piece of my mind. I wanted to say some things, but I remembered the forum rules...rolleyes.gif

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