Head-Fi.org › Forums › Equipment Forums › Portable Headphones, Earphones and In-Ear Monitors › Cosmic Ears - new CIEM company with great prices (including Hybrid designs!)
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

Cosmic Ears - new CIEM company with great prices (including Hybrid designs!) - Page 223

post #3331 of 4463
Quote:
Originally Posted by PhilGT View Post
 

A little note on the fit of a custom in-ear monitor, I will cover our process on creating a good fit, the reasons why occasionally a good fit is not achieved and lastly the impact of having an incorrect fit.

 

The most crucial area for the fit is the ear canal and as result this is the area we focus on the most. During the impression detailing stage we take great care in not touching the thickness and shape of the ear canal, we take the length down and smooth off the tip only. The impression is dipped in immersion wax prior to the mould being made, this is to smooth the impression resulting in a smoother shell, we use our method of “double tip dip” when dipping in the wax, this means we dip the canal only in the wax first and then the whole shell a second time, this gives the canal area a double wax coating. When the shell is complete and is in the final finishing stage we take extra care not to over polish the canal as this removes material and reduces the size. A final measure is at the QA stage where we compare the canal on the shell to the canal on the impression.

 

Fit issues do happen and can happen for a number of reasons. 

  • The most common reason is the quality of the initial ear impression, this is why we are very strict when it comes to accepting impressions and will reject impressions we feel are not good enough quality, we copy and duplicate the impression for the final monitor, if the impression is wrong then so will the final monitor, it is impossible for us to guess an individuals ear. 
  • Seasonal and illness. An individuals ear size can change at different parts of the year (providing one lives in an area with seasonal changes) a colder climate and the ear size will be slightly larger as the muscle contracts, warmer and it is slightly smaller as the muscle expands due to the warmer temperature. If you wear a ring on your finger, the ring is much tighter the warmer the body as the finger is bigger, go to a cold climate, like Sweden in the winter :-), and the ring will be less tight as the finger will be smaller. This seasonal/temperature change as well as location is something we also consider when creating a monitor. We have also experienced people taking ear impressions when they are ill, even just a cold, this is not advisable as we have seen ear shapes and sizes alter due to illness.
  • People have different ideas on how a monitor should fit and this varies. For example, person A likes to have a tight snug fit that will ensure a great seal and sound. Person B likes to have a more relaxed fit to enable them to insert the monitor more easily. If Person B has a monitor made that is perfect for person A they would say the fit is wrong as it feels too tight and uncomfortable, on the flip side if Person A had a monitor made that is perfect for Person B then they would say the fit is poor and has a bad seal.
  • Mistakes or over polishing can happen in the manufacturing stage but we have many measures in place to eliminate this as discussed above.

 

The bottom line in all this is that fit issues do occur due to one or more of the above, we take special care and attention to achieve a correct fit, however at the end of the day it will always be down to the individual, this is why we have a free re-fit warranty of all monitors as we want all customers to have the best fit possible.

 

The last think I want to discuss is the impact of the fit. A bad fit results in either the monitor being uncomfortable (example Person B with Person A fit) and/or poor seal. A poor seal impacts the low frequencies and the effect is actually quite astonishing. I carried out a little test and below is the resulting FR of the test. 

  • I measured a monitor using a good fit (this is in green line) and you can see healthy low frequencies. 
  • I then broke the seal with a 0.3mm hole, this is a very small hole but the impact can be seen on the red line. From 2Khz up there is no difference. The most astonishing result is the impact of the low frequencies from 300hz and down, this monitor would have very little bass impact.

 

This is why it is so important, whatever earphones, headphones, customs you are using, that the fit is good.

 

I hope this info is of use to people, contact me for any questions.

 

 


This is exactly what happened with my right piece, it fits comfortably but it seems that the seal is missing or rather not as good as the left piece resulting less BOOM.

I had to force turn it clockwise to get the same result as the left piece.

The left piece is perfect in comfort and seal, it snug just fine.

So what should I do Phil? I think the problem is the length and thickness at the back of the canal.

post #3332 of 4463

Has anyone paired their BA4F with the Pico Power? :0

Thinking about buying one but worried if the amp would only provide a marginal increase.

post #3333 of 4463

Alright, it's 2.30 in the morning (1.30 because of DST)

and this is the solution I've found:Plastic wrap

I tried wrapping around 50cm of it and the result is phenomenal, now it seals great.

The best thing is, you don't void the warranty nor damage anything.

At least I now know that the problem with the seal is because of the thickness of the canal.

post #3334 of 4463
Quote:
Originally Posted by ChainRazer View Post
 

Alright, it's 2.30 in the morning (1.30 because of DST)

and this is the solution I've found:Plastic wrap

I tried wrapping around 50cm of it and the result is phenomenal, now it seals great.

The best thing is, you don't void the warranty nor damage anything.

At least I now know that the problem with the seal is because of the thickness of the canal.

Well okay! Looks like you need to return them to Phil :0

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by nokcha View Post
 

Has anyone paired their BA4F with the Pico Power? :0

Thinking about buying one but worried if the amp would only provide a marginal increase.

I haven't, but I was almost planning to at a certain point.

What is your current source? I've noticed that the BA4f scales quite a lot with better amps. I'll be trying the BA4f with the Corda quickstep this week. I do like the BA4f a lot straight from the O2, and it does sound like the BA4f has reached a 'ceiling' with this amp. 

I don't think I will get anything truly 'better' when using an amp other than the O2, probably just something different. If that is the case, the quickstep is going right back. I could use that €275 quite well (to save up for the BA6 for instance)!


Edited by Marleybob217 - 11/3/13 at 4:37am
post #3335 of 4463

I know a lot of people have already requested this, and there are possibilities available already, but I'd love the option of a three-button remote in the cable. Although I'd settle for just a microphone and one button.

post #3336 of 4463
Quote:
Originally Posted by PhilGT View Post
 

A little note on the fit of a custom in-ear monitor, I will cover our process on creating a good fit, the reasons why occasionally a good fit is not achieved and lastly the impact of having an incorrect fit.

 

How Fit Issues Happen (Click to show)

The most crucial area for the fit is the ear canal and as result this is the area we focus on the most. During the impression detailing stage we take great care in not touching the thickness and shape of the ear canal, we take the length down and smooth off the tip only. The impression is dipped in immersion wax prior to the mould being made, this is to smooth the impression resulting in a smoother shell, we use our method of “double tip dip” when dipping in the wax, this means we dip the canal only in the wax first and then the whole shell a second time, this gives the canal area a double wax coating. When the shell is complete and is in the final finishing stage we take extra care not to over polish the canal as this removes material and reduces the size. A final measure is at the QA stage where we compare the canal on the shell to the canal on the impression.

 

Fit issues do happen and can happen for a number of reasons. 

  • The most common reason is the quality of the initial ear impression, this is why we are very strict when it comes to accepting impressions and will reject impressions we feel are not good enough quality, we copy and duplicate the impression for the final monitor, if the impression is wrong then so will the final monitor, it is impossible for us to guess an individuals ear. 
  • Seasonal and illness. An individuals ear size can change at different parts of the year (providing one lives in an area with seasonal changes) a colder climate and the ear size will be slightly larger as the muscle contracts, warmer and it is slightly smaller as the muscle expands due to the warmer temperature. If you wear a ring on your finger, the ring is much tighter the warmer the body as the finger is bigger, go to a cold climate, like Sweden in the winter :-), and the ring will be less tight as the finger will be smaller. This seasonal/temperature change as well as location is something we also consider when creating a monitor. We have also experienced people taking ear impressions when they are ill, even just a cold, this is not advisable as we have seen ear shapes and sizes alter due to illness.
  • People have different ideas on how a monitor should fit and this varies. For example, person A likes to have a tight snug fit that will ensure a great seal and sound. Person B likes to have a more relaxed fit to enable them to insert the monitor more easily. If Person B has a monitor made that is perfect for person A they would say the fit is wrong as it feels too tight and uncomfortable, on the flip side if Person A had a monitor made that is perfect for Person B then they would say the fit is poor and has a bad seal.
  • Mistakes or over polishing can happen in the manufacturing stage but we have many measures in place to eliminate this as discussed above.

 

The bottom line in all this is that fit issues do occur due to one or more of the above, we take special care and attention to achieve a correct fit, however at the end of the day it will always be down to the individual, this is why we have a free re-fit warranty of all monitors as we want all customers to have the best fit possible.

 

The last think I want to discuss is the impact of the fit. A bad fit results in either the monitor being uncomfortable (example Person B with Person A fit) and/or poor seal. A poor seal impacts the low frequencies and the effect is actually quite astonishing. I carried out a little test and below is the resulting FR of the test. 

  • I measured a monitor using a good fit (this is in green line) and you can see healthy low frequencies. 
  • I then broke the seal with a 0.3mm hole, this is a very small hole but the impact can be seen on the red line. From 2Khz up there is no difference. The most astonishing result is the impact of the low frequencies from 300hz and down, this monitor would have very little bass impact.

 

This is why it is so important, whatever earphones, headphones, customs you are using, that the fit is good.

 

I hope this info is of use to people, contact me for any questions.

 

 

 

 

Awesome informative post.  Should be a sticky and required reading for someone buying customs.  New and experienced head-fiers have many misconceptions on getting a correct fit; this post masterfully covers it all. 

post #3337 of 4463
Quote:
Originally Posted by Marleybob217 View Post
 

Well okay! Looks like you need to return them to Phil :0

 

I haven't, but I was almost planning to at a certain point.

What is your current source? I've noticed that the BA4f scales quite a lot with better amps. I'll be trying the BA4f with the Corda quickstep this week. I do like the BA4f a lot straight from the O2, and it does sound like the BA4f has reached a 'ceiling' with this amp. 

I don't think I will get anything truly 'better' when using an amp other than the O2, probably just something different. If that is the case, the quickstep is going right back. I could use that €275 quite well (to save up for the BA6 for instance)!

Will be using the DX50. Originally wanted to get the C5 until I read your post that it only made it marginally better so I checked the DX50 thread and came across this,

 

Quote:

DX50 and Pico Power

If the QS sound can be described as cool lush, I would say the the operative words for the Pico Power are "boldly honest". Well, we have to be careful here. The PP has a discrete output stage using NOS transistors rather than the standard output buffers. The result is a sound that is a bit relaxed in the upper register. There is a nice organic quality to the treble. Still I use the terms "boldly honest" for the PP because it just throws so much dang power into the mix without a hint of the QS lushness. The result is a great sense of presence.  The QS does not lack for transparency but the PP ups the ante. This synergizes perfectly with the thin but slightly warm line out of the DX50, even with colored IEMs like the Heaven VI. To my ear, if the QS is the more luxurious sounding of the two amps, the PP is the more honest. It has a huge sound that just sounds true to source. The other quality that distinguishes the Pico Power is the bass. The QS is no slouch in this department but for driving IEMs, the PP has the best bass that I have heard in a portable amp. It has remarkable power and impact without a hint of bloat. The DX50 line out is frankly not a bass monster and the PP's ability to resolve so much bass detail and generate so much impact with the DX50 is extremely welcome. (Note also that this is not the product of any artificial bass boost; the Inner Fidelity FR tests show that the PP is utterly neutral.)

So tempted :[. Just really afraid that the difference in SQ won't be enough to justify the price tag.

post #3338 of 4463
Quote:
Originally Posted by nokcha View Post
 

Will be using the DX50. Originally wanted to get the C5 until I read your post that it only made it marginally better so I checked the DX50 thread and came across this,

 

So tempted :[. Just really afraid that the difference in SQ won't be enough to justify the price tag.

How about the added size and weight. Unless you're planning to use somewhere at a desk or something.

You could also try the pico portable amp. It's significantly smaller. And a little cheaper I believe.

post #3339 of 4463
Quote:
Originally Posted by Marleybob217 View Post
 

How about the added size and weight. Unless you're planning to use somewhere at a desk or something.

You could also try the pico portable amp. It's significantly smaller. And a little cheaper I believe.

Well I'm just looking for a setup that's more transportable than portable. Most of the time I do most of my listening in stationary positions rather than active ones so I don't mind the added size or weight. I was initially considering the Pico Slim but I read in another forum that the Pico Power gave a much more higher boost in bass with little loss in clarity(I may be wrong but I couldn't find too much information on the comparison of the Pico Slim vs Pico Power)

post #3340 of 4463
Quote:
Originally Posted by infam0ussteven View Post

I haven't heard the song in a few years, I hear it a bit on my m-audio av40 but it isn't like the BA4F where I can hear it in detail and actually "feel" it if that makes sense.. It happens in the first 20 seconds or so.

What phase are your HY3 in? I hope you can get them soon, I know how bad the waiting is but good thing mine was pretty quick.
Shell creation... Been stagnant there for a month or so while I acquire my empty shells, which I am finally arriving to my permanent location which I have been away fron working out of state.
post #3341 of 4463
Quote:
Originally Posted by fabian005 View Post


Shell creation... Been stagnant there for a month or so while I acquire my empty shells, which I am finally arriving to my permanent location which I have been away fron working out of state.

Hi, we have sent you a few emails to confirm the address, if you send us an email with that we can check where the shells have been sent.

post #3342 of 4463
Quote:
Originally Posted by ChainRazer View Post
 

Alright, it's 2.30 in the morning (1.30 because of DST)

and this is the solution I've found:Plastic wrap

I tried wrapping around 50cm of it and the result is phenomenal, now it seals great.

The best thing is, you don't void the warranty nor damage anything.

At least I now know that the problem with the seal is because of the thickness of the canal.

50cm!? :eek: Are you sure you didn't mean 5cm (50mm)?

Looks like you definitely need a refit. I had mine thickened twice and they fit great now.

Is that the stuff you wrap food in when you put it in the freezer?

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by jorgen83 View Post
 

I know a lot of people have already requested this, and there are possibilities available already, but I'd love the option of a three-button remote in the cable. Although I'd settle for just a microphone and one button.

Ditto. They had one but it was poor quality so they didn't sell it. I think they are planning to design another one but they're probably busy with the new models.

post #3343 of 4463
post #3344 of 4463
Quote:
Originally Posted by blueangel2323 View Post
 

50cm!? :eek: Are you sure you didn't mean 5cm (50mm)?

Looks like you definitely need a refit. I had mine thickened twice and they fit great now.

Is that the stuff you wrap food in when you put it in the freezer?

You read it right, 50cm long and 1cm wide, and it still needs around 0.3mm added radius at the back and bottom of the canal.

but the thing is, those food wrap aren't really that thick.

post #3345 of 4463

The repairment of my BA4F is done.

 

I really miss it.

 

Should be there by the end of the week or the beginning of the next.

New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
Head-Fi.org › Forums › Equipment Forums › Portable Headphones, Earphones and In-Ear Monitors › Cosmic Ears - new CIEM company with great prices (including Hybrid designs!)