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Best classical recordings...ever! - Page 37

post #541 of 2209

Yes, this is one of the problems with focusing too much on "accuracy" and thinking of recording as historical record primarily.

 

Actual performance practice historically has always been much looser, even according to those who've studied it in depth, than we assume.  There's been far more room for improvisation than we tend to think.  Heck, the cadenza in any concerto performance was not only an opportunity to show off one's skills playing the written music; it was an opportunity to improvise, compose on the fly! Right in the middle of the performance.  With time, we've grown shy, and tend to play cadenzas that are known and written and chosen as "the best" (there's that "best" thing again.... <g>).

 

I think this tendency towards more precision has come with the loss of immersion in the culture and history and experience of the world of the music played; safer to just reproduce than produce, given that modern productions would probably mostly sound weak by comparison.

 

Take Artur Rubinstein, for example; he was a far "sloppier" player than, say, a Pollini, but listening to him, you feel you are connecting with someone who's still a part of the classical music world, lived it, didn't worship it as a museum piece to be studied to perfection.

 

Kind of like why I stopped listening to jazz, post-Wynton Marsalis.  Nothing against him or his capabilities or approach, but the same thing has happened to jazz; it's become history, and died, and been turned into something to worship, instead of still being a living tradition that is extended and evolved.

post #542 of 2209
Quote:
Originally Posted by extrabigmehdi View Post
 

 

I  was looking for a kind of "best of" of wagner, 

 


As ever, Hollywood has yer answer :tongue: 
http://vimeo.com/70265237
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zy5f87-kI8c

post #543 of 2209

Speaking of that. Has anyone seen Taking Sides? Which thank all the gods of Rome, was NOT a hollywood production.

post #544 of 2209
Quote:
Originally Posted by extrabigmehdi View Post
 

This reminds me that I've read quite some criticism , regarding Stokowki interpretations of Wagner.

I  was looking for a kind of "best of" of wagner, and I  didn't want to hear the full "Der Ring des Nibelungen" thing (14 cds of opera is not my cup of tea, and I 'm barely just interested by the music piece called "the ride of valkyries"  ). The recording "Ring Without Words" by maazel seemed perfect for me, but after seeing all the negative reviews  (especially from "santa fe listenner", a knowledgeable   reviewer ) ,  it seems that  the one called " Highlights from the Ring of Nibelungs" by Szell is a better choice.

I have a double-CD compilation by Sir Adrian Boult which I like a lot.

 

But really, try Walkure act 1, Walter / Melchior / Lehmann.  Listen to this one CD.  Then you'll want to hear the whole Ring.


Edited by Delirious Lab - 11/6/13 at 4:23am
post #545 of 2209
Quote:
Originally Posted by Delirious Lab View Post
 

Walkure act 1, Walter / Melchior / Lehmann.  Listen to this one CD.

 

Then you'll want to hear the whole Ring.

Do you mean this one?!

post #546 of 2209

Yes.

post #547 of 2209

Mahler the greater? That's ridiculous. I personally enjoy Mahler's music more than Wagner. I can listen to Mahler's relatively small output regularly without ever tiring of it. It thrills me and speaks to me like no other composer's work can. However, I also recognize that in terms of sheer genius, originality, and musical thought that Wagner is clearly the superior composer. Popularity does not equal greatness. Henry Pleasant's wrote a book almost 60 years ago, The Agony of Modern Music, where he made it clear: after Wagner all it has been is refinement and modification of his rules. Without Wagner there would have been no Mahler, no film scores. Among all the great, and not-so-great, composers of all time, there is a small group of men of titanic importance: Bach, Beethoven, Brahms, Mozart, Wagner, and maybe Stravinsky. Studying, and playing, their music is revelatory. The way they put music together is just mind-blowing. Mahler was a superb craftsman and created music of immense power, but study a score like Tristan und Isolde or Die Meistersinger and you'll realize why Wagner is considered one of the all-time greats.

post #548 of 2209
Quote:
Originally Posted by mbhaub View Post
 

Mahler the greater? That's ridiculous. I personally enjoy Mahler's music more than Wagner. I can listen to Mahler's relatively small output regularly without ever tiring of it. It thrills me and speaks to me like no other composer's work can. However, I also recognize that in terms of sheer genius, originality, and musical thought that Wagner is clearly the superior composer. Popularity does not equal greatness. Henry Pleasant's wrote a book almost 60 years ago, The Agony of Modern Music, where he made it clear: after Wagner all it has been is refinement and modification of his rules. Without Wagner there would have been no Mahler, no film scores. Among all the great, and not-so-great, composers of all time, there is a small group of men of titanic importance: Bach, Beethoven, Brahms, Mozart, Wagner, and maybe Stravinsky. Studying, and playing, their music is revelatory. The way they put music together is just mind-blowing. Mahler was a superb craftsman and created music of immense power, but study a score like Tristan und Isolde or Die Meistersinger and you'll realize why Wagner is considered one of the all-time greats.

IMO there would have been no Mahler if not first there were not Wagner.At least not the Mahler we know today.Mahler was a major advocate for Wagner's music and readily acknowledged the influence.

post #549 of 2209

Further fragmentation:

post #550 of 2209
Quote:
Originally Posted by sh4dowd4ncer View Post
 

Do you mean this one?!

 

Here is my own transfer from original shellac disks. Sounds much better than EMI's cd.

 

http://www.vintageip.com/xfers/walkureact1walter1935.mp3

post #551 of 2209
Quote:
Originally Posted by perhapss View Post
 

IMO there would have been no Mahler if not first there were not Wagner.At least not the Mahler we know today. Mahler was a major advocate for Wagner's music and readily acknowledged the influence.


This is not just your opinion, it is a well known and documented fact.

 

I will never understand why people need to make art in a contest where people claim their preferences to be objectively superior, it's silly IMO

post #552 of 2209

Some opinions on art are more informed than other ones.

post #553 of 2209
Quote:
Originally Posted by bigshot View Post
 

Some opinions on art are more informed than other ones.


You can be very well informed and still express silly- or even nasty opinions..

 

Read some of Mahler's or van Beethoven's contemporary critics for example.

post #554 of 2209

I suspect we know more about classical music today because of recordings than Beethoven's critics.

post #555 of 2209

And....

 

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