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Best classical recordings...ever! - Page 217

post #3241 of 3252
Quote:
Originally Posted by perhapss View Post
 


The best thing about Bach, is his music will always present challenges and surprises.

IMO.


Musically speaking of course.

:wink:

post #3242 of 3252
Quote:
Originally Posted by jackskelly View Post
 

I love these sort of debates :D

 

" ..sort..."?

 

?

post #3243 of 3252
Quote:
Originally Posted by perhapss View Post
 

 

" ..sort..."?

 

?

 

Debate?

post #3244 of 3252
Quote:
Originally Posted by mbhaub View Post
 

That is so correct, and usually ignored and misunderstood. When the church goes, western culture is going right along side. We've already seen it to a large extent. The church in the USA used to be a big deal in communities large and small.  A significant proportion of the population attended on Sunday. That's all been changing for the last 50+ years, and classical music, which once had a greater import in our culture, has declined in popularity ever since. Churches used to use organs, and at least tried to present high quality music. No more - now it's drum sets, guitars and pop songs in the church. When my church gave in to pop music, some of us complained. The pastor simply said "no body except you snobs like that boring opera stuff nowadays." Needless to say, I left taking my checkbook with me. There are thankfully some churches that support classics in letting orchestras and other groups use their facilities, but frankly, in another generation or two classical music will be dead in the USA just as the churches will no longer be of any significance. You can thank the selfish, inconsiderate generation of the 60s.

:confused_face_2:

post #3245 of 3252
Quote:
Originally Posted by perhapss View Post
 


The best thing about Bach, is his music will always present challenges and surprises.

IMO.

 

I think most great composers do once you dig past the surface of their most "popular" stuff. Stuff like LvB's late quartets and piano sonatas, and the Missa solemnis, have been confounding people since the day they were premiered. Even Mozart is this way. I asked a music educator acquaintance of mine about WAM and he said that there was lots of devilishly complicated stuff in there, but his legerdemain can make it not obvious. After all, neither he nor Bach were reformers, not about to jam a Grosse Fuge down our throats ^_^

post #3246 of 3252
Quote:
Originally Posted by RRod View Post
 

 

I think most great composers do once you dig past the surface of their most "popular" stuff. Stuff like LvB's late quartets and piano sonatas, and the Missa solemnis, have been confounding people since the day they were premiered. Even Mozart is this way. I asked a music educator acquaintance of mine about WAM and he said that there was lots of devilishly complicated stuff in there, but his legerdemain can make it not obvious. After all, neither he nor Bach were reformers, not about to jam a Grosse Fuge down our throats ^_^

Not sure what your point here is my friend :/ 

 

We all know Beethoven and Mozart were creative geniuses as well. But your point of 'reformers' is lost on me... Revolutionising (or pushing boundaries for art sake) has little or no relevance to what is, or should be considered great.

 

In this respect, should Schoenberg be considered greater than Sibelius or Britten for example? Boundaries need breaking in art when things become stale. And I for one can't imagine a world without Beethoven. But I consider his greatness in the endless invention and haunting melodies he wrote. Now, whether this was written in the classical idiom or one that he stretched the rules with.. It really doesn't matter. The effect does :)

post #3247 of 3252
Quote:
Originally Posted by LugBug1 View Post
 

Not sure what your point here is my friend :/ 

 

We all know Beethoven and Mozart were creative geniuses as well. But your point of 'reformers' is lost on me... Revolutionising (or pushing boundaries for art sake) has little or no relevance to what is, or should be considered great.

 

In this respect, should Schoenberg be considered greater than Sibelius or Britten for example? Boundaries need breaking in art when things become stale. And I for one can't imagine a world without Beethoven. But I consider his greatness in the endless invention and haunting melodies he wrote. Now, whether this was written in the classical idiom or one that he stretched the rules with.. It really doesn't matter. The effect does :)

 

So God just kind of sits in neutral, then? And LvBs boundary-pushing is surely a factor in his status as a serious contender to the "greatest" title. The problem with Schoenberg's revolution is that he took a hammer, a bit, to the emotional edifice of music, thus while it is intellectually stimulating it feels incomplete. Not the case for LvB.

post #3248 of 3252

I tend to credit artists when an experiment they try ends up changing their art form for the better. When they try an experiment that other artists who follow them take to detrimental extremes, I generally don't blame the one making the initial experiment. I blame the people who go to detrimental extremes.

 

It may not be completely logical, but it works for me.

post #3249 of 3252
Quote:
Originally Posted by RRod View Post
 

 

The problem with Schoenberg's revolution is that he took a hammer, a bit, to the emotional edifice of music, thus while it is intellectually stimulating it feels incomplete. Not the case for LvB.

 

I find no problem with "Schoenberg`s revolution".

Nor do I find it "incomplete".

 

I think of great composer like old friends.

Different friends for different times, moods situations etc.

Both LvB and Schoenberg reside comfortably alongside each other together in my conciousness.

Why do we have to pit them against one another?

post #3250 of 3252

Quinto

 

Just realized I forgot to thank you for the recommendation of the Diabelli Variations performed by Kovacevich.  When I first listened to the Variations years ago, I did not take much to the piece.  Looking back, I probably was just not ready to concentrate enough on it.  Still working on that, but this recording is great.


Edited by ctemkin - Today at 3:07 pm
post #3251 of 3252
Quote:
Originally Posted by perhapss View Post
 

 

I find no problem with "Schoenberg`s revolution".

Nor do I find it "incomplete".

 

I think of great composer like old friends.

Different friends for different times, moods situations etc.

Both LvB and Schoenberg reside comfortably alongside each other together in my conciousness.

Why do we have to pit them against one another?

 

Because people say things like "Bach is the pinnacle of music." ;)

post #3252 of 3252
Quote:
Originally Posted by RRod View Post
 

 

Because people say things like "Bach is the pinnacle of music." ;)

 

Actually I remember a friend of mine said once:


"There maybe a few comparably great composers as Bach but there is no better."

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