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Can con 3 (Sydney,Australia meet) - Jan 12th 2013 - 9:30am-6:30pm, Epping. - Page 11

post #151 of 237

im still in... id like to know the details of were this is all happening though... 

 

look forward to that PM.

post #152 of 237

I can't come! Darn it!

 

I have a MSPro, HD580, D5000, AKG K400 and K500 etc (see my profile). If anyone wants to listen to anything on my list please say it so we can arrange.

 

The K400 and K500 is pretty sweet, btw ;)

post #153 of 237
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by mrAdrian View Post

I can't come! Darn it!

I have a MSPro, HD580, D5000, AKG K400 and K500 etc (see my profile). If anyone wants to listen to anything on my list please say it so we can arrange.

The K400 and K500 is pretty sweet, btw wink.gif

Sorry to hear.
m, K500 is meant to be one of the better old school mid-centric open HP
Quote:
Originally Posted by dibzr View Post

im still in... id like to know the details of were this is all happening though... 

look forward to that PM.

Tue.
post #154 of 237
Quote:
Originally Posted by svyr View Post

only $200-300 away wink.gif, where's your commitment (hmmm, ok that's a nexus 7 right there biggrin.gif )? Townsville - up, down, left, right biggrin.gif ?
not sure why Tralucent pulled out. They didn't give a reason. Maybe busy with CES, maybe on holidays. Maybe because I openly criticized their marketing/pricing [to the point of being banned from that thread biggrin.gif (for DBT discussions outside of sound sci forums, not flaming biggrin.gif)] and invited their now direct competitor Rhapsodio who they were formerly affiliated with to the meet via proxy biggrin.gif
I would've loved to compare Tralucent's 1+2v2 to Rhapsodio's RDB Plus 2BA+DD hybrid (will bring the RDP+ demo unit to the meet/review/let other people review it as well)
I think 1+2v2 is extremely overpriced ($1400, really?) and Tralucent want to recoup all of the R&D/establishment costs now[alternative theory from someone else here biggrin.gif]/are skimming on the hype and audiophiles and compulsorily bundling cables/claiming sound differences for silver internal wiring or silver cables. I personally don't like any of that a single bit. Didn't even like the pricing for 1+2v1.
Rhapsodio's RDP Plus is a DD + TWFK (2BA + DD) hybrid, and a second iteration product as well, and is priced at less than half of what Tralucent are asking for their hybrid.
Not to mention Swinwoo's T-PEOS H-200 (also their second try at hybrids), VSONIC 7007 and other TWFK + DD based IEMs soon to come out priced at around $300, or things like AS-2 (huge dd + unknown BAs, and some interesting features) and Merlin (2twfk + dd)
Re: 1+2v2 - That said - if you're into that sort of marketing and loved the sound, have a spare 1.5k, by all means.

 

Another day perhaps. I would have loved to compare the Tralucent with even full sized headphones for that matter if the 'as much detail as the HD800s' is to be believed and the reviews so far have been very positive. I trust the experienced reviewers on the thread (some of whom you wouldn't call first adopters of the CIEM). If I recall correctly were you not one of the first ones on the thread - I thought you were interested in purchasing the earlier versions that were around $800 intro price? I believe you heard the older versions - did you get one in the end? Tell me do you believe Sennheiser are trying to recoup market/advertising/R&D costs from their HD800 or is that price justified unlike the 1P2 (leave alone the fact that one is an IEM and the other a full sized can)? Surely by now Tralucent are somewhat established..have shown excellent customer service, seems to have listened to customer feedback and produced a new version, no additional selection of products but cables and an inexpensive amplifier to boot, being reviewed relatively by trustworthy ears and not fanboys. 

 

Some pay more for IEMs since they feel that these are more comfortable and provide better isolation than any closed can/open headphone will. We each justify the price some way lol. The term expensive/overpriced is a relative term. Some say the HD800s are the best headphones in the world while others don't. Surely once you begin including price comparisons before putting these items side by side and testing - is that not a portion of expectation bias whereby you may be thinking beforehand that the cheaper alternative would be fantastic if it can do 90% of what the other is offering. Of course the adverse is also possible. Don't see the reason to single out Tralucent price and compare directly to Rhapsodio here...... Lots of companies have jacked up prices following improvements and as introductory period closes. I guess it isn't well established company to be doing that sort of stuff? Not that I am defending any companies for doing so...Tralucent included. But why no mention of any of these companies (perhaps one or two may be at the meet).

 

I believe the price increase on their second versions have been in their opinions justified (well from what I read anyway) and it is up to us as the customer to decide whether or not we wish to pay that much. From what I've heard on the originals and what some trusted reviews (IMO) have said so far - I don't mind spending the money and I believe it will work out for me in the end. We are all in the same game of getting most out of audio for what we are willing to spend. And it's great you found some cheaper alternatives. That's great! It is up to your ears at the end of the day. Expectation bias begone! But keep in mind I didn't purchase these because of advertising/marketing or lack thereof from what I observed. Purely from discussions via PM and that thread in particular and comments from ears that I have now begun to trust. I'm not so easily swayed with the flavour of the month. I doubt that they are duping us with the upgrades. 

 

Heck even some consider the HE-6 unnecessarily expensive considering its little brother the HE-500 does a stand up job already for the price (I still want one nonetheless and am willing to pay whatever I need to supplement the headphones in their performance). Some say the LCD-3 is not worth that much over an LCD-2. Some say the Stig likes....ahh what were we talking about again. Very much relative unfortunately. But it is your prerogative as a consumer to consider the expenses of a product. Completely, understandable. And if we are keeping things objective, it also doesn't mean that the 1P2 automatically sounds twice as good as those Rhapsodios you mentioned even though sound is more a qualititative term than a quantitative one in this subjective world and a relationship between price and sonic quality has yet to be established (and possibly can never be) although it can somewhat be extrapolated based on a user's personal experience with previous equipment purchases. (and breathe).

 

And if Rhapsodio was indeed their direct competitor as you say then wouldn't that be reason enough for them to show their face so they can show them up. Just a bit odd that you single out Tralucent and then mention their supposedly direct competitor. Only until I started reading the Rhapsodio thread did I become aware that there are some things happening in the background that I'd rather avoid. I don't want to get involved with this.

 

That said you are one of the first adopters of Rhapsodio products and if you are oblivious or perhaps immune to any form of marketing, don't have 1.5K growing from trees (I do), and enjoy the sound then by all means haha. Anyways I don't mind a chance to listen to the Rhapsodios however. Would be interesting to see regardless of all these internal problems...call me a disinterested third party but I am excited to see how Tralucent grows. 

 
I had no intention of offending anyone or company with the above - these are just a random weirdo's opinions. Most of what I say (usually in jest) is to invoke discussion and conversation regarding what everyone is here (hear) for! I do not work for or am getting financial or product incentives from Tralucent Audio. Merely trying to be the voice of balance. Just seems silly comparing prices without at least comparing SQ or sound reproduction or whatever other reasons people use to purchase audio equipment. Price is only part of the picture not that I am defending the price of the 1P2s. If I have offended somebody then I apologise (hears someone cocking gun on internet..nk77 slowly backs away from keyboard..........). biggrin.gif

 

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by AnakChan View Post


Awww...c'mon! You can't simplify this 100 yr old art into just "red paint"! It's a technique with lacquer :-P!
Anyhow wasn't Oz the place where the TH-900s were sold for something like $1500-1600 last month? Made the rest of the world jealous (except Japan, naturally).

 

 

Ahh so many things to try..svyr please sell that Nexus 7 and buy me some tickets to Sydney! Btw I never mentioned I was from Townsville?!!! How on Earth did you get that info? Anyways have fun at the meet!popcorn.gif ( no reason for this smiley...I was just hungry). gs1000.gif

post #155 of 237
Thread Starter 
Well, I'm not convinced - You trust lee and gg, and bought a $1.4k IEM? Great.
You think doubling the price and passing it on to consumers because your initial product wasn't great is a good call - great.
However, you may well find down the track that RDP+, or 7007 or H-200 or AS9 or AS2 are as good or better in one way or another. [or people who don't necessarily know which IEM costs what incorporating your expectation bias argument above wink.gif, which also applies to the marketing claims of tralucent re their IEMs/pricing for your trusted reviewers wink.gif ]
Or if you down the track decide that the criteria used in the reviews differ to yours smily_headphones1.gif

Quote:
thought you were interested in purchasing the earlier versions that were around $800 intro price? I believe you heard the older versions - did you get one in the end?

Heard the old version. $800 was too much for it, personally [plus it could've used more prominent lower mids and upper mids sparkle]. Again, for reasons of TWFK + DD alternatives for less soon, or CI + TWFK alternatives now. $1400 for TWFK + DD is crazy.

Quote:
the rest incl pricing and expectation bias and ...
Tell me do you believe Sennheiser are trying to recoup market/advertising/R&D costs from their HD800 or is that price justified unlike the 1P2 (leave alone the fact that one is an IEM and the other a full sized can)?

The comparison you're trying to make doesn't make sense to me [economies of scale/type of business aside]: own acoustics and materials lab and developing your own drivers/chamber/vent, etc from different/innovative materials to constructing a cross-over [standard electronics/experimentation, some measurement if own an ear coupler, etc] and acrylic shells [std equipment] and employing off-the shelf drivers wink.gif [incidentally, the twfk in front of DD design was first in K3003 biggrin.gif]?


Quote:
Surely by now Tralucent are somewhat established..

don't they have about 5 customers for the IEMs biggrin.gif [half for v1]? and the initial demo unit failed on tour on the first person reviewing it?

Quote:
Don't see the reason to single out Tralucent price and compare directly to Rhapsodio here
... Just a bit odd that you single out Tralucent and then mention their supposedly direct competitor.

To be fair I also singled AKG out with k3003 [and at the time AKG was innovating to a point and have much more of a claim to price skimming than tralucent]. Comparing to other companies employing the similar drivers (DD + TWFK), or more or less the same drivers [Mentioned at least 4 other companies with similar products] is perfectly valid. As for Rhapsodio - shared roots with Tralucent. I've already stated why I dislike Tralucent re pricing and marketing compared to the other 4. By the same token I greatly respect say Heir audio who don't make any of the said marketing claims =) . It's perfectly valid to express my opinion of thinking it's overpriced, dubious and there may be cheaper options. If you think Tralucent is magically superior to the other 4, because they price it at 1.4k 'because they can/want to recoup costs' - it's your right


Quote:
call me a disinterested third party but I am excited to see how Tralucent grows.

That's your right as a person paying $1.4k for TWFK +DD smily_headphones1.gif . In my opinion, they just want to price themselves as an exclusive product, but I can't see why they're better than say Cosmic Ears biggrin.gif [self fulfilling prophecy - yay]

Look, all I hear is 'stop being mean to tralucent' and a bunch of optimism that doesn't make sense to the way I think about things + a different attitude to spending money on IEMs biggrin.gif , so let's agree to disagree, clearly your internal valuation models for IEMs and opinions on marketing differ from mine. I think it's hyped and overpriced. Yay Tralucent is also valid.


Quote:
Townsville?!!! How on Earth did you get that info? Anyways have fun at the meet! ( no reason for this smiley...I was just hungry).

Population/probability wise people go for Townsville, Cairns or Bris wink.gif . Although Brisbane is clearly not far north biggrin.gif or north qld.
Edited by svyr - 1/6/13 at 11:53pm
post #156 of 237
Thread Starter 
By the way, the RDP+ hybrid, RD (dd IEM) and the Amp sent to us by Rhapsodio have arrived biggrin.gif .
post #157 of 237
Quote:
Originally Posted by svyr View Post

Well, I'm not convinced - You trust lee and gg, and bought a $1.4k IEM? Great.
You think doubling the price and passing it on to consumers because your initial product wasn't great is a good call - great.
However, you may well find down the track that RDP+, or 7007 or H-200 or AS9 or AS2 are as good or better in one way or another. [or people who don't necessarily know which IEM costs what incorporating your expectation bias argument above wink.gif, which also applies to the marketing claims of tralucent re their IEMs/pricing for your trusted reviewers wink.gif ]
Or if you down the track decide that the criteria used in the reviews differ to yours smily_headphones1.gif
Heard the old version. $800 was too much for it, personally [plus it could've used more prominent lower mids and upper mids sparkle]. Again, for reasons of TWFK + DD alternatives for less soon, or CI + TWFK alternatives now. $1400 for TWFK + DD is crazy.
The comparison you're trying to make doesn't make sense to me [economies of scale/type of business aside]: own acoustics and materials lab and developing your own drivers/chamber/vent, etc from different/innovative materials to constructing a cross-over [standard electronics/experimentation, some measurement if own an ear coupler, etc] and acrylic shells [std equipment] and employing off-the shelf drivers wink.gif [incidentally, the twfk in front of DD design was first in K3003 biggrin.gif]?

don't they have about 5 customers for the IEMs biggrin.gif [half for v1]? and the initial demo unit failed on tour on the first person reviewing it?
To be fair I also singled AKG out with k3003 [and at the time AKG was innovating to a point and have much more of a claim to price skimming than tralucent]. Comparing to other companies employing the similar drivers (DD + TWFK), or more or less the same drivers [Mentioned at least 4 other companies with similar products] is perfectly valid. As for Rhapsodio - shared roots with Tralucent. I've already stated why I dislike Tralucent re pricing and marketing compared to the other 4. By the same token I greatly respect say Heir audio who don't make any of the said marketing claims =) . It's perfectly valid to express my opinion of thinking it's overpriced, dubious and there may be cheaper options. If you think Tralucent is magically superior to the other 4, because they price it at 1.4k 'because they can/want to recoup costs' - it's your right
That's your right as a person paying $1.4k for TWFK +DD smily_headphones1.gif . In my opinion, they just want to price themselves as an exclusive product, but I can't see why they're better than say Cosmic Ears biggrin.gif [self fulfilling prophecy - yay]
Look, all I hear is 'stop being mean to tralucent' and a bunch of optimism that doesn't make sense to the way I think about things + a different attitude to spending money on IEMs biggrin.gif , so let's agree to disagree, clearly your internal valuation models for IEMs and opinions on marketing differ from mine. I think it's hyped and overpriced. Yay Tralucent is also valid.
Population/probability wise people go for Townsville, Cairns or Bris wink.gif . Although Brisbane is clearly not far north biggrin.gif or north qld.

 

Actually they have quite a bit more than just 5 customers Svyr. At least from what I've been told they are booked right now in terms of the 1Plus2 sales which is good for them. The reviews will speak for themselves opposed to your speculation.


Edited by lee730 - 1/7/13 at 12:22am
post #158 of 237
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by lee730 View Post

Actually they have quite a bit more than just 5 customers Svyr. At least from what I've been told they are booked right now in terms of the 1Plus2 sales which is good for them. The reviews will speak for themselves opposed to your speculation.
Quote:
You think doubling the price and passing it on to consumers because your initial product wasn't great is a good call - great.
However, you may well find down the track that RDP+, or 7007 or H-200 or AS9 or AS2 are as good or better in one way or another.

=) from my perspective the salient point is the second line. so we'll see.
post #159 of 237

That's a big "May" ;). Also if I remember correctly from your early posts on the Tralucent thread you were quite impressed with the first model as a matter of fact. Even I was very impressed with them and to be honest still am. Just when I do direct comparisons to the newer model am I left underwhelmed. :) Even in comparison to the 334 and AKG3003 this was not the case. Only this redesigned model had such an impression on me and it continues to get better. The newer pair simply put makes the older model sound muffled in comparison.
 


Edited by lee730 - 1/7/13 at 12:38am
post #160 of 237
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by lee730 View Post

That's a big "May" wink.gif. Also if I remember correctly from your early posts on the Tralucent thread you were quite impressed with the first model as a matter of fact. Even I was very impressed with them and to be honest still am. Just when I do direct comparisons to the newer model am I left underwhelmed. smily_headphones1.gif

 

I was impressed with the sub-bass and over all sound less mids sparkle, until it came to the wallet. [unequalized: 1+2v1 ~ LCD2, Merlin - Stax O2]. Again, the salient point being comparison against similar DD + TWFK offerings smily_headphones1.gif .
I'll take my chances biggrin.gif that's 4 chances - 1 per DD+TWFK IEM that's not 1+2v2. I don't have 1.4k that's burning my pocket now, or... [for Gavin who wishes his product to be extra high end for reasons I can't grasp and in philosophies I don't approve of biggrin.gif ].
Edited by svyr - 1/7/13 at 12:40am
post #161 of 237
Quote:
Originally Posted by svyr View Post


I was impressed with the sub-bass and over all sound less mids sparkle, until it came to the wallet. [unequalized: 1+2v1 ~ LCD2, Merlin - Stax O2]. Again, the salient point being comparison against similar DD + TWFK offerings smily_headphones1.gif .
I'll take my chances biggrin.gif that's 4 chances - 1 per DD+TWFK IEM that's not 1+2v2. I don't have 1.4k that's burning my pocket now, or... [for Gavin who wishes his product to be extra high end for reasons I can't grasp and in philosophies I don't approve of biggrin.gif ].

 

 

In all honesty, I have never met nor have had contact with you, but please stop mentioning me by name. I don't know you!

 

You can have your personal thoughts, choose the way you spend money and post whatever you like, that is your prerogative.......

 

Thank you!

post #162 of 237
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by spkrs01 View Post


In all honesty, I have never met nor have had contact with you, but please stop mentioning me by name. I don't know you!

You can have your personal thoughts, choose the way you spend money and post whatever you like, that is your prerogative.......

Thank you!

Gavin, (now that we did have contact via PM biggrin.gif ). As discussed - your name was in the Tralucent thread/mentioned by Chong [Tralucent Aus, who I dealt with at length for the previous meet] as the guy who has large influence over pricing/[presumably]runs Tralucent and hence owns the business decisions above I don't share. That seemed to be the crux of the issue above [your name used as a Proxy for Tralucent] and you seem to be ok with me using your name in that context given your role at Tralucent.

I'm sorry we disagree and I'm glad you respect other people's opinions.

You possibly appreciate that while some people love 1plus2v2 and agree with doubling down on pricing and audiophile marketing [and you possibly genuinely believe in it/are passionate about it], statistically, there will be some that don't, and sometimes strongly as the first group support it. And that likewise, 4 similarly designed IEMs* pose a threat to 1plus2v2 sound and durability or whatever else-wise. [or at least are more diplomatic then me to stir things smily_headphones1.gif ] [speaking of pricing, you can buy 3.5 of those 4 IEMs for 1 1plus2v2 biggrin.gif].

I'm eager to see how it all turns out.

*[and some ancillary options from Cosmic Ears that aren't TWFK, but might be good, or TWFK +CI from UM], some with features allowing for sound customization via filters or bass-ports
Edited by svyr - 1/7/13 at 4:27am
post #163 of 237

I don't get it, I thought this is a meet thread that's about to happen in Sydney.

 

I don't know about the internal affairs between tralucent and rhapsodio but if in fact they were partners and one's been selling the same product for a lot more expensive, hmm... Now it seems like their partnership is voided and both are developing their new things. Let their product speak for themselves.

 

Svyr, how long do you get to keep the RDB for? I seriously want to try it out... Only if I can write reviews as good as others here :(

post #164 of 237

Could we keep posts relevant to the meet please?

post #165 of 237
Quote:
Originally Posted by pkwak View Post

Could we keep posts relevant to the meet please?

 

THANK YOU! 

 

Man, that was the worst! Where's the mute button?!

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Head-Fi.org › Forums › Meets, Get-Togethers, Factory Tours › Local / Regional Head-Fi Meets, Parties, Get-Togethers › Can con 3 (Sydney,Australia meet) - Jan 12th 2013 - 9:30am-6:30pm, Epping.