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Why pick on cables ? - Page 24  

post #346 of 403

What about interconnects?

 

Any benefit of gold versus tin or different types?

 

How about loose connections...at what point does a loosely attached wire affect sound quality or is it "all or Nothing" between connected contacts?
 

post #347 of 403
Quote:
Originally Posted by ukon16 View Post

What about interconnects?

 

Any benefit of gold versus tin or different types?

 

How about loose connections...at what point does a loosely attached wire affect sound quality or is it "all or Nothing" between connected contacts?
 


at what point does it impact sound quality, would depend on where the damage is and at what point in the movement of the cable does it impact the wire.

 

my experiance were:

1. total disconnect: complete loss of sound,

2. loose disconnect that sometimes re connects: snags and or movement of the cable/stress fractures cause no sound or sound to travel in one ear but not the other ear

3. random disconnects can cause sound but you lose bass or audio is low-volume even though you know the sound volume is definitely not 'low'

post #348 of 403
Quote:
Originally Posted by ukon16 View Post

What about interconnects?

Any benefit of gold versus tin or different types?

How about loose connections...at what point does a loosely attached wire affect sound quality or is it "all or Nothing" between connected contacts?

 
Contact quality has two main goals: low resistance and reliability. Low resistance relates to current handling capability, which isn't an issue in line level and headphone level audio. Materials tend to oxidize over time as a result of the material and environment. Most oxidation is not as good a conductor as the original matrial, so oxidized contacts can raise resistance to the point of circuit failure. Tin oxidizes readily, nickel not as much, gold not at all (if its 24k). Silver as a better conductor than gold but oxidizes readily. Higher voltages can burn through oxidation layers, so silver is used in higher voltage contacts. Gold is great for low voltage applications but is also very soft, so not great in high wear applications. It's also expensive so gold plating is usually quite thin.

Higher contact pressure reduces the effects of oxidation, so high pressure gold on gold contacts are used where the need is for high reliability in a low signal connection - sound familiar?

So the most reliable audio connections would be made with gold on gold contacts, like a gold RCA plug in a gold jack. If the connector is in a high-use application, like a headphone jack, then a harder more oxidation-prone plating material in a high contact pressure connector would be a better choice.
post #349 of 403
That , in the context of both this topic and in relation to all the other stuff I've been reading in the last few days, sounds like another load of rubbish. Prove that it makes the sound any different. Where's the evidence?
post #350 of 403
Quote:
Originally Posted by Takeanidea View Post

That , in the context of both this topic and in relation to all the other stuff I've been reading in the last few days, sounds like another load of rubbish. Prove that it makes the sound any different. Where's the evidence?

Prove that you wrote this. Before we doing anything.  

post #351 of 403

I'm with you, Takeanidea. But I'm too polite to call them on it. I think science folks can be just as bad as subjective folks at focusing on inaudible trivialities sometimes.

post #352 of 403
Quote:
Originally Posted by Takeanidea View Post

That , in the context of both this topic and in relation to all the other stuff I've been reading in the last few days, sounds like another load of rubbish. Prove that it makes the sound any different. Where's the evidence?

Please specify to which post you are referring.
Edited by jaddie - 2/2/13 at 5:22pm
post #353 of 403
Quote:
Originally Posted by Takeanidea View Post

That , in the context of both this topic and in relation to all the other stuff I've been reading in the last few days, sounds like another load of rubbish. Prove that it makes the sound any different. Where's the evidence?

Ok, now that I'm looking at the thread on the computer, it looks like that was pointed squarely at my post.  

 

I've made not one single claim as to the effect of connector types on sound quality, except that to imply that a heavily oxidized contact will eventually have sufficiently high resistance that the circuit will effectively be open, which means: no sound.  That is a fact.  It doesn't happen often, thankfully.  I never said one material sounded better or different from another. Once a good low resistance connection is made, the goal has been accomplished, exotic materials or not.  I never addressed the rather large grey area between a highly oxidized "open circuit" condition and a low resistance one, though that exists too.

 

My entire discussion relates to contact reliability, not sound quality.  I'd be happy to "prove" the points, if you wouldn't mind letting me know to which ones you take exception.

 

Do you disagree that:

 

contact oxidation happens?

 

some metal oxidation layers are less conductive?

 

gold does not oxidize?

 

silver contacts provide less resistance than gold (not that it matters in audio applications)?

 

high voltage burns through oxidation?

 

high contact pressure creates a more oxidation resistant connection?

 

Please let me know which of these scientific engineering principles you don't agree with and I'll be happy to supply proof of them.

 

In case the point was to ambiguous, let me clarify: all contacts and connections sound alike right up until the point that oxidation forms and creates a high resistance.  The use of certain techniques and materials prevents or forestalls that condition.

post #354 of 403

Questions often get over answered. But I think he was talking about the guy who eqs with a cable.


Edited by bigshot - 2/2/13 at 7:44pm
post #355 of 403
I found your whole posting quite typical of many I've read, I'm sorry but it comes across as a load of meaningless and trivial mumbo jumbo. Oxidation? Jeez it's been bad enough reading how much money I've most probably wasted on this hobby recently without trying to make some sense of yet another load of useless engineer related technical hogwash. If it's not going to affect the sound, it's off topic here
Edited by Takeanidea - 2/2/13 at 8:46pm
post #356 of 403

I got oxidation on a cable once. I cleaned it off with rubbing alcohol and it was fine.

post #357 of 403

Again, nobody here is saying that you need to go out and swap your cable for something else that may have marginally better properties for long-term usage and wear, or saying it will have an influence on the sound outside of the more extreme situations.  None of this really has to do with spending money.  I don't know what you would read (that is correct) that would cause you to go out and spend more money, for the most part.  Usually it's the opposite.

 

Somebody asked a question about which was better, and there are actual answers there.  I don't think asking for a lower level of discourse just to avoid complexity and nuance is a good idea.

 

I think it's pretty insulting to lump in thorough responses with the flat-out incorrect pseudoscience meandering hogwash crap that you see here and there, if that's what you're doing.  Or maybe that's not what you're saying.


Edited by mikeaj - 2/2/13 at 9:29pm
post #358 of 403
Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve Eddy View Post

 

I pound my bacon with my CD player to make *get ready for it* bacon bits. biggrin.gif

 

se


I laughed a LOT at this.  Like, a ridiculous amount. 

post #359 of 403
Quote:
Originally Posted by bigshot View Post

I got oxidation on a cable once. I cleaned it off with rubbing alcohol and it was fine.

 

now that's sound advice
post #360 of 403
Quote:
Originally Posted by Takeanidea View Post

I found your whole posting quite typical of many I've read, I'm sorry but it comes across as a load of meaningless and trivial mumbo jumbo. Oxidation? Jeez it's been bad enough reading how much money I've most probably wasted on this hobby recently without trying to make some sense of yet another load of useless engineer related technical hogwash. If it's not going to affect the sound, it's off topic here

 

I've seen oxidation screw up alot of crap hence why deoxit is a miracle solution for electronic repair....oxidation certainly can ruin pots and add static.

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