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post #46 of 79

It's very cold sounding.

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post #47 of 79
Quote:
Originally Posted by Magick Man View Post


I believe, sometimes, it's a plot to get you to keep a product beyond its return period, so you're stuck with it. That's not always the case, but at times it is. I've seen some really shady business in the top-end of hi-fi, so I make sure to dot my "I"s and cross my "T"s because there are some real sharks out there. I've fostered a very good relationship with AmEx and they watch my back, if a place won't accept them I move on to another dealer.

I also used to think that. when I got my m51 (I know, it is poor man's dac relatively speaking) there was awful distortion when I cranked up the volume. I called the dealer and he said to let it burn in. I was skeptical but because I would never really listen at those high levels I did not bother with return. I have had it for a while now and recently I tired cranking it up just to check and the distortion was gone. Dont know if that was just a coincidence but perhaps he was right. 

post #48 of 79

My brother just purchased the Vivaldi . I haven not heard it but he was with the owner of DCS at Lyric in NY last Thursday and hanging with James Gandolfini(Soprano's)who also was listening tothe Vivaldi as well. Not sure if Gandolfini bought one. My brother has the Scarlotti and is trading it so he can purchase the Vivaldi.   He also has the flagship YG Acoustic Towers and the MBL monoblocks making the total system well  over 300K with the rest of his hear.  He thinking of buying the Brinkmann turntable to replace his VPI. 


Edited by Frank I - 4/18/13 at 12:12pm
post #49 of 79
I just remember arguing with some old guy, I won't say the name of the dealer because that would be mean. *cough*Sound Specialists*cough* And he told me to hold on to an amp for a while longer, because it hadn't "burned in yet" and not to worry about the 30 day return policy, that it was okay. We had a "gentlemen's agreement". Well, I called on day 32 to get an RMA, no joke, and he said, "sorry, it's too late". Really? "Yes, it's too late, I never said anything of the sort." Really? So I called my lady at AmEx and explained my dilemma and she asked, "Is it damaged or defective?" I replied, "No, it just sounds like rubbish." She laughed. "Hold on to your hat, this is going to get interesting." She then reversed the charges and called the guy. He then called me within 5 minutes, he was cross. I told him, "You broke our gentlemen's agreement, and I stopped being a gentleman. You want to give me an RMA number now or should I just stick it out on the curb?" He did and I sent it back. I'm a cuddly teddy bear, until someone tries to take my honey.
post #50 of 79

Fair call on being sceptical towards burn-in then. I'll take bets on that salesman not being the owner and also being on commission. 

post #51 of 79
Quote:
Originally Posted by Magick Man View Post

I just remember arguing with some old guy, I won't say the name of the dealer because that would be mean. *cough*Sound Specialists*cough* And he told me to hold on to an amp for a while longer, because it hadn't "burned in yet" and not to worry about the 30 day return policy, that it was okay. We had a "gentlemen's agreement". Well, I called on day 32 to get an RMA, no joke, and he said, "sorry, it's too late". Really? "Yes, it's too late, I never said anything of the sort." Really? So I called my lady at AmEx and explained my dilemma and she asked, "Is it damaged or defective?" I replied, "No, it just sounds like rubbish." She laughed. "Hold on to your hat, this is going to get interesting." She then reversed the charges and called the guy. He then called me within 5 minutes, he was cross. I told him, "You broke our gentlemen's agreement, and I stopped being a gentleman. You want to give me an RMA number now or should I just stick it out on the curb?" He did and I sent it back. I'm a cuddly teddy bear, until someone tries to take my honey.


well played my friend! I see where you're coming from.

post #52 of 79
Quote:
Originally Posted by Currawong View Post

Fair call on being sceptical towards burn-in then. I'll take bets on that salesman not being the owner and also being on commission. 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cante Ista View Post


well played my friend! I see where you're coming from.

Trust me, I don't like monkeying around with anyone's livelihood, but I do expect a person to hold up their end of a bargain. What's bad is, it wasn't even a very expensive amp (in relative terms), it was the principle of the thing that irked me. Currawong is right, it wasn't the owner, it was one of the reps. The owner was "out of town", supposedly.

Don't get me wrong on the Vivaldi, I think it's a wonderful piece of hardware, but it's a little too much of a diminishing return for me. I think I'm going with the Alexandria X-2s instead, and move the W/Ps into the study. I have some Mission RX1s in there right now and I'd prefer a full-range, instead.
post #53 of 79

I just bought a dCS Debussy.  The poor man's Vivaldi . . . ksc75smile.gif

post #54 of 79
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jolida302 View Post

It's very cold sounding.

my experience w the dcs stuff as a 'house sound', a bit analytical and artificial sounding. great 'hi-fi'. 

post #55 of 79

I hate to offend anyone who has bought it.  But it never sounded like music to me.  Too hard, too pumped up bass with a characteristic I hear imposed on all instruments with low frequencies.  I can't understand how it has the name it does.  Well, actually, I think I understand and it has nothing to do with sound.  There are other brands of audio (electronics, speakers) that exist based on name, not sound, also.

 

With headphones, I find this phenomenon of things being raved just due to price and ads and reviews, without great sound, to not really exist.  That's something I love about this community.  I might disagree a bit, as with the Stax 009. where I like the Audeze LCD3 better.  But, I can understand the great characteristics of the 009, and why folks who weight certain characteristics differently than I do feel that they are the best.  I can't get there with the DCS.  I don't know why folks would think it is the best replication of music in the digital world.      

post #56 of 79

^ I'll let you know soon . . . mine should be here next week. 
 

post #57 of 79
Quote:
Originally Posted by googleli View Post

From the high end sources I have auditioned, the biggest difference with cheaper ones is in the soundstage and details. The top ones can really pinpoint the exact position of instruments, and center imaging. In headphone and smaller speaker systems, many cheaper DACs can do the job reasonably well, but in larger speakers the most minute differences would become quite significant, and the source which sounded wuite good for headphones became apparent that they have a plain 2D aoundstage, with a difference in width but not depth, or otherwise lack in the imaging department. Those are relatively objective qualities which IMO distinguish the better ones from the not so high end ones. Taking my Zodiac Gold and Weiss DAC202 as example, they are fine gear with my headphone systems, but once connected to my main speaker system and compared against my K-01, they immediately pale in terms of 3D soundstage and minute details, as well as top and bottom end dynamics.

When it comes to musicality and whether the sound is analog enough , it is a matter of personal taste - EMM Labs, dCS, MSB Platinum, Playback Designs, Esoteric or Soluution all sound a bit different and it comes down to how you like the sound is presented, but all with a very good soundstage as a base. And talking about turntables, let's not get into the debate of vinyl vs digital, as we all know the arguments of both aides reasonably well - just to point out that high end digital source is much more than sounding analog. There are some really steep turntables as well, taking the Clearaudio Statement as an example. It is perfectly okay to be content and satisfied with budget gear, but it is not fair to dismiss the better ones just because they command insane prices, without actually hearing them in a high end speaker system. If you believe your DAC can sound better than the internal sound chip on your laptop, there is no reason why there can't be a DAC out there sounding better than your current one.

My personal experience confirms this understanding. I am quite happy (actually very happy as I convert all files to 24/96 with MP filter) with TP + Cary DAC for headphone use, but will not consider using that for the main system, which uses Linn Klimax DS.

post #58 of 79

Total rubbish that are ears get used to the sound of new hifi  i have heard many components improve over time 50-100hrs apx,

Every bit of kit has to run in just like the human body operrates better when its warmed up, all the components improve,

their performance as elecricity flows though each of them + ressitance is less + less + the componnet operates better,

with thess inpedance + resitance the overall sound of the Hi-Fi componet inproves hasse you hear an inproved sound,

Quality once it;s run(burned) in!!!!

post #59 of 79

Now that's a first post.

post #60 of 79

I have heard a dcs Vivaldi through Lehman headphone amp -> Sennheiser HD800 (to compare with my own dcs Puccini), and one of the most memorable features of the sound - one that I wasn't expecting - was a noticeably better 'rhythm and pace' than the Puccini. There was a better resolved and more natural sounding treble too. I heard the Vivaldi at a local dealer event, and rather doubt I'll ever be able to afford one.

About the dcs sound being "cold" or to 'hi-fi": my system did not become really listenable until I had sorted out both the mains power - with an Equi-Tech Model Q balanced supply - and also the signal and speaker cables. (By the way, like seemingly everyone who hears them, I strongly recommend Chord Sarum Tuned Aray.) The improvements made by both the power supply and cables were striking. They add several thousand pounds to the system cost, but have been worth it for me.

 

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