Head-Fi.org › Forums › Equipment Forums › Headphones (full-size) › [New] Philips Fidelio X1
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

[New] Philips Fidelio X1 - Page 339

post #5071 of 5081

Also, I bought an Audio-Quest Forest cable for my M-stage, and it surely changes things compared to the other cable I was using. It really is different, less bright and less detail with the AQ cable.

post #5072 of 5081
Quote:
Originally Posted by SunshineReggae View Post

If you wanna bring that out as a general message, be my guest, maybe you will convince some people of it. Don't bother with me though.

Cable does make a difference with the x1. Souce components aa well.
post #5073 of 5081
Quote:
Originally Posted by SunshineReggae View Post
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by CoiL View Post
 

Change the cable for lower impedance OFC and use somekind of amp with max ~500mW output. Tube amp and tube buffered DAC preferred ;) 


 

wat

 

No you don't get it. One needs to believe in that kind of stuff for it to actually work. And I don't.

Belive what You want. I also didn`t belive in that cable stuff before I just tried it out with X1 and measured impedance after hearing difference. In most cases cable makes almost no difference but when it comes to high impedance cable like X1 stock cable, then changing it for better low-impedance actually works. I`m not the only one saying it. Take a look at X1 users stock cable impedances and impressions: http://www.head-fi.org/t/623013/new-philips-fidelio-x1/4320#post_10475263 ...there are more impressions an opinions on this but I just stopped adding them to post. Even Tyll @ innerfidelity mentioned in X1 review that X1 stock cable impedance is too high and could benefit from better cable. 

About amping, X1 max input is ~500mW and my own experience says that noticeable larger input mW makes its sound somewhat bloated. Again I`m not only person mentioning this.

Same goes for "tubey" sound added to X1 with tube amp or tube buffered dac.

 

Now, if You don`t belive it, fine, your choice but don`t make it as "belive" thing when practical tests and others ppl ears also confirm it.


Edited by CoiL - 10/23/14 at 11:28pm
post #5074 of 5081

No, actually what Tyll said was, that the impedance of the cable was noticeably high, to the point that it might affect sound. As a result, we have many people flailing their arms, claiming that other cables definitely hugely improve sound.

 

But... there are also people who have said that it might just be a placebo effect, that they are not sure they can tell a difference.

 

So what we need is some proper blind testing to figure out if the cable does make a difference.

 

But ofcourse there have not been done any blind tests :). So that leaves me very skeptic of the belief that it makes a difference.

post #5075 of 5081
+1
post #5076 of 5081
Quote:
Originally Posted by CoiL View Post
 

Belive what You want. I also didn`t belive in that cable stuff before I just tried it out with X1 and measured impedance after hearing difference. In most cases cable makes almost no difference but when it comes to high impedance cable like X1 stock cable, then changing it for better low-impedance actually works. I`m not the only one saying it. Take a look at X1 users stock cable impedances and impressions: http://www.head-fi.org/t/623013/new-philips-fidelio-x1/4320#post_10475263 ...there are more impressions an opinions on this but I just stopped adding them to post. Even Tyll @ innerfidelity mentioned in X1 review that X1 stock cable impedance is too high and could benefit from better cable. 

About amping, X1 max input is ~500mW and my own experience says that noticeable larger input mW makes its sound somewhat bloated. Again I`m not only person mentioning this.

Same goes for "tubey" sound added to X1 with tube amp or tube buffered dac.

 

Now, if You don`t belive it, fine, your choice but don`t make it as "belive" thing when practical tests and others ppl ears also confirm it.

 

The max input has nothing to do with sound quality. Do you even understand power requirements? You think philips would put guidelines on the box that relate to subjective impressions? What if someone liked that 'bloat' and took it for 'great bass'? Philips would be making recommendations that would only serve to confuse and alienate customers.

 

No. The point of the max input is that the X1 is a very sensitive headphone. If you have a huge mothertrucking amp with crazy output, it's very easy to make the mistake of damaging the X1 by turning up the volume too much. Not to mention, under the condition that you can only use a very small portion of the amp's power, you're prone to channel imbalance issues and other types of distortion - signal to noise ratio tends to be worse the lower the volume. But it's arguably a safety regulation more than anything, and it has very little to do with 'bloat' or other subjective impressions of sound.

post #5077 of 5081

Theoretics stay theoretics. I believe in practics. I did my "blind" test and difference was(is) very noticeable. I`m not only X1 user hearing it. If You won`t belive experience of many X1 users and follow only Your own blind belief then I don`t know what more to say. Won`t discuss with You about this subject anymore since it seems pointless and I really do not care about Your opinion. Belive what You want. Was just sharing some real world experience with X1 ;)


Edited by CoiL - Yesterday at 8:26 am
post #5078 of 5081
^ I'm gonna let you guys battle that one out.. LOL

On another note I've fallen in love with listening to Taylor swifts new song "shake it up" on these headphones - or more specifically the drums. Anyone have a suggestion for songs with similarly awesome drums?
post #5079 of 5081
Quote:
Originally Posted by Foscot View Post
 

First of all, I am not a veteran listener, therefore you might say I am objectively worse at doing this comparison. To those who don't already know, these are purely subjective opinions.

 

I just had the Aune X1 over for a listen for a week. Comparing it to my X-Fi XtremeMusic on my Fidelio X1s, there is no difference large enough to justify the price tag. I suspect this being because of the low impedance, therefore eliminating the need for an amp.

 

The DAC on my XtremeMusic and the Aune X1 are similar, and even though soundstage is slightly wider and the sound a little more pleasing, I do not recommend what many users are recommending for the Fidelio X1.

 

Pink Floyd, even in 24 bit 96 khz SA-CD 3 mbit/s sound, sounds amazing regardless of which DAC/AMP is used.

 

What I do recommend for the Fidelio X1, is one of the HiFimeDIY DAC+amps such as the Sabre UX1 or maybe even give the higher output impedance U2 a try, since they are cheaper, have (according to some) better DACs and don't have a massive amp which does so little for the Fidelio X1s (not saying it doesn't need amping, but it doesn't need a amp so powerful it has to be turned down to 25%

 

Hi Foscot. I remember you PM'd me about the Aune X1 a couple of months ago.

 

I do agree on the DAC part, there's little differences between them since both the XtremeMusic and X1 (I assume you're talking about the older Mk.2 model, which is different to the X1 Pro) since both DACs has quite a neutral signature to them, slightly warm-ish tilt. Unfortunately the XtremeMusic is a soundcard, which means it is really only going to be useful on a PC. Also bringing this card to newer PCs doesn't exactly work well, due to how bad Creative's drivers are.

 

I would still generally recommend the X1 Pro to any X1 (or even X2) owners these days. True, going above 11' oclock on the POT is going make ears bleed, but you have to admit the versatility of the X1 Pro provides. USB, optical, RCA in, pre-amp out... is there another DAC/Amp all-in-one out there at $220 that provides this? I mean I'd actually recommend the X1 Pro to anyone who has a $200 budget in fact.

 

The UX1 is indeed a good budget option though, I have to agree with that. As is an even cheaper FiiO D03k too. 

post #5080 of 5081
Quote:
Originally Posted by CoiL View Post
 

Theoretics stay theoretics. I believe in practics. I did my "blind" test and difference was(is) very noticeable. I`m not only X1 user hearing it. If You won`t belive experience of many X1 users and follow only Your own blind belief then I don`t know what more to say. Won`t discuss with You about this subject anymore since it seems pointless and I really do not care about Your opinion. Belive what You want. Was just sharing some real world experience with X1 ;)


There are also lots of people that changed cables and said that they heard no difference. This, with cables from Vmoda and even MonoPrice. No one can argue with you saying that you truly think that there is a difference. That is your perception. Not necessarily the signal your ears are being stimulated by, but rather what your brain decides to interpret. I think you need to go in believing that there can and will be a difference when it comes to cables to think that they make any significant difference. Some folks are just more prone to be swayed by suggestion (or just having spent big bucks on a cable). Expectation bias it is called.

 

While there is some specific effects that changing the impedance of a cable can cause... reduction of damping factor and even FR in the bass region, I have not found anything, even subtle differences, when comparing the stock cables to several others.

 

I even had a friend change through 4 different cables while I was blindfolded. I could not reliably detect differences.

This does not mean that no one else could, but for my purposes, all of the cables did the same thing! Now I realize that the time it takes to switch cables works against this kind of test actually producing useful results. I haven't been able to figure out a way to speed up the cable change process.

 

So, I will never say that someone does not or could not perceive something that they report. However I often marvel at these discussions. People actually seem to get angry because someone else says that they are wrong. Who really cares?

 

If a person "thinks" that they hear something, whether it is based on physics or personal perception (with all of the biases that this encompasses), good for them! Go listen and be happy. No reason to get upset because someone else does not hear the same thing.


Edited by mandrake50 - Today at 10:13 am
post #5081 of 5081

Well it's just too bad, I came into this thread to post my impressions about X1, but nobody cares at all, it immediately derails into terribly boring argument about cables and amps. I get guy who doesn't understand at all how amps work telling me to buy a tube amp, and guys who hear endless differences in cables instead. Thanks headfi...

New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
  Back to Forum: Headphones (full-size)
Head-Fi.org › Forums › Equipment Forums › Headphones (full-size) › [New] Philips Fidelio X1