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New DENON "Music Maniac" & "Urban Raver" Lines: D7100, D600, D400 & C300 Impressions Thread - Page 99

post #1471 of 1585

Running off an iPhone 5s into a Burson Conductor (so aside from being an iPhone, we're talking a very good signal here) all I could hear was how boomy the midbass was. 

 

Keep in mind, Denon made an iPhone app to be used WITH THE D7100's, so if you're going to say they shouldn't be run off of a mobile device... that's news to Denon, who apparently have come to the conclusion that this is EXACTLY how their headphones should be used.

 

Personally, I am incredibly wary of any headphones wherein people say "no no no, you just have to find that magical combination of hardware to make them sound good". That's not a good pair of headphones. 

post #1472 of 1585
Yeah I know about the app, seen it. But it doesn't means it will sound good.

Its not about magical combination. The same storry is with other headphones. If u want the best of them, just get a proper setup. There is no magick here.

Regarding the iPhone5s to Burson. Thats not a good signal in my opinion. Taking signal out of a headphone socket? There is no boomy bass on my system. There was no boomy bas on Fiio12 or rega ether.

As I said I have done extensive listening thru mobile devices with other headphones for last 6 months. I was looking to dump CD and move to Flac thru my NAS. Results where at most listenable but I wouldn't call it audiophile sound. Connecting dac to android phone didn't change things much either.

While Denon claims that D7100 could be used of mobile device. I strongly disagree and wouldn't recomened anyone to do so or make a judgement on that basis.




Sent from my C6603 using Tapatalk
post #1473 of 1585
Quote:
Originally Posted by MinedSafe View Post

Yeah I know about the app, seen it. But it doesn't mean it will sound good.

Its not about magical combination. The same storry is with other headphones. If u want the best of them, just get a proper setup. There is no magick here.

Regarding the iPhone5s to Burson. Thats not a good signal in my opinion. Taking signal out of a headphone socket? There is no boomy bass on my system. There was no boomy bas on Fiio12 or rega ether.

As I said I have done extensive listening thru mobile devices with other headphones for last 6 months. I was looking to dump CD and move to Flac thru my NAS. Results where at most listenable but I wouldn't call it audiophile sound. Connecting dac to android phone didn't change things much either.

While Denon claims that D7100 could be used of mobile device. I strongly disagree and wouldn't recomened anyone to do so or make a judgement on that basis.




Sent from my C6603 using Tapatalk
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Sent from my BN NookHD+ using Tapatalk
post #1474 of 1585
Just to add out of my iPod classic without an amp, there was some distortion and it didn't sound good. The D600 although slightly less sensitive sounds better running from a portable device.
post #1475 of 1585
Quote:
Originally Posted by MinedSafe View Post

Yeah I know about the app, seen it. But it doesn't means it will sound good.

Its not about magical combination. The same storry is with other headphones. If u want the best of them, just get a proper setup. There is no magick here.

Regarding the iPhone5s to Burson. Thats not a good signal in my opinion. Taking signal out of a headphone socket? There is no boomy bass on my system. There was no boomy bas on Fiio12 or rega ether.

As I said I have done extensive listening thru mobile devices with other headphones for last 6 months. I was looking to dump CD and move to Flac thru my NAS. Results where at most listenable but I wouldn't call it audiophile sound. Connecting dac to android phone didn't change things much either.

While Denon claims that D7100 could be used of mobile device. I strongly disagree and wouldn't recomened anyone to do so or make a judgement on that basis.




Sent from my C6603 using Tapatalk

 

Yeah I figure Denon probably doesn't know what's best for their headphones. I mean how could they? 

post #1476 of 1585
Quote:
Originally Posted by SomeGuyDude View Post
 

 

Yeah I figure Denon probably doesn't know what's best for their headphones. I mean how could they?

I thought it was a nice touch that the Denon app had an EQ on it.

post #1477 of 1585

Not sure where people started discussing the Denon's as neutral.  They aren't, but for some of us they're fun.  In terms of distortion I personally haven't noticed anything though, it's comparable if not a bit less than many speakers.

 

Of course, I prefer the D600 . . . I think the D7100 is a step too far, but that depends on what you're looking for.  The D600 reminded me of B&W house sound and was an insta-buy at $250-$300.

post #1478 of 1585
Quote:
Originally Posted by palmfish View Post
 

 

 

 

 

Hi,

 

This is my 1st post so please be patient with me.

 

I own a pair of Denon D600's connected via the long 3m cable into a FIIO E12 (with Bass Boost enabled) connected to a SanDisk Zip Clip running the latest version of Rockbox.

 

Using a sine-wave mp3, I've tried to equalise the D600's by ear both on the Clip & an IPhone 4S using the Denon Music App.

 

When I've made the necessary EQ Cuts & Boosts to make the sine-wave sound the same volume through the frequencies, I end up with an EQ profile similar to the above D600 profile (except for the compensation of the E12 Bass Boost.)

 

However the results on either setup sounds awful or muddy.

In the end I had to make an improvised EQ setup by ear, experimenting & googling as I went along.

I ended up with the traditional V profile of raised Bass & raised Treble with perhaps louder vocals:

 

eq enabled: on
eq precut: 75
eq low shelf filter: 32, 7, 50
eq peak filter 1: 64, 10, 30
eq peak filter 2: 125, 10, 30
eq peak filter 3: 250, 10, 30
eq peak filter 4: 500, 10, 20
eq peak filter 5: 1000, 10, 15
eq peak filter 6: 2000, 10, 30
eq peak filter 7: 4000, 10, 55
eq peak filter 8: 8000, 10, 60
eq high shelf filter: 16000, 7, 75

 

This is the best sounding I've got it so far.

Is this correct & does anyone have any suggestions to improve?

 

Thanks,

 

Mark

post #1479 of 1585

In my (admittedly somewhat limited) experience, trying to EQ a headphone to alter its response curve significantly never really works. You can use an EQ to boost a little here or tame some extra output there, but trying to really "shape" the sound is going to come out odd in comparison to a headphone that responds that way normally. 

post #1480 of 1585

Hi @SomeGuyDude

 

What I should have made clear was that I was trying to equalise the D600s to a flat(er) response.

 

When I first received the D600s; you could tell that the vocals were recessed & I wanted the music to sound with more substance.

post #1481 of 1585
Quote:
Originally Posted by SomeGuyDude View Post
 

In my (admittedly somewhat limited) experience, trying to EQ a headphone to alter its response curve significantly never really works. You can use an EQ to boost a little here or tame some extra output there, but trying to really "shape" the sound is going to come out odd in comparison to a headphone that responds that way normally. 

I have the same limited experience with EQ'ing but I'm also of the same mindset that only moderate tweaks would be worthwhile.

post #1482 of 1585

Hi @SomeGuyDude  @Byrnie

 

ok, taking the Denon D600 frequency response graph :-

 

 

Would it be theoretically possible to get a "flat" response by applying opposite EQ?

 

E.g.

 

There's a big dip @ ~4KHz -> 5KHz of  -10dBr.

 

Adding +10dB @ 4KHz did make the sound much brighter but the vocals became too nasal; +8dB was more pleasantly subtle - my guess it boils down to personal preference, research & experimentation?

 

Thanks,

 

Mark

post #1483 of 1585
Quote:
Originally Posted by ceemsc View Post
 

Hi @SomeGuyDude  @Byrnie

 

ok, taking the Denon D600 frequency response graph :-

 

 

Would it be theoretically possible to get a "flat" response by applying opposite EQ?

 

E.g.

 

There's a big dip @ ~4KHz -> 5KHz of  -10dBr.

 

Adding +10dB @ 4KHz did make the sound much brighter but the vocals became too nasal; +8dB was more pleasantly subtle - my guess it boils down to personal preference, research & experimentation?

 

Thanks,

 

Mark

I would start a separate thread on this as i don't think SomeDudeGuy or myself are the best people to ask about this.  In theory that is how I would approach it and I would make only minor tweaks at first i.e., boosting at 5000Hz by 2-3dB and lowering at 20hz-100hz by 2dB.  Try that and use it for a month then tweak from there.  Again I haven't dabbled much in EQ'ing so starting a thread on this specific subject (or searching for one given there probably already was one) would probably yield better information.  Good luck though!

post #1484 of 1585

@SomeGuyDude  @Byrnie

 

OK, Thanks  - It's all been useful info anyway.

 

Mark

post #1485 of 1585

FWIW, you don't want a truly ruler-flat curve. The human ear doesn't perceive all frequencies evenly. The reason things are all jagged up near the top end is our ears hear the frequencies that are associated with the human voice more readily, particularly on the higher end (I've heard theories about crying infants and screams for help, for example) so dips and peaks are there to make sure our ears don't scream for mercy, LOL. 

 

If you've ever listened to a drum kit in the same room as you vs how it sounds on a recording you'll be very grateful for this.

 

My PRIMARY concern, from looking at that chart, would be the hump around 100Hz. Tone that down and it should make a serious difference. Take a look at the D600 vs the well-respected Audeze LCD3:

 

Notice how they follow a similar path up around 4kHZ and 10kHZ as well as staying relatively boosted at the low end. The main difference is the LCD3's stay markedly higher above 10kHZ (helping clarity) and its bass is significantly flatter rather than humped upward. Tame the bass so it's flatter and that will go pretty far in making it sound less "bloated". 

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