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= Hifiman Regrilling Mod = - Page 49

post #721 of 740

Just did the grill mod on my 400s :D

 

 

Ordered from a local guy I know who got a laser cutting (and CNC + 3D Printing) machines.

 

Made out of a piece of thin plastic, somewhat flimsy, but good enough for now

 

Cant use acrylic, too prone to breaking if too thin, can't find any other sheet of metal thin enough yet.

 

So it's plastic wrapped in carbon fiber sticker :D

 

Use the type of cloth for speakers for anti dust - dont know what it's called, lol.

 

Costs less than US$20 

 

Happy enough with the results.

 

 

Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)

 

 

 

 

post #722 of 740

Very very cool! 

post #723 of 740
Just used the basic car grill mesh from Amazon. It's thicker than stock grill so must be cut tight to fit snugly. Plastic trim rings won't fit.
post #724 of 740
For those that use InspiredLaserDesign grills, how you trim off the four tabs? I've tried a few methods and so far have broken one frown.gif

Fortunately they aren't expensive but I haven't had much luck. I guess I'm not mechanically inclined.

Thanks!
post #725 of 740
Quote:
Originally Posted by kehorton View Post

For those that use InspiredLaserDesign grills, how you trim off the four tabs? I've tried a few methods and so far have broken one frown.gif

Fortunately they aren't expensive but I haven't had much luck. I guess I'm not mechanically inclined.

Thanks!


I use a pair of side cutters to trim the majority of the tab off with, then a bench grinder to fine tune the fit to the headphone, balancing the four tabs to be the same size. 

post #726 of 740
Just got around to messing with the he-6's today.
post #727 of 740
Wow, you guys are great with your tools. I failed multiple times to cut these cleanly. Ah well. Looks great though. Did you put felt over the inside facing the drivers?
post #728 of 740
Quote:
Originally Posted by kehorton View Post

Wow, you guys are great with your tools. I failed multiple times to cut these cleanly. Ah well. Looks great though. Did you put felt over the inside facing the drivers?

No, left it stock.  Might be a good idea to try for reducing reflections.................

 

I'm using the Biohazard design, which has the least amount of surface area (by design) as I wanted the most open without going grill-less. 

post #729 of 740
I still need more impressions on modding grills for the he560.what are the changes with it in terms of sound?
post #730 of 740

Anyone with an HE-400i know what size acrylic fan grill to get (Inspired Laser Design)? Is it 80 mm or 92 mm? 

post #731 of 740

The regrilling mod i finally made on my HE 400 with sorbothane duro 70 put  around and near the driver.... After the sorb. mod properly implemented, i must say the grill mod was very audibly efficient to make my he 400 on par with my 2 Stax headphone, very different sound but very holograpgic and realistic... My he 400 is driving by the vintage Sansui AU 7700.... If the regrilling mod. is made without the sorb. mod and without a good amp for the planars, i dont think that it will be extraordinary like mine for the last days were to my ears... Thanks to you all for  this mods suggestion...By the way i cut a pizza oven's made  golden mesh   for it....:atsmile: 


Edited by richard51 - 7/29/16 at 5:55am
post #732 of 740
Quote:
Originally Posted by PKPnytheta47 View Post
 

Anyone with an HE-400i know what size acrylic fan grill to get (Inspired Laser Design)? Is it 80 mm or 92 mm? 


80mm

post #733 of 740

Amen1

I finished the 80mm bio hazard mod myself a few weeks ago. Used duro 50 1/2 x 1/2 x 1/10 cut into half pieces, 12 per cup.

Driven by either Pioneer SX-3800 or SX-3900 in balance mode. Self made 4-pin xlr cables driven with 7 ohm & 1 ohm, 10 watt resisters at the tapes.

Man does she shine with the amps.  

post #734 of 740

i have now experiment with 3 different grills, the original one is the worse,  My first attempt is with one that is practically open with large  metal mesh(originally designed for oven and pizza), second one the plastic  mesh is tighter with more little holes... the large mesh give more airy sound and is very good ,way better than the original...The  one with the tighter mesh give absolutely gorgeous mids frequencies, less airy but organic mids and meatier mids, the human voice is way better with that mesh... I think i prefer this to the larger  and more open mesh...

 

 

update: i will look  finally for a grill with an intermediary size mesh between the two i had try to retain the qualities of these two in optimal balance.... 

 

In any case with each 3 grills it is like 3 different headphone... I must say that my he 400 are  properly damped with sorbothane duro 70 that enhance greatly the effect of the grill mods...Without sorbothane and before this grill mods. i was thinking to sell the he 400, now this is my prefered headphone and with the grill mods. completely transformed headphone with dominant mid frequencies and beautiful sound more 3-d  realistic than my beloved  refine sounding  sorbothanized Stax SR-5... i am curious to compare my he 400 modified to the mids of the  he 500 non modified...:beerchug: thanks to all of you 

 

SECOND UPDATE:

 

WOW! i decided to cut in the center of the plastic grill  with the tighter mesh  a  large hole (approx.1/3 of the diameter)  , and gluing  a  perforated red silk piece of paper in this open center ...Hence all is secure now  for the dust i think....BUt what a surprise! the bass is clearer, and the highs now are better refine and silky, without damaging the organic mids... I think of all the review about the he 400 speaking of the tizz in the highs, and their v shape etc all that was a defect is now a quality, hence all depend of the proper implemented topology of the cup , i listen to  the he 400 for the first time after 3 years on my head... Now it is clear for me that with the duro 70 sorbothane around the driver and this last grill mod with this plastic mesh center hole covered with this silk paper the he 400 surpass all my Stax and my speakers also on all count,imaging,bass,high etc...Thanks to the initiator of this grill mod. BUT remember that without the sorbothane this mod is way less spectacular...

 

 

p.s. they are more beautiful than this photo reveal... 


Edited by richard51 - 8/3/16 at 4:25pm
post #735 of 740
Quote:
Originally Posted by jerg View Post

Prelude:


Evaluating efficacy of new grills vs old grills:
Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)

This is a test that can be used to easily and definitively evaluate how the new grills improve upon the sound, and how close they are to being acoustically transparent.

Start by downloading a high bitrate pink noise file, then listen to the pink noise on loop through the headphones at a clear volume.

Meanwhile have the grills off the headphones, and hold the grills to be tested (whether it be the stock or new grills) and hover them on and off where they seat on the headphones. Pink noise is used here because it is by far the easiest way to discern resonance / ringing / soundstage objectively without delving into expensive measuring instruments.

Also try to minimize hand and finger movements when hovering the grills on and off during this test, as those movements also induce a noticeable change in the pink noise sound.

Focus on judging two variables through this test:

1) how the soundstage changes with and without the grills

2) how much additional resonance / ringing is induced by the grills

Note that regardless of how good you choose your materials, with a composite grill composed of a steel mesh + fabric, it WILL decrease soundstage and induce resonance/ringing, the aim is to produce a pair of grills that minimize those two negative effects.

So far my rev.2 grills (picture at top of post) are the best compromise, it reduces soundstage moderately (between stock and rev. 1), it also induces the least ringing.

Rev. 1 grills affect the soundstage the least out of the three, but induces the most ringing probably due to it having the densest steel mesh.

Stock grills close the soundstage in the most, by far; it induces moderate ringing (between rev. 1 and 2 grills I made).






Nothing from the stock headphones is destroyed with this mod, the only thing replaced is the grill which pops off of course. Completely reversible.

Comment, like, favorite, try it out if you like. Cheers!


Edit: partially revised on Aug 17, 2013

Thanks for the well written, detailed, and clear information on this mod! I don't own any HiFiMans (yet!), but the concepts and practices laid out will absolutely apply to pretty much any headphone of a remotely similar construction. I'm preparing to apply the same concepts to my Grados, in fact.

However, I have one nit to pick, and I think it's an important one: the last section, "Evaluating efficacy," should really just be removed, as it's frankly unsalvageable without starting over from scratch. You describe it as "definitive" and "objective." To be as clear as possible: no, it is not objective in any sense of the. Word. It relies on subjective judgments about what sounds bigger, or wider, and assumes that if you fail to notice any number of possible artifacts that detract from SQ, then they must not exist, and you'll never notice anything new ever again! Am I exaggerating your claim here? I really don't think I am. The test as laid out makes no effort whatsoever to isolate one variable at a time, doesn't even define its own terminology (what objectively factual criteria should we look for when determining whether the soundstage is wider or narrower, as an example).

You put so much great thought and attention to detail in describing the mods performed, then you tack on this grade-school effort at achieving objectivity, EVEN THOUGH THAT WAS NEVER ONE OF YOUR GOALS IN THE FIRST PLACE! You're only ever aiming for subjective improvements, and that's fine! So are the rest of us! Well except maybe for NwAvGuy, and his approach is fine too, if it works for him.

All I'm saying is that you posted a very strong review, don't cheapen it by making it something it's not! I was a fan long before you started trying to lie to everybody including yourself. Bottom line is it's an irreparably flawed test, and it's likely to actually cause harm, because readers might form incorrect opinions based on the purported finality of the test.

I'm sorry if this has been covered in the 800 comments somewhere; if it was, it wasn't enough, because the offensive section is still up there. If anyone thinks I'm being harsh, well, I did my best to praise the strengths here as stridently as I'm condemning the faults.
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