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O2 AMP + ODAC - Page 32

post #466 of 3396
Quote:
Originally Posted by glunteer View Post

mhoe but ... you can not use the ODAC and asus xonar simultaneously right? or you use one or the other ...

 

If you mean using the ODAC as a DAC to the Xonar (to have access to its surround sound features), then you cannot. But it is of course possible to play separate audio streams on both at the same time.

post #467 of 3396
Quote:
Originally Posted by glunteer View Post

HiFiMeDiy Sabre or ODAC give a better result than my asus xonar dx? they get along with my fiio e11?

 

I am not entirely sure about the Xonar DX, but the Xonar D1 (which in theory is the same card as the DX, but with a PCI interface instead of PCIe, and a slightly different PCB layout), according to my tests, is comparable to the ODAC, and should be transparent in theory if it works without problems (no ground loop, no significant EMI, no bad power supply, etc.). It is also better - although it might not be an audible difference - than the RMAA results posted for the HiFiMeDiy DAC, but I do not know how accurate those are, because there are many things people can get wrong with loopback tests, and RMAA does not test the devices very extensively anyway (for example, it would fail to detect the clipping problems of the NuForce uDAC2). Considering its low price, it would be interesting to see more detailed and reliable tests of the HiFiMeDiy Sabre DAC.

In short, if you do not have interference issues, "upgrading" to the ODAC is probably not worth the money in my opinion. Of course, subjectively the ODAC may still sound better, especially if you expect it to be an improvement.


Edited by stv014 - 11/30/12 at 9:49am
post #468 of 3396

I have a Fiio E9 + E7... Would it be a good idea to just buy the ODAC instead of getting the O2 as well?

In other words, how does the E9 compare as an amp with the O2?

post #469 of 3396
E9 had very high output impedance, which could be problematic with low impedance headphones. O2 suffers from no such problems
post #470 of 3396

What kind of problems does that cause? Is it worth $150 to fix in your opinion?

post #471 of 3396
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tus-Chan View Post

I have a Fiio E9 + E7... Would it be a good idea to just buy the ODAC instead of getting the O2 as well?

In other words, how does the E9 compare as an amp with the O2?

 

I have had both amps... E9 is still neutral but is worse from the technical perspective. I do not find the E9 to be transparent enough. Also, the output impedance of 10 ohms is not very ideal for headphones with impedance up to 80 ohms.

 

It very depends on what you are looking for with an amp... If you want neutrality, transparency, power and versatility (you can use SIPs with your unit in order to use whatever gain you want to get the cleanest amplification), O2 is what you want. If you just need an amp, E9 is good enough.

 

But I have bought O2 w/ ODAC installed inside with my desired look and SIPs for changing gain resistors and cannot be happier... I am not planning to purchase anything else regardless the phone I am going to use :-) It's just perfect...

post #472 of 3396
Originally Posted by USAudio View Post
Originally Posted by kiteki View Post

Yup it's $42 versus $99 / $149 for pretty much the exact same DAC, and then he has $57 - 107 extra to spend on the amplifier!!

Here are some RMAA results, all very far beyond audible limits if you want to ask the odac designer - http://alkasar.online.fr/mesures/HifiMeDIY%20SABRE%2024-96%20DAC%20v1.htm
Hmmm, they may use similar chips but the implementations look quite different, so I don't know if we can say they are exactly the same. Also, the price difference is likely due to the fact the ODAC is designed and made in the USA. The HifiMeDIY is likely made in China.

 

Hifimediy is a team of Europeans and Chinese selling various DIY audio components, the $42 ES9023 is their only non-diy, finished product.  It's made in and ships from Zurich, Switzerland, I think.

 

Since I trust my hearing a lot more than measurements (especially RMAA), it's not fair I say they are exactly the same, no.  I think a dScope analysis and several accounts of listening tests would be nice.

 

 

Originally Posted by randomkid View Post

Check out the Stoner Acoustics UD100 DAC, $50 and ClieOS has compared it to the ODAC and its nearly as good.

 

There is that one too, yeah.

 

 

Originally Posted by glunteer View Post

HiFiMeDiy Sabre or ODAC give a better result than my asus xonar dx? they get along with my fiio e11?

 

I'd vote the Hifimediy.  Then later you can use it's optical out, and put the $100 you saved towards a Yamaha reciver with optical in and 5.1.

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post #473 of 3396
Originally Posted by randomkid View Post

E9 had very high output impedance, which could be problematic with low impedance headphones. O2 suffers from no such problems

 

Originally Posted by Tus-Chan View Post

What kind of problems does that cause? Is it worth $150 to fix in your opinion?

 

The 6.5mm jack on your E9 has 10 ohm output impedance which is fine and very common.  The 3.5mm jack has 43 ohm output impedance which can cause issues in for example 16 ohm products, you can try both jacks and hear the difference for yourself.

post #474 of 3396

By testing through a rapid switch with my Q701 (adapter plugged into 6.3 unscrewed), I'm surprised at how much of a difference there is. It's weird. The 3.5 is not anywhere near as loud, and it sounds a bit different, though I can't put my finger on why.

post #475 of 3396

Thanks for everyone's help ... on second thought, I'll still stick with my xonar dx + FiiO e11 ... 'll save money and buy a better headphone ... thank you!

post #476 of 3396

Ah, well there may be more differences in the 6.5mm versus 3.5mm jacks than output impedance alone, idk.  If you already have the Fiio E9 + E7 I don't think you desperately need to invest in the ODAC or the O2.

 

The ODAC / O2 project revolves around dScope measurements, accuracy, and concepts of what we can / can't hear.  There are other EE's using the exact same dScope with very different ideas on what we can hear, so take the project with some salt when it comes to how much you need to invest for self-titled "perfect sound".

post #477 of 3396

Well, if anything, I want to get a better DAC than an E7. I've got no use for a large portable amp (I'm of the opinion that, in real portable use in noisy environments, you're not going to notice a difference for it to be worth the inconvenience), and I'm fine with the E9 (I really love the form factor).

 

I mean, my Sansa Clip+ probably has a better DAC than the E7.

 

(not really, but I've just never really been very impressed with the E7 as a standalone or an amp.)


Edited by Tus-Chan - 11/30/12 at 12:59pm
post #478 of 3396

I've never heard the E7, but my favorite sounding DAC's were using a Cirrus Logic CS4398 or AKM AK4396 as the core chip.  I've seen their popularity on diyaudio.com as well, so there is most likely something to it.

 

Yaya, I know, it's not the baseball players skill / efficiency which counts, it's how you implement the team, lol.

 

I know, massive portable amplifiers are the suck-ness, and the really slim ones I'm yet to hear any 'real' kind of ampliifer sound from them.

post #479 of 3396
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tus-Chan View Post

Well, if anything, I want to get a better DAC than an E7. I've got no use for a large portable amp (I'm of the opinion that, in real portable use in noisy environments, you're not going to notice a difference for it to be worth the inconvenience), and I'm fine with the E9 (I really love the form factor).

 

I mean, my Sansa Clip+ probably has a better DAC than the E7.

 

(not really, but I've just never really been very impressed with the E7 as a standalone or an amp.)

 

From what I've read about E7 not offering complete 16bit depth in reality and their measurements not being very impressive, I would also at least upgrade on E17...

post #480 of 3396
Quote:
Originally Posted by MHOE View Post

 

From what I've read about E7 not offering complete 16bit depth in reality and their measurements not being very impressive, I would also at least upgrade on E17...

If I recall correctly, "Voldemort" really liked the E7 considering its price. I'm guessing the E17 will only be better considering it has the same DAC but with more options. I own an E7 and find it to be a good companion with my laptop for mobile use.

 

This isn't totally related to the O2/ODAC itself, but is there a place other than eBay where I could purchase a short 3.5mm male-male cable for cheap? I lost the one that came with the E7 so I can't hook up my Clip Zip to the O2.

All of the cables I've seen are ~$10. Seriously, $10 for a 3-4 inch cable?

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