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12 Extremely Disappointing Facts About Popular Music - Page 3

post #31 of 92
Quote:
Originally Posted by Radio_head View Post

Some of the top of the billboard charts from one of my favorite years, 1968:

(snip)
There was a point when great music on the radio (ie popluar music) was the rule rather than the exception.

If the average person demanded more - more substance, melody, harmonics, variety, talent, originality, variation - then that would be the stuff on the radio (there's still some good music coming out but you have to look for it.)  Pop music's decline merely mirrors the general populace's real interest in music as something other than background in the car, at work, or in the club.


There was great music that year, but there was also completely forgettable crap that year. Pop music has the capacity for greatness, but it's governed by Sturgeon's Law like everything else.
post #32 of 92
Quote:
Originally Posted by MaZa View Post

I think we should clarify a bit. There is Pop music, and then there are conveyor belt "pop music" products. This article was clearly about the latter one. There are honest to God good singers, real artists in pop music and then there is garbage created by record companies to create money. Shooting stars that shine bright for few hits and then die down when the next one shows up.


Yeah, I agree with this. It's kind of where I wanted to go with my last post but it didn't really end up there.

post #33 of 92
Quote:
Originally Posted by rroseperry View Post


There was great music that year, but there was also completely forgettable crap that year. Pop music has the capacity for greatness, but it's governed by Sturgeon's Law like everything else.

I agree, I've read almost all of Theodore Sturgeon's works and I'd say a good 90% of his works are crap.

 

In a musical sense - sure, I'll roll with you that there was a similar percentage of junk that was released in total, but what if there were just more discerning listeners back then and a higher percentage of the junk was filtered out?  What if there were DJ's with real musical backgrounds and unique tastes who opted for the 10% much more than 10% of the time?  What you end up with is the same amount of junk but it is not all necessarily as popular.

 

To condense - The junk will always be there, but whether or not it's popular is for the populace to decide.

post #34 of 92

Decide on a list that you guys find really disapoinintg...and Call Me Maybe?

post #35 of 92

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DA NANANA NAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA NA DA NANANA NAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA NA

post #36 of 92
Quote:
Originally Posted by Radio_head View Post

I agree, I've read almost all of Theodore Sturgeon's works and I'd say a good 90% of his works are crap.

In a musical sense - sure, I'll roll with you that there was a similar percentage of junk that was released in total, but what if there were just more discerning listeners back then and a higher percentage of the junk was filtered out?  What if there were DJ's with real musical backgrounds and unique tastes who opted for the 10% much more than 10% of the time?  What you end up with is the same amount of junk but it is not all necessarily as popular.

To condense - The junk will always be there, but whether or not it's popular is for the populace to decide.

But the populace always chooses junk. Here's the Billboard top 100 from 1968

1. Hey Jude The Beatles
2. I Heard It Through The Grapevine Marvin Gaye
3. Love Is Blue Paul Mauriat
4. Love Child Diana Ross &The Supremes
5. Honey Bobby Goldsboro
6. Sittin' On The Dock Of The Bay Otis Redding
7. People Got To Be Free The Rascals
8. This Guy's In Love With You Herb Alpert
9. Judy In Disguise (With Glasses) John Fred &His Playboy Band
10. Woman Woman Gary Puckett &The Union Gap
11. Mrs. Robinson Simon &Garfunkel
12. Who's Making Love Johnnie Taylor
13. Hello I Love You The Doors
14. Tighten Up Archie Bell &The Drells
15. Young Girl Gary Puckett &The Union Gap
16. Harper Valley Pta Jeannie C. Riley
17. Those Were The Days Mary Hopkin
18. Little Green Apples O.C. Smith
19. The Good, The Bad And The Ugly Hugo Montenegro
20. Bend Me, Shape Me American Breed
21. Cry Like A Baby The Box Tops
22. Magic Carpet Ride Steppenwolf
23. Green Tambourine The Lemon Pipers
24. Midnight Confessions The Grass Roots
25. For Once In My Life Stevie Wonder
26. It's A Beautiful Morning The Rascals
27. Spooky Classics Iv
28. Abraham, Martin And John Dion
29. Stoned Soul Picnic 5th Dimension
30. Chain Of Fools Aretha Franklin
31. Mony Mony Tommy James &The Shondells
32. Classical Gas Mason Williams
33. Cowboys To Girls The Intruders
34. I Love How You Love Me Bobby Vinton
35. The Ballad Of Bonnie And Clyde Georgie Fame
36. I've Gotta Get A Message To You Bee Gees
37. Grazing In The Grass Hugh Masekela
38. Angel Of The Morning Merrilee Rush &The Turnabouts
39. Fire Crazy World Of Arthur Brown
40. (Theme From) Valley Of The Dolls Dionne Warwick
41. Born To Be Wild Steppenwolf
42. The Horse Cliff Nobles &Co.
43. Lady Willpower Gary Puckett &The Union Gap
44. Slip Away Clarence Carter
45. I Wish It Would Rain The Temptations
46. Jumpin' Jack Flash The Rolling Stones
47. Light My Fire Jose Feliciano
48. (Sweet Sweet Baby) Since You've Been Gone Aretha Franklin
49. La-La Means I Love You The Delfonics
50. Girl Watcher The O'kaysions
51. Different Drum Stone Poneys F/Linda Ronstadt
52. Stormy Classics Iv F/ Dennis Yost
53. Yummy Yummy Yummy Ohio Express
54. Hold Me Tight Johnny Nash
55. The Look Of Love Sergio Mendes & Brazil 66
56. Sunshine Of Your Love Cream
57. Dance To The Music Sly &The Family Stone
58. Turn Around Look At Me The Vogues
59. Over You Gary Puckett &The Union Gap
60. Reach Out Of The Darkness Friend And Lover
61. Simon Says 19l0 Fruitgum Co.
62. Revolution The Beatles
63. Bottle Of Wine The Fireballs
64. Lady Madonna The Beatles
65. Love Is All Around The Troggs
66. Macarthur Park Richard Harris
67. Take Time To Know Her Percy Sledge
68. Hurdy Gurdy Man Donovan
69. White Room Cream
70. I Got The Feelin' James Brown
71. Nobody But Me The Human Beinz
72. 1,2,3, Red Light 1910 Fruitgum Co.
73. Think Aretha Franklin
74. You Keep Me Hangin' On Vanilla Fudge
75. Goin' Out Of My Head/Can't Take My Eyes Off You The Lettermen
76. The Unicorn The Irish Rovers
77. Baby, Now That I've Found You The Foundations
78. Ain't Nothing Like The Real Thing Marvin Gaye And Tammi Terrell
79. The Fool On The Hill Sergio Mendes &Brazil '66
80. Susan The Buckinghams
81. Time Has Come Today Chambers Brothers
82. I Say A Little Prayer Aretha Franklin
83. Indian Lake The Cowsills
84. I Thank You Sam And Dave
85. Elenore The Turtles
86. Hush Deep Purple
87. Here Comes The Judge Shorty Long
88. My Special Angel The Vogues
89. I Wonder What She's Doing Tonite Tommy Boyce &Bobby Hart
90. Stay In My Corner The Dells
91. Both Sides Now Judy Collins
92. The House That Jack Built Aretha Franklin
93. You're All I Need To Get By Marvin Gaye And Tammi Terrell
94. The Mighty Quinn (Quinn The Eskimo] Manfred Mann
95. Suzie Q (Part One) Creedence Clearwater Revival
96. Do You Know The Way To San Jose Dionne Warwick
97. If You Can Want Smokey Robinson &The Miracles
98. Say It Loud-I'm Black And I'm Proud (Part 1) James Brown
99. I Love You People
100. Piece Of My Heart Big Brother &The Holding Company

of 100, I think many people would say 30% of the songs on that list are junk. For my personal list of completely forgettable trash, it goes up to 44%. I don't think the DJ were any more selective, (To be fair there wasn't Clear Channel then, but on the other hand, payola.) I definitely don't think that listeners were any more discerning either.

(edit to add: About Sturgeon, considering he wasn't as prolific as other writers of the period, saying 90% of his work is trash is hyperbolic. It hasn't aged well, but More Than Human is still good sf.)
Edited by rroseperry - 7/6/12 at 8:44am
post #37 of 92

To each their own, I guess.  On the Billboard Top 100 from 2011, there were less than 10 songs that I found bearable.  Of that 1968 list, it's more like 70 songs.  The DJ thought was offhand and unsubstantiated, just a possible theory.  The public certainly seems less discerning than they used to be, and this is largely from want of any kind of musical education.  In this study for instance, while schools in CA had 6% more attendance from '99 to '04, music classes were cut by 50%, which is 4 times more than any other class. Participation in general music courses dropped by over 85%.  Anecdotally, (I've never seen a study to back this up) there was a point in the 50's-60's when everyone in America's burgeoning middle class seemed to be taking music lessons, whether as a sign of affluence or because they suddenly had an opportunity that didn't exist in previous generations.  Obviously, this doesn't mean any individual is more discerning than a particular individual from 2012, but as a general rule I don't think it outlandish to consider the public more musically attuned.  

 

Whether this affects what is on the radio is a matter of debate.  (The old "does media affect society or vice versa" argument.) 

post #38 of 92
Quote:
Originally Posted by Radio_head View Post

To each their own, I guess.  On the Billboard Top 100 from 2011, there were less than 10 songs that I found bearable.  Of that 1968 list, it's more like 70 songs.  The DJ thought was offhand and unsubstantiated, just a possible theory.  The public certainly seems less discerning than they used to be, and this is largely from want of any kind of musical education.  In this study for instance, while schools in CA had 6% more attendance from '99 to '04, music classes were cut by 50%, which is 4 times more than any other class. Participation in general music courses dropped by over 85%.  Anecdotally, (I've never seen a study to back this up) there was a point in the 50's-60's when everyone in America's burgeoning middle class seemed to be taking music lessons, whether as a sign of affluence or because they suddenly had an opportunity that didn't exist in previous generations.  Obviously, this doesn't mean any individual is more discerning than a particular individual from 2012, but as a general rule I don't think it outlandish to consider the public more musically attuned.  

Whether this affects what is on the radio is a matter of debate.  (The old "does media affect society or vice versa" argument.) 

in full disclosure, I don't listen to much radio at all and most of what I hear, I don't much care for. I guess my real argument is against the idea of a golden age of pop music, with the implication that we've moved past the iron age, to something like the compost or recycled plastic age. I think there's as much creativity and excellence in popular music as there ever was, but the stuff that gets through the filters, that's pushed out through the airwaves, doesn't capture what's going on. I read Bob Lefletz (sp?) emails and I think he has it right. The music moguls are operating with an out-dated paradigm, which means that the mainstream is lots of "well, that's what sold last year" and junk. At the same time, there's some excellent stuff around, but the modes of distribution have really changed and you find stuff out in other ways than listening to the radio.

As far as music education and the decline thereof, you get no argument from me at all.
post #39 of 92

I think we are essentially agreeing- great stuff is still around, but not as much of it ends up being popular/on the radio these days, whatever the exact reason may be.

post #40 of 92

I totally disagree with the idea that modern pop music is disappointing.  To start off, I think that it needs to be said that I don't believe in albums that have perfection production.  Perfect production is subjective and varies from person to person.  For instance, I believe that Bjork's "Vespertine" has a perfect production.  It's very precise, intricate, delicate, and has a great sound stage.  I also feel that M.I.A.'s /\/\ /\ Y /\ was a perfectly produced album.  This album is very raw and you hear pops, clicks, and random noises all of the place.  M.I.A. and her producers engineered the album to sound like it wasn't mastered, even though they spent a great deal of time perfecting it.  It's a different type of production than what is found on Vespertine.  /\/\ /\ Y /\'s production isn't a flawless, glossy, or perfected, but I still feel like the album is perfectly produced.  This is a great example showing how production is subjective.


With that in mind, I also listen to a lot of modern hits that can be found on top 40 radio.  I bought Flo Rida's album a few days ago, actually.  There is nothing wrong with this music.  It is built to unite many people and to jam out to.  Nothing more.  I don't understand why some of you can't dance to music?  Why does it always have to be about creating something new and groundbreaking? I own many underground progressive albums that have a unique and developed sound, but I also own a lot of modern dance music.  Remember that music is subjective. Pop music is fine being just what it is.  Stop being so whiny, everything in life doesn't have to be deep and meaningful.  I don't understand why you can't like both groundbreaking music and music created just for fun.  

post #41 of 92
Quote:
Originally Posted by elegantlie View Post

I totally disagree with the idea that modern pop music is disappointing.  To start off, I think that it needs to be said that I don't believe in albums that have perfection production.  Perfect production is subjective and varies from person to person.  For instance, I believe that Bjork's "Vespertine" has a perfect production.  It's very precise, intricate, delicate, and has a great sound stage.  I also feel that M.I.A.'s /\/\ /\ Y /\ was a perfectly produced album.  This album is very raw and you hear pops, clicks, and random noises all of the place.  M.I.A. and her producers engineered the album to sound like it wasn't mastered, even though they spent a great deal of time perfecting it.  It's a different type of production than what is found on Vespertine.  /\/\ /\ Y /\'s production isn't a flawless, glossy, or perfected, but I still feel like the album is perfectly produced.  This is a great example showing how production is subjective.


With that in mind, I also listen to a lot of modern hits that can be found on top 40 radio.  I bought Flo Rida's album a few days ago, actually.  There is nothing wrong with this music.  It is built to unite many people and to jam out to.  Nothing more.  I don't understand why some of you can't dance to music?  Why does it always have to be about creating something new and groundbreaking? I own many underground progressive albums that have a unique and developed sound, but I also own a lot of modern dance music.  Remember that music is subjective. Pop music is fine being just what it is.  Stop being so whiny, everything in life doesn't have to be deep and meaningful.  I don't understand why you can't like both groundbreaking music and music created just for fun.  

I'm the same way...but every generation is different. This is a thread for people that prefer the last gen and pre last gen music tastes which I also like as well but I also like modern ones. IT will take hell and high water to change a person's music tastes. I just like reading what they have to say or think about as I like the songs they like as well in addition to flo rida and all those new artists.

 

Talking about buying new modern music. I bought some on amazon yesterday to test out amazon's cloud service and thie r MP3 selection and quality.....NEVER AGAIN....iTunes or CD from now on.......... I'm proceeding to delete the songs I bought as they were just terrible quality.... I will not kid you on saying that the songs they have are NOT MP3 256kbps quality that you would find if you personally took a CD and ripped it in MP3 256kbps......this sounds like if you took a CD and ripped it in MP3 128kbps (leaving 64kbps per channel or more or less depending on joint audio and stuff like that).....

post #42 of 92
Quote:
Originally Posted by bowei006 View Post

I'm the same way...but every generation is different. This is a thread for people that prefer the last gen and pre last gen music tastes which I also like as well but I also like modern ones. IT will take hell and high water to change a person's music tastes. I just like reading what they have to say or think about as I like the songs they like as well in addition to flo rida and all those new artists.

 

I totally agree, but I still can't stand people ranting about "the music industry's downfall."  It just so happens that I don't enjoy last generations music, but I don't think it's bad nor do I create threads complaining about it.  The key here I think is that each person has their specific taste in music.  If a certain type of music exists, it must mean that somebody likes it.  

 

Just because it's personally not your taste doesn't mean it's bad.  It's simply not your taste.  That's about where the discussion should end, imo. 

post #43 of 92
Quote:
Originally Posted by elegantlie View Post

 

I totally agree, but I still can't stand people ranting about "the music industry's downfall."  It just so happens that I don't enjoy last generations music, but I don't think it's bad nor do I create threads complaining about it.  The key here I think is that each person has their specific taste in music.  If a certain type of music exists, it must mean that somebody likes it.  

 

Just because it's personally not your taste doesn't mean it's bad.  It's simply not your taste.  That's about where the discussion should end, imo. 

Majority of audiophiles that actually know what they are talking about and have gear are more for last generation music. It's a majority we can't counter and although I also don't like it in that sense... there is some truth that is comming. Although one can also argue that the losing of audio quality and all that is from progression and is just a "new wave" of the world. 

 

We may not like it...but a predominant amount of head fiers that come here regularly like old and previous gen music(I don't like to use the word old....but well, I'll use it) so as it's a popular thing amongst the users. There will be a thread on it and etc etc.

post #44 of 92
Almost all of the CDs I buy are of music from the 60s and 70s. Most of the music produced after 1985 is imo rather bad. What happened? Why is there so much good music from the 60s and 70s, and so much awful music after that?
post #45 of 92
Quote:
Originally Posted by JK1 View Post

Almost all of the CDs I buy are of music from the 60s and 70s. Most of the music produced after 1985 is imo rather bad. What happened? Why is there so much good music from the 60s and 70s, and so much awful music after that?

Every generation has a rebel group and wanting to be different. The groups in the 20's did it, 60's, and so on and so on.  20's and 60's were two big musical and new generation stars. We currently have another one. The parents or seasoned previous gen music listeners of that time said the same thing about 20's and 60's(and so on) music. This is the same.

 

You guys here will probably enjoy this as I found it hilarious as well:

 

 

Amusing video

 

 

Best parst:

http://youtu.be/WgII2gDY-Rw?hd=1&t=4m58s

http://youtu.be/WgII2gDY-Rw?hd=1&t=3m23s

http://youtu.be/WgII2gDY-Rw?hd=1&t=6m1s  (watch this part for a bit, the next part after is pretty funny too) Watch to 6:34 lol

 

 

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