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Grado PS1000, very mixed and not review like impressions. - Page 9

post #121 of 193
Quote:
Originally Posted by maconhel View Post

I have a detailed picture..

 

 

Very nice ;) so you also own this other Grado flagship!

 

Is your pair the one with the blemish near it's edge?

 

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by shimmer n roar View Post

as i said, i can't account for the differences in weight between the two headphones. maybe it is due to variations in the weight of the constituent components. 30 grams really isn't a lot of weight per se. wood does vary in density and weight regardless of the dimensions. maybe the heavier pair contained denser mahogany wood inner chambers. how do you know that there aren't variations in the density and weight of the foam pads? maybe there was more cable sitting on the scales for one of the measurements than the other. i really don't know and neither do you, but to claim that the differences in the finish of the metal cups and the weight of the two headphones is due to a change in the "recipe" for the alloy is just baseless speculation. why don't you approach grado for an explanation?

 

It's a 47.7 grams difference. I think it's a huge inconsistency and a lot of divergence between two pairs of the exact same headphone (model). The cables had to be rolled up and between the headband and the cups on the balance. The post contained a lot pictures and the whole thread was discussing about it, and the owner was being systematic in his descriptions. Yes it was in China, but they were taking the issue even more seriously than we do here... and just like us, they are also find Grado's QC for their flagship lacking, as in "wang quality fu control ming troubled, yei Grado, xhaoblabla" poorly translated by Google. The pairs didn't sounded the same either according to the owner, one seemed bass-heavier.

 

I'm juggling with my RS-1 right now, it weights next to nothing. What is the weight of just two standard mahogany inserts versus a denser one? 10 grams versus 12 grams, 20-25 grams? Not a 47.7 grams difference. Do you really expect two wooden inserts sets of different density to differ by more than 15x2 = 30 grams?

 

I'm 99% certain Grado foam never changed, or at least from 2009 to 2012. If their shape stood the same, their density also. Only around 2000 when the bowls were introduced did a paradox change might have occurred. They've been making foam pads (well, outsourced in China, so they're not manufacturing them) since 1989 and with consistency. If you own two Grados and that their pads feel different it's because a previous owner washed his with shampoo because he had comfort issue or for hygienic motives. Grado also knows how much the slightest discrepancy would affect their sound, as Grado sound and airiness-ness is strongly influenced by the pads (and probably foam quality).

 

The headband leather also changed a few times. But again, it's not a 10-15 grams difference, and I don't think the wood either, personally.


Edited by devouringone3 - 8/17/12 at 1:15am
post #122 of 193

47.7 grams - i stand corrected. again, i can't account for the increased weight of just one ps1000. let's not forget that well over a thousand have been made. sorry, but i'm not prepared to accept on your say so and based on what you've seen at a website, that the differences in finish for an unknown number of ps1000 production units and a weight discrepancy for a single ps1000 production unit, is proof positive that the composition of the alloy cups has changed. if you'd rather perpetuate an unsubstantiated belief than approach the manufacturer for an explanation, then that is your prerogative. however, there's a difference between poor quality control and what you are claiming. anyone familiar with grado accepts that qc has never been their strong suit.

post #123 of 193

You're totally right, I will go edit and change some of my post + the description of these two photos in my Grado Science album.

 

I realized I was alluding to something that could just as well (if not more likely) not be the case, being aware myself that Grado likes to go up and down repeatedly and very much randomly, actually. It's just their usual variation and a change of finish; two dots on a graph doesn't mean much, I shall not make it a tendency!


Edited by devouringone3 - 8/17/12 at 2:37pm
post #124 of 193

Mine #202 have the #184 type of finish. I haven't weighed them, though. ;)

post #125 of 193
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gradofan2 View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by priest View Post

 

If you value soundstage highly, is it really that difficult of a choice?

smile.gif

 

Yes... my RS-1's have a fairly large soundstage - not much different than my PS1000's, especially with the stadium pads (G Cushions).  As I said... it's merely a function of mating them with a setup, which matches their electronic requirements well (i.e. low impedence, high current output).  Many (perhaps most) have never really heard the RS-1's, or many Grados, for that matter. 

 

Strange, my PS1000 wipes the floor with the RS1i in depth. We must have very different ears, or very different production units.

post #126 of 193

yeah, that's a very interesting comment....I've always heard that the the PS1k had a far larger sound stage than the RS-1

post #127 of 193
Quote:
Originally Posted by Focker View Post

yeah, that's a very interesting comment....I've always heard that the the PS1k had a far larger sound stage than the RS-1

It's not the driver from them that matter, but the "Jumbo" pad in PS1000 instead that make that huge different of soundstage.

post #128 of 193

i suspect there's more to it than that. the drivers in the ps1000 and gs1000(i) would be tuned for use with the g cush pads, whereas the drivers in the rs1(i) are not.

post #129 of 193
Quote:
Originally Posted by shimmer n roar View Post

i suspect there's more to it than that. the drivers in the ps1000 and gs1000(i) would be tuned for use with the g cush pads, whereas the drivers in the rs1(i) are not.

Yeah I agree, and it's supposed to be like that.

 

But for example if you put G-Cush pad to SR60i, then they will have huge soundstage too in instant.

post #130 of 193

there will be a large soundstage in height and width, but imaging precision and depth/ layering will still be poor. that's more of a factor of the drivers.

post #131 of 193
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheMiddleSky View Post

Yeah I agree, and it's supposed to be like that.

 

But for example if you put G-Cush pad to SR60i, then they will have huge soundstage too in instant.

 

i suppose so but at the expense of frequency balance. i've read posts where hf2 owners put g cush pads on them in the hope of turning them into something approaching a ps1000 and it knocked the frequency balance out of kilter. so you gain an increase in soundstage and a corresponding decrease in sound quality. 

post #132 of 193
Quote:
Originally Posted by shimmer n roar View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by TheMiddleSky View Post

Yeah I agree, and it's supposed to be like that.

 

But for example if you put G-Cush pad to SR60i, then they will have huge soundstage too in instant.

 

i suppose so but at the expense of frequency balance. i've read posts where hf2 owners put g cush pads on them in the hope of turning them into something approaching a ps1000 and it knocked the frequency balance out of kilter. so you gain an increase in soundstage and a corresponding decrease in sound quality. 

You also gain more comfort.

post #133 of 193

When I worked my way up the Grado chain (owning all of them except the SR80i, some of them twice), I freely swapped the S-cushions and L-cushions on all models up to the RS1i. Maybe I'm jumping to conclusions, but I never put G-cushions on the lower models. Their size is just too extreme, and I would imagine that, as shimmer n roar asserts, the drivers have to be specifically tuned for that kind of cushion to produce the desired effect. I am also highly skeptical that soundstage is simply a function of distance of a driver from the ears. I no longer own the RS1i, but I will try G-cushions on my RS2i, to see what happens. In any event, I do perceive soundstage differences between the GS1000i and PS1000, which would not be possible if soundstage were merely a function of the size of the cushion.

post #134 of 193

Another easy way to experience how significant changing pads can affect the soundstage is by swapping g-cushion on PS1000/GS1000 with bowl pad. wink.gif

 

I'm not saying SR60i/RS1i/GS1000/PS1000 has the same size (quantity and quality) of soundstage, but my point is, the pad itself is the most matter for soundstage size.

post #135 of 193
Quote:
Originally Posted by priest View Post

When I worked my way up the Grado chain (owning all of them except the SR80i, some of them twice), I freely swapped the S-cushions and L-cushions on all models up to the RS1i. Maybe I'm jumping to conclusions, but I never put G-cushions on the lower models. Their size is just too extreme, and I would imagine that, as shimmer n roar asserts, the drivers have to be specifically tuned for that kind of cushion to produce the desired effect. I am also highly skeptical that soundstage is simply a function of distance of a driver from the ears. I no longer own the RS1i, but I will try G-cushions on my RS2i, to see what happens. In any event, I do perceive soundstage differences between the GS1000i and PS1000, which would not be possible if soundstage were merely a function of the size of the cushion.

 

yes, i suspect there's more to it than that. no doubt the more technically minded amongst us could explain it. i've seen similar comments regarding the soundstage of the gs1000(i) compared to the ps1000.

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