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TURNTABLE SETUP Questions thread - don't start a new thread, ASK YOUR QUESTION HERE! - Page 67

post #991 of 2630
Quote:
Originally Posted by BLACKENEDPLAGUE View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Silent One View Post

No one does biz with their biggrin.gif local Pharmacy? I'm po', so I use the Fremer featured Aquafina! Wash, rinse and then rinse again after the fact.

>Aquafina

>poor

 

Don't even get me started sir/madam, I'm back for less than a month and would like to stay unbanned this time

 

Hey dt880smile.png I'm with you! I gotta lighten the mood 'round head-fi sometimes...

post #992 of 2630
Quote:
Originally Posted by Silent One View Post

 

Hey dt880smile.png I'm with you! I gotta lighten the mood 'round head-fi sometimes...

Since Aquafina kept popping up, I had to google it since over here it is not distributed. As it is a Pepsi brand, there was an immediate association with the movie by the enfant terrible director of what used to be Yugoslavia, Dusan Makavejev :

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rvDbH6ahpOo

 

It includes the best coke jingle ever written - that will never get used by the official Coca Cola company. Check out why...

post #993 of 2630
Quote:
Originally Posted by analogsurviver View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Silent One View Post

 

Hey dt880smile.png I'm with you! I gotta lighten the mood 'round head-fi sometimes...

Since Aquafina kept popping up, I had to google it since over here it is not distributed. As it is a Pepsi brand, there was an immediate association with the movie by the enfant terrible director of what used to be Yugoslavia, Dusan Makavejev :

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rvDbH6ahpOo

 

It includes the best coke jingle ever written - that will never get used by the official Coca Cola company. Check out why...

 

Thanks, analoguesurviver. But, @ 1 hour plus, I'd better watch later tonight. And while I've got you here (Skylab and others feel free to weigh-in), hypothetically if I budgeted $1,000 - $1,500 for a new cart, what are some of the better pairings for the MMF-7?

 

My phono stage inside the big Pioneer does MM/MC, so not worried...


Edited by Silent One - 3/10/13 at 11:25am
post #994 of 2630
Quote:
Originally Posted by Silent One View Post

 

Thanks, analoguesurviver. But, @ 1 hour plus, I'd better watch later tonight. And while I've got you here (Skylab and others feel free to weigh-in), hypothetically if I budgeted $1,000 - $1,500 for a new cart, what are some of the better pairings for the MMF-7?

 

My phono stage inside the big Pioneer does MM/MC, so not worried...

Unfortunately not too familiar with MMF - I understand they are made in the same factory as Pro-ject in Czech Republic, share parts ( arms ) - etc - but they are "cosa nostra" of the US - never saw a MMF in flesh.

 

I have also no experience with Pioneer receivers with MC inputs - no idea how much hum breaktrough is in phono from the big power transformer, but it can not be as good as a preamplifier, even if it does share the same circuit. So, avoiding really LOMC ( below 0.3 mV ) is perhaps safe advice.

 

What sound you are after - something neutral/analytic or more lush sounding ? Do you satisfy yourself with relatively modest/small soundstage - or you long for "Pigs In Space" ( the sound from the Muppet Show ...gargantuan soundstage ) type of spatial representation ?

 

A really good one from the neutral/analytic/reasonable-but-definitely-not-Pigs-In-Space camp is Dynavector 17D3 http://www.musicdirect.com/p-6978-dynavector-17d3-karat-mc-cartridge.aspx

that is within your hypothetical budget. 

http://www.tnt-audio.com/sorgenti/dynavector_17d_e.html

 

But BEFORE shelling out that kind of money , I would canibalize AT120E from your Sony and try it on the MMF. I think I know what is bothering you with the Goldring - and ATs do not have that malady. If it proves it is to your liking, you might consider a better stylus ( ATN440Mla, ATN150MLX, maybe even ATN150ANV ) - but any cartridge change brings along test record, tracking force gauge, alignment protractor and all that jazz - including to learn how to use it.

Practicing on AT120E ( or anything yet cheaper/expendable) and any possible "oopses" along the way is a better idea than doing your first cart change with your latest/costliest acquisition.

 

For the more spatial reproduction, my usual advice would have been a Benz - but since it is a bit uncertain at the moment how things will be in the future, I tend to hesitate to do that.

 

It is an ungrateful price segment - it is a lot of money, yet I did single out the DV17D3 as perhaps the most bang for the buck. Or not - because it can not be retipped PROPERLY and it is a bit pricey when the time comes http://www.needledoctor.com/New/Dynavector-Retip-Exchanges. A VdH or Benz initially cost more, but diamond retipping is far less expensive - that is also one of the reasons behind their popularity. Doing it three or more times if it proves to your liking - do the math ...

post #995 of 2630
Quote:
Originally Posted by analogsurviver View Post
Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Silent One View Post

 

Thanks, analoguesurviver. But, @ 1 hour plus, I'd better watch later tonight. And while I've got you here (Skylab and others feel free to weigh-in), hypothetically if I budgeted $1,000 - $1,500 for a new cart, what are some of the better pairings for the MMF-7?

 

My phono stage inside the big Pioneer does MM/MC, so not worried...

Unfortunately not too familiar with MMF - I understand they are made in the same factory as Pro-ject in Czech Republic, share parts ( arms ) - etc - but they are "cosa nostra" of the US - never saw a MMF in flesh.

 

I have also no experience with Pioneer receivers with MC inputs - no idea how much hum breaktrough is in phono from the big power transformer, but it can not be as good as a preamplifier, even if it does share the same circuit. So, avoiding really LOMC ( below 0.3 mV ) is perhaps safe advice.

 

What sound you are after - something neutral/analytic or more lush sounding ? Do you satisfy yourself with relatively modest/small soundstage - or you long for "Pigs In Space" ( the sound from the Muppet Show ...gargantuan soundstage ) type of spatial representation ?

 

A really good one from the neutral/analytic/reasonable-but-definitely-not-Pigs-In-Space camp is Dynavector 17D3 http://www.musicdirect.com/p-6978-dynavector-17d3-karat-mc-cartridge.aspx

that is within your hypothetical budget. 

http://www.tnt-audio.com/sorgenti/dynavector_17d_e.html

 

But BEFORE shelling out that kind of money , I would canibalize AT120E from your Sony and try it on the MMF. I think I know what is bothering you with the Goldring - and ATs do not have that malady. If it proves it is to your liking, you might consider a better stylus ( ATN440Mla, ATN150MLX, maybe even ATN150ANV ) - but any cartridge change brings along test record, tracking force gauge, alignment protractor and all that jazz - including to learn how to use it.

Practicing on AT120E ( or anything yet cheaper/expendable) and any possible "oopses" along the way is a better idea than doing your first cart change with your latest/costliest acquisition.

 

For the more spatial reproduction, my usual advice would have been a Benz - but since it is a bit uncertain at the moment how things will be in the future, I tend to hesitate to do that.

 

It is an ungrateful price segment - it is a lot of money, yet I did single out the DV17D3 as perhaps the most bang for the buck. Or not - because it can not be retipped PROPERLY and it is a bit pricey when the time comes http://www.needledoctor.com/New/Dynavector-Retip-Exchanges. A VdH or Benz initially cost more, but diamond retipping is far less expensive - that is also one of the reasons behind their popularity. Doing it three or more times if it proves to your liking - do the math ...

 

 

 

On my having the AT120E in the Sony... good memory! My Pioneer stereo receiver isn't suffering from hum out of the phono stage. Yes, going external could bring more joy, but currently not being tripped up in that regard.

 

I remember you made the same comment about the Goldring today as you did a couple of months back, but never expanded your thought. Nothing is bothering me to date - it's more about wanting to compare it to something. In other words, I've no idea what I've got - can it get better for a reasonable price? This is what I aim to find out. The previous owner switched to Benz-Micro and suggested I have a look - forgot which model he had.

 

On the subject of Pro-ject, I noticed my new belt and those used by Music Hall, all have Pro-ject part numbers. Seems, MH submits their drawings for turntables and Pro-ject does the heavy lifting. biggrin.gif

 

Speaking of heavy, that PS-X5 is heavy. When sitting atop a trio of 6 lb brass footers (each) and 4" Maple platforms, the Sony/AT120E combo is a giant killer, considering the $125 price tag. This mounting was temporary at best. Properly mounted, I expect the presentation rise a bit higher. The mids/highs got sweeter, the bottom got tighter/punchier and the overall presentation just bigger...wowza!

 

To be honest, I'm not sure yet if I want my presentation to be s-p-a-c-e-y ("Far out, man") or hard hitting and on point, right where I'm sitting. If I play my cards right, I'll have my forthcoming tube phono stage/preamp and from there, seek seasoning. But if I have the chance to get the cart first, then...

post #996 of 2630
Recently went out to 2 malls, browsed around the music stores. I'm disappointed with the vinyl pricing here in Malaysia. They're well double the price of what's sold online. Vinyls that cost US$17.99 is MYR119 (aboyut US$40). CDs are cheaper, at just about MYR42 (US$14).

Such a waste of money to buy them here. Flea markets is the way to go, but then you can't find newer releases like Adele or Lana Del Rey, not to mention Burial.

My previous TT owner was generous enough to let go of his bundle for just MYR50. After a few months I have 20 vinyl records now smily_headphones1.gif happy man.
post #997 of 2630
Quote:
Originally Posted by Silent One View Post

 

On my having the AT120E in the Sony... good memory! My Pioneer stereo receiver isn't suffering from hum out of the phono stage. Yes, going external could bring more joy, but currently not being tripped up in that regard.

 

I remember you made the same comment about the Goldring today as you did a couple of months back, but never expanded your thought. Nothing is bothering me to date - it's more about wanting to compare it to something. In other words, I've no idea what I've got - can it get better for a reasonable price? This is what I aim to find out. The previous owner switched to Benz-Micro and suggested I have a look - forgot which model he had.

 

On the subject of Pro-ject, I noticed my new belt and those used by Music Hall, all have Pro-ject part numbers. Seems, MH submits their drawings for turntables and Pro-ject does the heavy lifting. biggrin.gif

 

Speaking of heavy, that PS-X5 is heavy. When sitting atop a trio of 6 lb brass footers (each) and 4" Maple platforms, the Sony/AT120E combo is a giant killer, considering the $125 price tag. This mounting was temporary at best. Properly mounted, I expect the presentation rise a bit higher. The mids/highs got sweeter, the bottom got tighter/punchier and the overall presentation just bigger...wowza!

 

To be honest, I'm not sure yet if I want my presentation to be s-p-a-c-e-y ("Far out, man") or hard hitting and on point, right where I'm sitting. If I play my cards right, I'll have my forthcoming tube phono stage/preamp and from there, seek seasoning. But if I have the chance to get the cart first, then...

I have had answer for this post of yours yesterday, in the end hit a wrong button - poof ! Here we go again.

 

If you are basically happy with equipment you have now, leave it at that for a while. I find discovering a new artist or gettting better print of an album more thrill than say a new cartridge - but then again, you have to be at certain level for this to be true. It is like with musical instruments, we can argue ad nuseaum about Stradivari vs Guarnieri vs Any New Violin or Steinway vs Bosendorfer vs Fazioli vs ..... - once the instrument is at a certain high enough level, it is combination of the instrument and how much has the musician grown with it and mastered it. One can always nitpick beyond reason, but like changing the instrument, requiring certain changes in the playing in order to achieve the "same" sound as before and hopefully pick up from there, phono is much the same thing. It is risky to go changing say your phono preamp for a significantly different design - if you are happy with your present setup - it may well mean you will discover things better unheard unless your piggybank has no limits.

 

Now, spatial reproduction will always be problematic - how much "space" should there be. It can be deceiving, to say the least. If your stylus is anything less than the ultimate possible ( Micro Line/Ridge/Reach/SAS, Van den Hul, Fritz Gyger ) - you may well find "space" on LP to be much more represented, particularly in depth. I do not recall if we covered the pinch effect - but once the stylus becomes to big to allow for perfect (enough) tracing of the groove, what should be lateral movement only gets accompanied with vertical motioin - something that is not on the recording and is a form of distortion. It ADDS the sensation of depth - as vertical motion is out of phase signal and that usually is a part of recording responsible for depth. The best reference you can have at home is the same recording on CD ( I know we all like to "tar and feather" CD, but thing has its pros ) - if your phono has "Far out - man..." space and CD not even lateral spread, there is something wrong. 

 

To illustrate the point: recently, I was listening to Grado with an elliptical stylus to many pop albums that did not get a spin for quite a while. It was journey down the memory lane, much the same sound ( with all the improvement of better anicilary equipment gathered in those years ) I remember with these LPs played with Grado back in the day. Play the same albums with Audio Technica ATN440MLa - despite almost perfect channel separation that should offer beter space, there is usually lesS space - for the reasons noted, the pinch effect, which is all but absent with Micro Line stylus. One should not praise something that sounds good for its actual weaknesses - and if you compare the same recording on CD and vinyl, Micro Line stylus will give much closer sound to the CD - period. This is rational and technically correct solution. But still, Grado gets its share of time, particularly on LPs I first heard with it.

 

Regarding 17D3 - it also has Micro Ridge stylus - but it had to sacrifice something in order to have that unbelievable speed due to its 1.7 mm "long" cantilever - and that is channel separation. It is rather low, around 20 dB - which is distinctly poor. 20 dB of separation means 10 % breaktrough to other channel where there should be none at all - would you buy an amplifier with specified 10 % distortion ? 40 dB separation means 1 % breaktrough - that is much better. The difference will be most audible on soloist dead on center - it will sound much more real. That is why costlier offerings from Dynavector ( AND EVERYONE ELSE ) sport normal cantilever lenghts and better separation - but these designs can not compete with 17D3's speed. One has to decide, it often ends up with a TT carrying at least two tonearms and a 17D3 plus "something else".

 

Goldring has somewhat highish effective mass. It is mostly audible in the treble - sibilants are the first to get affected, if your Cassshshsadra Wilshshsshon does not sound perfectly clean on sibilants, it is a sign. The same goes for cymbals - if they are clean at low levels and get ever more sandpapery the harder the drummer hits them - the same. Add to that any instrument that has high level of treble energy - not to mention soprano. It is here you need as low effective mass as you can get - and Goldring MCs do not belong in this group. A stylus that can not follow the ondulations of the groove will loose contact with the groove - causing permanent demage. No after the fact action can return the record to its former glory.

 

The most trouble is the fact that top styli are perfectly capable of playing the demage their lesser predecessors have left on your records. Try not to let this happen.

post #998 of 2630
Quote:
Originally Posted by penmarker View Post

Recently went out to 2 malls, browsed around the music stores. I'm disappointed with the vinyl pricing here in Malaysia. They're well double the price of what's sold online. Vinyls that cost US$17.99 is MYR119 (aboyut US$40). CDs are cheaper, at just about MYR42 (US$14).

Such a waste of money to buy them here. Flea markets is the way to go, but then you can't find newer releases like Adele or Lana Del Rey, not to mention Burial.

My previous TT owner was generous enough to let go of his bundle for just MYR50. After a few months I have 20 vinyl records now smily_headphones1.gif happy man.

Bummer regarding vinyl pricing. It does cost to ship them, yet doubling is a bit steep. Then again, new releases are expensive - regardless of market.

 

Hope you will eventtually find a way to increase your collection at an acceptableL3000.gif cost.

post #999 of 2630

Hey guys. Very interesting thread and thanks a bunch to Skylab for lending his knowledge and starting the thread.

 

I've slowly been collecting vinyl over the last few years of some of my favorite albums. Looking to finally take the plunge and get myself a turntable to actually listen to these babies on.

 

I'm looking at spending under $750. I was thinking maybe a used Rega P3? Or maybe a P1 with performance mod? Any suggestions for me? biggrin.gif Will be listening through both monitors and headphones.

EDIT: Also just found this on eBay not too far from my place: http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/251243345523?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1423.l2649


Edited by matthewh133 - 3/11/13 at 3:35am
post #1000 of 2630
Quote:
Originally Posted by analogsurviver View Post
Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Silent One View Post

 

On my having the AT120E in the Sony... good memory! My Pioneer stereo receiver isn't suffering from hum out of the phono stage. Yes, going external could bring more joy, but currently not being tripped up in that regard.

 

I remember you made the same comment about the Goldring today as you did a couple of months back, but never expanded your thought. Nothing is bothering me to date - it's more about wanting to compare it to something. In other words, I've no idea what I've got - can it get better for a reasonable price? This is what I aim to find out. The previous owner switched to Benz-Micro and suggested I have a look - forgot which model he had.

 

On the subject of Pro-ject, I noticed my new belt and those used by Music Hall, all have Pro-ject part numbers. Seems, MH submits their drawings for turntables and Pro-ject does the heavy lifting. biggrin.gif

 

Speaking of heavy, that PS-X5 is heavy. When sitting atop a trio of 6 lb brass footers (each) and 4" Maple platforms, the Sony/AT120E combo is a giant killer, considering the $125 price tag. This mounting was temporary at best. Properly mounted, I expect the presentation rise a bit higher. The mids/highs got sweeter, the bottom got tighter/punchier and the overall presentation just bigger...wowza!

 

To be honest, I'm not sure yet if I want my presentation to be s-p-a-c-e-y ("Far out, man") or hard hitting and on point, right where I'm sitting. If I play my cards right, I'll have my forthcoming tube phono stage/preamp and from there, seek seasoning. But if I have the chance to get the cart first, then...

I have had answer for this post of yours yesterday, in the end hit a wrong button - poof ! Here we go again.

 

If you are basically happy with equipment you have now, leave it at that for a while. I find discovering a new artist or gettting better print of an album more thrill than say a new cartridge - but then again, you have to be at certain level for this to be true. It is like with musical instruments, we can argue ad nuseaum about Stradivari vs Guarnieri vs Any New Violin or Steinway vs Bosendorfer vs Fazioli vs ..... - once the instrument is at a certain high enough level, it is combination of the instrument and how much has the musician grown with it and mastered it. One can always nitpick beyond reason, but like changing the instrument, requiring certain changes in the playing in order to achieve the "same" sound as before and hopefully pick up from there, phono is much the same thing. It is risky to go changing say your phono preamp for a significantly different design - if you are happy with your present setup - it may well mean you will discover things better unheard unless your piggybank has no limits.

 

Now, spatial reproduction will always be problematic - how much "space" should there be. It can be deceiving, to say the least. If your stylus is anything less than the ultimate possible ( Micro Line/Ridge/Reach/SAS, Van den Hul, Fritz Gyger ) - you may well find "space" on LP to be much more represented, particularly in depth. I do not recall if we covered the pinch effect - but once the stylus becomes to big to allow for perfect (enough) tracing of the groove, what should be lateral movement only gets accompanied with vertical motioin - something that is not on the recording and is a form of distortion. It ADDS the sensation of depth - as vertical motion is out of phase signal and that usually is a part of recording responsible for depth. The best reference you can have at home is the same recording on CD ( I know we all like to "tar and feather" CD, but thing has its pros ) - if your phono has "Far out - man..." space and CD not even lateral spread, there is something wrong. 

 

To illustrate the point: recently, I was listening to Grado with an elliptical stylus to many pop albums that did not get a spin for quite a while. It was journey down the memory lane, much the same sound ( with all the improvement of better anicilary equipment gathered in those years ) I remember with these LPs played with Grado back in the day. Play the same albums with Audio Technica ATN440MLa - despite almost perfect channel separation that should offer beter space, there is usually lesS space - for the reasons noted, the pinch effect, which is all but absent with Micro Line stylus. One should not praise something that sounds good for its actual weaknesses - and if you compare the same recording on CD and vinyl, Micro Line stylus will give much closer sound to the CD - period. This is rational and technically correct solution. But still, Grado gets its share of time, particularly on LPs I first heard with it.

 

Regarding 17D3 - it also has Micro Ridge stylus - but it had to sacrifice something in order to have that unbelievable speed due to its 1.7 mm "long" cantilever - and that is channel separation. It is rather low, around 20 dB - which is distinctly poor. 20 dB of separation means 10 % breaktrough to other channel where there should be none at all - would you buy an amplifier with specified 10 % distortion ? 40 dB separation means 1 % breaktrough - that is much better. The difference will be most audible on soloist dead on center - it will sound much more real. That is why costlier offerings from Dynavector ( AND EVERYONE ELSE ) sport normal cantilever lenghts and better separation - but these designs can not compete with 17D3's speed. One has to decide, it often ends up with a TT carrying at least two tonearms and a 17D3 plus "something else".

 

Goldring has somewhat highish effective mass. It is mostly audible in the treble - sibilants are the first to get affected, if your Cassshshsadra Wilshshsshon does not sound perfectly clean on sibilants, it is a sign. The same goes for cymbals - if they are clean at low levels and get ever more sandpapery the harder the drummer hits them - the same. Add to that any instrument that has high level of treble energy - not to mention soprano. It is here you need as low effective mass as you can get - and Goldring MCs do not belong in this group. A stylus that can not follow the ondulations of the groove will loose contact with the groove - causing permanent demage. No after the fact action can return the record to its former glory.

 

The most trouble is the fact that top styli are perfectly capable of playing the demage their lesser predecessors have left on your records. Try not to let this happen.

 

 

 

Thanks for expanding your thoughts - sorry about the double effort. Yes, I am armed with test tracks on the external drive and CD. This was the sole reason I've kept my Sony DVD player, so I could maintain this practice. In fact, any big changes to the system no matter the area, and I listen to the CD for familiar cues. At this writing, I'm slowly packing my gear up to move in a month or two. In the short-term, will have to live mad.gifwith my iPod. By the month of May, I hope to evaluate a few CD tracks against the Goldring cart. Wait, did you call my cart "Chubby?" biggrin.gif

 

I understand your musical instrument analogy well. Which speaks to a point I expressed a single moon or two back (January?). And that's, by paying closer attention to myself (the listener) and what I'm bringing to the table a given night, I can wring out the last few percentages of pleasure in a listening session. Even on lesser wink.gif gears. 

 

Still, I'm tempted to buy another cart when the table comes out of the box. Clearaudio Maestro?

popcorn.gif

post #1001 of 2630

After solving 95% of the problems with the TT I still get nervous of the settings. I Literally am afraid to play records as not to damage them. Yesterday I played Sunn's Black One and for the first time there was a skipping groove. Before all this and with the Ortofon Red that didn't happen.

 

The thing is that I will get to borrow a digital scale to check the downforce but there is absolutely no way I could reliably check the azimuth other than trust the eye (and possibly ears, but I don't feel I'm that qualified).

 

I feel that for me to be at ease I should really buy a non-tarnished, new, TT and have the Ortofon Black installed by an experttriportsad.gif

The doubts are so awful--

 

A proper question: If the Black's downforce should be between 15-17Nm and there is a recommended weight of 15Nm, which would you prefer? To go with the recommendation or just go with the heavier setting as to try to minimize the possible corrosion from too little weight?

post #1002 of 2630
Quote:
Originally Posted by Silent One View Post

 

Thanks for expanding your thoughts - sorry about the double effort. Yes, I am armed with test tracks on the external drive and CD. This was the sole reason I've kept my Sony DVD player, so I could maintain this practice. In fact, any big changes to the system no matter the area, and I listen to the CD for familiar cues. At this writing, I'm slowly packing my gear up to move in a month or two. In the short-term, will have to live mad.gifwith my iPod. By the month of May, I hope to evaluate a few CD tracks against the Goldring cart. Wait, did you call my cart "Chubby?" biggrin.gif

 

I understand your musical instrument analogy well. Which speaks to a point I expressed a single moon or two back (January?). And that's, by paying closer attention to myself (the listener) and what I'm bringing to the table a given night, I can wring out the last few percentages of pleasure in a listening session. Even on lesser wink.gif gears. 

 

Still, I'm tempted to buy another cart when the table comes out of the box. Clearaudio Maestro?

popcorn.gif

00:00 - 01:44 watching of this http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xs1aUws0Lrs should do.

 

Wish you the best of luck with the move - so that you wil not HAVE to get a new cart in order to play LPs. Pack the TTs REALLY well - that is to say, well enough to survive a fall from about one metre height  without any consequences. Accidents do happen.

 

"Chubby" were its predecessors - no idea how much slimmer current version can be - but it is not exactly a balerina.

 

BTW - did you get to see the Coca Cola Kid ?

post #1003 of 2630
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kirnupiima View Post

After solving 95% of the problems with the TT I still get nervous of the settings. I Literally am afraid to play records as not to damage them. Yesterday I played Sunn's Black One and for the first time there was a skipping groove. Before all this and with the Ortofon Red that didn't happen.

 

The thing is that I will get to borrow a digital scale to check the downforce but there is absolutely no way I could reliably check the azimuth other than trust the eye (and possibly ears, but I don't feel I'm that qualified).

 

I feel that for me to be at ease I should really buy a non-tarnished, new, TT and have the Ortofon Black installed by an experttriportsad.gif

The doubts are so awful--

 

A proper question: If the Black's downforce should be between 15-17Nm and there is a recommended weight of 15Nm, which would you prefer? To go with the recommendation or just go with the heavier setting as to try to minimize the possible corrosion from too little weight?

Ortofon is the only ( and obviously last ) Mohican that does pay proper attention to the QC regarding everything stylus geometry oriented - including azimuth. Well enough even I would not feel uncomfortable with "dead mirror level" setting for an Ortofon. Even if it may VERY SLIGHTLY deviate from perfection, which is only verifiable with a proper test record and an osciloscope, it will be safe for records in this way. That is why Ortofon prices are higher for the nominally same quality of stylus compared to other manufacturers - sample to sample variation is really held to a minimum.

 

Playing at upper limit of manufacturer's range for VTF is much better than risking mistracking - I curse the day I followed the instruction for Ortofon MC20Super to the letter by setting the VTF to max 2.0 gram - and demaged the finale of Prokofiev direct to disk recording on Sheffield. It turned out all that was needed was 0.05 gram increase in VTF as verified by the test record - but for Prokofiev disk it was too late.

 

If I understand correctly, your turntable is basically new. Take time to learn to adjust it by yourself or get an expert help - no need to get a new one in my opinion. It will have to be finely adjusted just the same.

post #1004 of 2630
Quote:
Originally Posted by matthewh133 View Post

Hey guys. Very interesting thread and thanks a bunch to Skylab for lending his knowledge and starting the thread.

I've slowly been collecting vinyl over the last few years of some of my favorite albums. Looking to finally take the plunge and get myself a turntable to actually listen to these babies on.

I'm looking at spending under $750. I was thinking maybe a used Rega P3? Or maybe a P1 with performance mod? Any suggestions for me? biggrin.gif Will be listening through both monitors and headphones.


EDIT: Also just found this on eBay not too far from my place: http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/251243345523?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1423.l2649

Definitely go for the P3, or even the P2 with the glass platter. Both have better tone arms than the RP1. Also, skip the Rega cart and go for an Ortofon 2M Blue or Bronze, they're a match made in heaven and offer a better cost/performance ratio.
post #1005 of 2630
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Silent One View Post

 

Thanks, analoguesurviver. But, @ 1 hour plus, I'd better watch later tonight. And while I've got you here (Skylab and others feel free to weigh-in), hypothetically if I budgeted $1,000 - $1,500 for a new cart, what are some of the better pairings for the MMF-7?

 

My phono stage inside the big Pioneer does MM/MC, so not worried...

 

For that TT, I would definitely consider a Clearaudio Maestro Wood.  I have one and really like it.  $1K list.  Like AS, I would recommend a Benz, but while apparently they are making limited quantities, the wait is long...

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by matthewh133 View Post

Hey guys. Very interesting thread and thanks a bunch to Skylab for lending his knowledge and starting the thread.

 

I've slowly been collecting vinyl over the last few years of some of my favorite albums. Looking to finally take the plunge and get myself a turntable to actually listen to these babies on.

 

I'm looking at spending under $750. I was thinking maybe a used Rega P3? Or maybe a P1 with performance mod? Any suggestions for me? biggrin.gif Will be listening through both monitors and headphones.

EDIT: Also just found this on eBay not too far from my place: http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/251243345523?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1423.l2649

 

Well, for me...I would probably go with the Technics.

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