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Ultimate Ears Personal Reference Monitors: The *Custom* Custom In-Ear Monitor - Page 13

post #181 of 213
Quote:
Originally Posted by average_joe View Post

 

I will see if I can borrow the K3003 again...

 

You don't have to borrow, you can buy mine wink_face.gif. Thanks for the mini review. I am definatey very interested.

post #182 of 213
Quote:
Originally Posted by average_joe View Post

My PRM is bass = 55, mids = 50, treble = 45, but more to come on that in a few weeks is all I can say right now.  Some of the 'set sound signature' aspects of the PRM are the clarity, soundstage presentation, and note thickness.  I need more time to determine how much things can change, if at all.  

 

I will see if I can borrow the K3003 again...


I assume your tuning doesn't make a major change from the neutral one? What is the limit? 0-100?

 

Oh, alright, won't force you to, but I'd still love to see the comparison if possible ksc75smile.gif

post #183 of 213
Quote:
Originally Posted by Audiowood View Post

You don't have to borrow, you can buy mine wink_face.gif. Thanks for the mini review. I am definatey very interested.

 

Lol, they hurt my ears after a little while; I will buy them for $5 biggrin.gif

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by etherlite View Post


I assume your tuning doesn't make a major change from the neutral one? What is the limit? 0-100?

 

Oh, alright, won't force you to, but I'd still love to see the comparison if possible ksc75smile.gif

 

Yes, 0 is max gain and 100 is max cut to the frequency spectrums.  The changes on the demo are quite small with a + or - 5.

post #184 of 213
Quote:
Originally Posted by average_joe View Post

Yes, 0 is max gain and 100 is max cut to the frequency spectrums.  The changes on the demo are quite small with a + or - 5.

WHAAAT!? Only 5% change is possible?! deadhorse.gif

post #185 of 213
Quote:
Originally Posted by average_joe View Post

 

Lol, they hurt my ears after a little while; I will buy them for $5 biggrin.gif

 

 

Yes, 0 is max gain and 100 is max cut to the frequency spectrums.  The changes on the demo are quite small with a + or - 5.

 

Is the +, -5 changes the sound significantly? Like a +5 db treble boost kind of deal here?

post #186 of 213

At the moment I am not sure if the numbers correlate to an exact dB number, but I will have quite a bit more detail (hopefully) about the process, tuning capabilities, etc in my review.

 

My guess at the moment (and I hate when I am way off on a guess) is the change may be somewhere around 1 dB for a 5 point change on the tuning, however I am not sure if changes are linear. 50 is neutral, so 55 represents a cut of some amount while 45 represents a boost of some amount.  This is pure speculation, but if a 5 point change is 1 dB, then the maximum change is 10 dB either way.  Your patience is appreciated :)

post #187 of 213
Ok thanks for the info. Take your time on the review no rush.
post #188 of 213

oh, so you mean a single turn on the knob will give you 5 points of change which equal 1dB. You can turn the knob as high as 0 point and as low as 100 points. CMIIW

 

This makes more sense about the customization, can't imagine paying 2000$ just to get a very minor customizable CIEM eek.gif

 

No problem Joe, I'd prefer to read an informative and correct review rather than a rushed but misleading review wink_face.gif

post #189 of 213
Quote:
Originally Posted by Audiowood View Post

Ok thanks for the info. Take your time on the review no rush.

 

NP

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by etherlite View Post

oh, so you mean a single turn on the knob will give you 5 points of change which equal 1dB. You can turn the knob as high as 0 point and as low as 100 points. CMIIW

 

This makes more sense about the customization, can't imagine paying 2000$ just to get a very minor customizable CIEM eek.gif

 

No problem Joe, I'd prefer to read an informative and correct review rather than a rushed but misleading review wink_face.gif

 

At this point, that is a guess, but I could be wrong about the amount of change.  Yes, the knob goes up to 0 and down to 100 (counter intuitive?).

 

I think the $2K price is in place for numerous reasons including the tuning technology.  But the bottom line is the PRM does sound quite good.

post #190 of 213
Quote:
Originally Posted by etherlite View Post

 

This makes more sense about the customization, can't imagine paying 2000$ just to get a very minor customizable CIEM eek.gif

 

Because for $50-$300 you could get a crap ton of garbage sounding phones that deviate >5dB.  You don't need a well designed CIEM for that but I'd be willing to take your money if you're willing to spend it.  wink_face.gif

 

People don't seem to understand how a well placed 1.5dB change over a certain range can effect a sound signature.


Edited by Anaxilus - 9/26/12 at 12:01am
post #191 of 213

Previously I thought average_joe meant that the customization is only limited to 45-55, producing difference of roughly -1 to +1 dB variety from the neutral UE PRM.

 

and sorry, I don't really have much knowledge in the technical stuffs, so please spare me. >.<

post #192 of 213

I think people are misinterpreting average_joe's speculations...

 

Hadn't we determined that customization happens by changing the impedance of the driver groups?

 

Therefore the notion that a change of "5" corresponds to a change of "x dB" can't possibly be.  First of all, the display scale on the machine is likely not a scientific metric but a consumer-oriented, completely arbitrary value picked to make the tester think "oh, I adjusted by 5, therefore the change should be subtly notable (more than a change of 1, less than a change of completely cutting the response totally) and I should take pains to hear the adjustment I just made before tipping the balance even further."  In other words, my guess is the values are on a subjective scale designed around the psychology of number perception.  (My guess could be verified easily - does changing the value to one extreme or other totally cut that frequency range out, or boost it to absolute dominance over other ranges?  I thought I read or somehow understood that it does not...)  Moreover, a change of "x dB" at what frequency?  60hz for the bass range/driver, 1khz for midrange drivers, and 12khz for treble???

 

If we assume (as I thought was already established) that the consumer's adjustments are to the impedance curve, then the effects on the frequency response curve will be complex, not easy to describe by 1:1 mapping statements such as, "a change of 5 corresponds to a trim of 1dB" (again, at what frequency?).  An impedance change, however, will be spread around a fair stretch of the FR curve, and have other nuanced effects on sound than simply boosting or reducing some of the volume.

post #193 of 213

The dials go way over 100 on the tuning box for the UE PRM.

 

I won't say it's the first thing I did, but, okay, actually, the first thing I did was to take one of the dials to over 150 and compare it to 50.

 

THE CHANGE WAS MILD

 

Audible, but mild.

 

It sure as hell wasn't however many dB people are thinking it was. That is definitely not how the tuning box works.

 

Changing the tuning from 50-50-50 to a tuning of 55-50-45 or what have you is practically nothing.

 

The tuning system is being way, way overhyped in reviews like Steve Guttenberg's (no surprise). Use of EQ on a DAP is a larger effect than what is possible with the impedance changes for the UE PRM.

 

 

Also, I confirmed with a UE rep that each dial does not directly correspond to bass, mids and treble driver groups, but rather each has an effect on the overall impedence measures.


Edited by Kunlun - 9/26/12 at 5:51am
post #194 of 213
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kunlun View Post

THE CHANGE WAS MILD

 

Probably a good thing.  

 

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Anaxilus View Post

 

People don't seem to understand how a well placed 1.5dB change over a certain range can effect a sound signature.

 

Yup.

 

--

 

It is a personal reference monitor, after all.  It wouldn't be reference if they let you deviate too far from the mean.  For those who's HRTF has conditioned them to perceive things a tad differently than others (which is everyone really), this thing seems like the right solution.  Of course, if you already know what you want, and what sounds right to you, you could save a bunch of money and buy a different CIEM.  'Course, knowing what you want sonically is easier said than done IME...takes money & time.

 

--

 

I was in touch with one of the UE reps we see here at most meets, they'll offer me a discount on everything but the PRM.  Scratch that one off the list.

post #195 of 213
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kunlun View Post

The dials go way over 100 on the tuning box for the UE PRM.

 

I won't say it's the first thing I did, but, okay, actually, the first thing I did was to take one of the dials to over 150 and compare it to 50.

 

THE CHANGE WAS MILD

 

Audible, but mild.

 

It sure as hell wasn't however many dB people are thinking it was. That is definitely not how the tuning box works.

 

Changing the tuning from 50-50-50 to a tuning of 55-50-45 or what have you is practically nothing.

 

The tuning system is being way, way overhyped in reviews like Steve Guttenberg's (no surprise). Use of EQ on a DAP is a larger effect than what is possible with the impedance changes for the UE PRM.

 

 

Also, I confirmed with a UE rep that each dial does not directly correspond to bass, mids and treble driver groups, but rather each has an effect on the overall impedence measures.

 

 

 

Then i better not to waste the 2k... buy 2 pair of UE RM better.

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