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HP for orchestra, Opera voice, soundtracks, classic... - Page 3

post #31 of 48

I think K701/702 and Q701 since they are modification of one of those need 300, for others 100 should be enough

post #32 of 48
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by olegausany View Post

I think K701/702 and Q701 since they are modification of one of those need 300, for others 100 should be enough

Those headphones are only borrowed to me, so 100 nor 300 are not possible.

I am already burning-in em on all players I have at home. I'll try to hit at least 30 hours, which should help. I've heard first 30 hours are most important and have dramatic effect for overall burn-in phase. Next hours should improve quality only little bit. Maybe for AKG it's still not enough, but there's nothing better I can do. For DT880, HD600 and K702 I'll hit more hours, as these I can have borrowed for longer.

Well, maybe for K702 I'll hit 100 hours, if I put them on the radio for 24hours/day, for 4 days.

post #33 of 48
Thread Starter 

After few days, I've finaly found out, in which songs Audiotechnica ATH-AD900 shines.

Musicals. At least, there where are not too much lows in music.

 

Edit: Ok, sorry for bashing ATH-AD900, I gave them too little burn-in. Now after another 12 hours of burn-in, situation with them is much better. Separation of instruments starts to be maybe batter than on AKG K702. They have wide soundstage, and really very very open, airy sound, like nothing is block them. I would say, their sound feeling is closest to the feeling, like you feel it natural without headphones, although too little punch and energy in basses&lows still remains problem in some tracks. The tracks recorded in studios are not so good with them, and tracks with lotsa basses and lows also not. But if you listen just to them, you will get used to it, and it's not so bad anyway. Just when you switching between them and AKG Q701/HD600/DT880, you will notice this difference, and realize, something is really missing in your tracks.
These HPs really fits for live performances, best when there is actor singing/speaking on the stage, while music (without too much basses) is in background, and you sit in audition.

These HP also need very wide or big head, or they are too loose. I have little head, they don't fit so good, and they cannot be adjusted.

I would say, they are OK, but only under special circumstances... to buy them just blindly as one-HP-for-all, is quite risky, and HD600 or DT880 fits better for this purpose.


Edited by Warrax - 7/22/12 at 4:50am
post #34 of 48
Thread Starter 

Today, I've recieved two new headphones, Sennheisers HD598 and HD650. First of them are borrowed by my friend, and are perfectly burned-in.

 

700

 

I'm looking forward to compare them on NFB12.1, if I'll find adequate reasons to go for higher models, or the differences will be not worth of additional money.

 

Lol, my collection is now quite wide, still waiting for SHR1440...

 

700

 

 

I've never though before, I would ever have so many models to compare. But -  that's the life. Sometimes, one suprises even himself. I like comparing and analyze stuff in life, so this is the result of those attributes, lol.

Well, I'm really starting to think to make some little review.....maybe another amateur review, one more view to already endless list of comparsion reviews? ;-)  I will see.

 

Edit:

from first listening, HD600 winning ... seems more bright and clear. HD650 have some strange kind of dark basses or something like that... it sounds to me little bit more unnatural. Maybe for rap would be better, but for soundtracks, HD600 seems like more alive, clear and natural. The differance is not so big, just HD650 have that strange kind of color on lows, which, IMO, take some life and balance from soundtracks (didn't have listen more genres yet). Maybe, it is that "HD6x0 are darker HPs" attribute, which HD650 have even more bold? Don't know, if it's that "darker" attribute, but I would say, I would not pay more money just to have some color, that takes something from track.

Will post more "edits" with further findings.

 

Edit2:

I've finally identified that colored sound on lows, that HD650 have over HD600.

I'm not so good in english, but I know exact word, that describe it in my languange, but dictionary translated it as this:

http://slovnik.azet.sk/preklad/anglicko-slovensky/?q=duniet

 

Should be "to roll" probably.

I've identifed it thanks to Kernkraft 400 from Zombie Nation http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vWOTg8qPq-4

That is typical music, that is often played in Disco clubs... which are relatively small closed rooms, but music is very very loud, with lotsa basses. The basses in that space just to roll...

and that is exactly that attribute... when I've was switching between HD600 and HD650 (I have special quick technique for it, when there is only 0,5 sec. delay between switching), the HD650 version of that track immediately remained in my memories on disco clubs... it has such signature. So I think, basses and lows on HD650 more rolling (if that is that right word), while HD600 is like in much larger area... maybe concert hall. I'm not suprised now, why so many people like HD650 (and especially on NFB12)... because nowadays, there are halfly-deaf people from disco clubs all around, that find this signature good and used to...lol...

But for sensitive ones, like me, that likes concert halls over disco clubs, there's one

unequality - HD600>HD650. Also, mids and highs seems a little bit more audible on HD600, while on HD650, are like more damped. Imagine soundtracks in damped disco club, or on wide stage... which wins? For me, the stage. That's HD600. Although, someone can really like that "rolling" flavour of HD650

But... will give to HD650 more chances, though. Maybe, even I'll start to like that signature as time goes, who knows. ;-) Need to listen to it longer.

 

Edit3:

Ok I've found where HD650 sounds better than HD600... when chello plays http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OZxgAY6WPUw (I am listening it as FLAC of course)

beginning at 0:52, at HD650 it brings more emotions than on HD600. On both it's good tho, just that signature, which makes basses to roll more, makes also chello like more full of sounding.


Edited by Warrax - 7/23/12 at 1:58pm
post #35 of 48

As i already said in multiple threads and other people agree with me that HD650 are very picky what amp you are pairing them with. And for me they are lacking that deep sub-bass classical and jazz demand and especially after I heard the bass HE-400, D5000/7000 have I can't go back to HD650 and they are now for sale

post #36 of 48

People say bass should be on the lean side for classical music... don't know where they get that idea. 

 

I listen to a lot of Bach and in Bach, bass is crucial. With the HD 598, the bass is EQ'able. The Q701 has well extended bass but is seriously lacking in quantity. Not to mention, the soundstage is a little TOO wide. Almost like a cavern sometimes. And of course, the Q701 needs a very good amp. 

post #37 of 48
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by olegausany View Post

As i already said in multiple threads and other people agree with me that HD650 are very picky what amp you are pairing them with. And for me they are lacking that deep sub-bass classical and jazz demand and especially after I heard the bass HE-400, D5000/7000 have I can't go back to HD650 and they are now for sale


Yes, 650 are picky, but NFB12 + HD650 is considered to proper combination.

At least for HD600 is it working for sure. But many are asking about HD650 to NFB12, and it is recommended.

post #38 of 48
Quote:
Originally Posted by Warrax View Post


Yes, 650 are picky, but NFB12 + HD650 is considered to proper combination.

At least for HD600 is it working for sure. But many are asking about HD650 to NFB12, and it is recommended.

Have you compared it with the HD 598 yet? 

post #39 of 48
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by NimbleTurtle View Post

Have you compared it with the HD 598 yet? 

Yes, tho friend borrowed it to me only for one day.

 

My opinion on HD598 + NFB12.1:

 

Actually, I didn't like those headphones, so I didn't want to spend too much energy and time to test them. I was only curious, if I don't make mistake to spend so much money on HD600, when there will be almost no hearable differances from HD598. This also told me friend, that when he was buying it, he tested it with HD600, and he was not able to hear differance, so that's why he's choosen HD598. Wwell, but I have very sensitive musical ear, so my opinion can be different, so I wanted to try it. And this hows it got: Even after few minutes, I was pretty much considered, I would never buy these headphones. Their price is already high, and I would rather stay at Superlux for 25 euro, save those money, wait a little bit, and then buy rather HD600. Sound quality has been like one level below HD600, it's hard to describe, but when I was switching them, I have definetly said to myself, that I don't want to spend so much money on those headphones. One thing I also didn't like on them, is color... that yellowish is not the problem, but that brown earpads are just pain for my eyes. (I understand this opinion is personal). But for sure, I was able to hear the differance from HD600... man, NFB12 + HD600 sound quality is just superior.

Also, one thing, that really pissed me about those, was construction quality. Cannot help, but everytime I've touch them, and take them to put it on my head, something in me just felt "blah"... when I've touched HD600/650, that is other league... very nice feeling, and very nice build quality. I don't want my headphones, to be cracked after one time they hit the hard surface on ground. Another thing, I didn't like at them has been material, that are earcups made of... it's far behind quality of HD600 foam. I simply didn't like it on touch. (maybe it's because they are old... in this case I apologize, better be to touch new ones- thats true). When I've put them on head, they've just felt with cheap feeling... really, I have SR850 (which are similiar to superlux), and I like them more to touch... although, they are less comfy on head than HD598, that's for sure.

When the HD598 are already on head, and you spend some time with them, they are ok. Still not as good feeling as HD600, but it's ok... they are comfortable, yes.

One positive thing about them... and this thing can be major factor in popularity of them, is they are really easy to drive. They've sounded directly from my Sansa Clip best from all headphones I have... SR850/ AD700/ AD900/ DT880/ K702/Q701/HD600/HD650. AD900 is also easy to drive and sound very good, but only for live recordings, like musicals (les miserables etc...), but when you put some rock, metal, vocals, pop, electronic... HD598 is pretty good... for everything, with satisfying sound. But, I don't recommend these headphones to take out, just because of that crappy build quality. Funny thing is, HD600/650 are much more suitable for this, beucase they don't break so easy, they will last for long. Of course, you need tube amp for them in this case. If I would use them only at home, I would amp them from proper amp... so what's the point they sound good on portable players, when they are not good for moving all around?

I've realized these all stuff in matter of minutes, and few hours with them, and result was quite clear - they are not for me. I would take rather Superlux, spare the money, and later buy directly HD600. But for people, that want some good sounding headphones only to not very powerfull soundcard, like Xonar D1, they can be ok. They can be also ok to Xonar STX. But to NFB, HD600 really fits more, and it is hearable differance... one level up in quality.

Verdict? I would not recommend NFB12 + HD598 combo. It makes no sense for me, as NFB12 + HD600 is much better. You've already spent about 200 euro on NFB, and you spend 150 on HD598... that's 350 euro. For me, NFB12 + HD600 for 450 euro is worth every penny of that extra 100 euro.

You can take it as... you pay 30 euro for far far better construction, and better comfort, and 70 euro for one level better of music quality. It's not too much, and sounds reasonable to me.

For someone with Xonar - D1 for 50 euro + HD598 150 euro = 200 euro. D1 + HD600 = 300 euro. But xonar  D1 will not drive the HD600 very well. so in this case, HD598 can be interesting option. But even in this case, I would rather went for : D1 + Superlux = 75 euro.


Edited by Warrax - 7/25/12 at 9:27am
post #40 of 48
Quote:
Originally Posted by Warrax View Post

Yes, tho friend borrowed it to me only for one day.

 

My opinion on HD598 + NFB12.1:

 

Actually, I didn't like those headphones, so I didn't want to spend too much energy and time to test them. I was only curious, if I don't make mistake to spend so much money on HD600, when there will be almost no hearable differances from HD598. This also told me friend, that when he was buying it, he tested it with HD600, and he was not able to hear differance, so that's why he's choosen HD598. Wwell, but I have very sensitive musical ear, so my opinion can be different, so I wanted to try it. And this hows it got: Even after few minutes, I was pretty much considered, I would never buy these headphones. Their price is already high, and I would rather stay at Superlux for 25 euro, save those money, wait a little bit, and then buy rather HD600. Sound quality has been like one level below HD600, it's hard to describe, but when I was switching them, I have definetly said to myself, that I don't want to spend so much money on those headphones. One thing I also didn't like on them, is color... that yellowish is not the problem, but that brown earpads are just pain for my eyes. (I understand this opinion is personal). But for sure, I was able to hear the differance from HD600... man, NFB12 + HD600 sound quality is just superior.

Also, one thing, that really pissed me about those, was construction quality. Cannot help, but everytime I've touch them, and take them to put it on my head, something in me just felt "blah"... when I've touched HD600/650, that is other league... very nice feeling, and very nice build quality. I don't want my headphones, to be cracked after one time they hit the hard surface on ground. Another thing, I didn't like at them has been material, that are earcups made of... it's far behind quality of HD600 foam. I simply didn't like it on touch. (maybe it's because they are old... in this case I apologize, better be to touch new ones- thats true). When I've put them on head, they've just felt with cheap feeling... really, I have SR850 (which are similiar to superlux), and I like them more to touch... although, they are less comfy on head than HD598, that's for sure.

When the HD598 are already on head, and you spend some time with them, they are ok. Still not as good feeling as HD600, but it's ok... they are comfortable, yes.

One positive thing about them... and this thing can be major factor in popularity of them, is they are really easy to drive. They've sounded directly from my Sansa Clip best from all headphones I have... SR850/ AD700/ AD900/ DT880/ K702/Q701/HD600/HD650. AD900 is also easy to drive and sound very good, but only for live recordings, like musicals (les miserables etc...), but when you put some rock, metal, vocals, pop, electronic... HD598 is pretty good... for everything, with satisfying sound. But, I don't recommend these headphones to take out, just because of that crappy build quality. Funny thing is, HD600/650 are much more suitable for this, beucase they don't break so easy, they will last for long. Of course, you need tube amp for them in this case. If I would use them only at home, I would amp them from proper amp... so what's the point they sound good on portable players, when they are not good for moving all around?

I've realized these all stuff in matter of minutes, and few hours with them, and result was quite clear - they are not for me. I would take rather Superlux, spare the money, and later buy directly HD600. But for people, that want some good sounding headphones only to not very powerfull soundcard, like Xonar D1, they can be ok. They can be also ok to Xonar STX. But to NFB, HD600 really fits more, and it is hearable differance... one level up in quality.

Verdict? I would not recommend NFB12 + HD598 combo. It makes no sense for me, as NFB12 + HD600 is much better. You've already spent about 200 euro on NFB, and you spend 150 on HD598... that's 350 euro. For me, NFB12 + HD600 for 450 euro is worth every penny of that extra 100 euro.

You can take it as... you pay 30 euro for far far better construction, and better comfort, and 70 euro for one level better of music quality. It's not too much, and sounds reasonable to me.

For someone with Xonar - D1 for 50 euro + HD598 150 euro = 200 euro. D1 + HD600 = 300 euro. But xonar  D1 will not drive the HD600 very well. so in this case, HD598 can be interesting option. But even in this case, I would rather went for : D1 + Superlux = 75 euro.

Sorry but what aspect of sound quality is "better". It's a very vague impression. Not to sound critical, but your impression of the HD 598's looks (which I fully agree) could render a psychological bias that's impossible to notice. Shame... I would've liked a more detailed analysis. When people talk about superior sound quality, they're usually not very descriptive in their opinions. Thanks for the reply! 

post #41 of 48
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by NimbleTurtle View Post

Sorry but what aspect of sound quality is "better". It's a very vague impression. Not to sound critical, but your impression of the HD 598's looks (which I fully agree) could render a psychological bias that's impossible to notice. Shame... I would've liked a more detailed analysis. When people talk about superior sound quality, they're usually not very descriptive in their opinions. Thanks for the reply! 

Sorry pal, but understand my situation. I had very limited time for this thing. I knew almost imediately, I don't want those headphones. Why should I waste my precious time (I don't have much right now) on detailed analysis of headphones, I don't want, and don't like? I've just switched them several times with some of my favourite recordings, and did this several times a day. (maybe 20-30 times) And for me, it was quite clear, they are in overall quality (that's the overall feeling,you have from music...) by remarkable margin behind HD600. That means, you can feel it immediately after switching, and even don't need to focus. I cannot describe this very detailed by words, it's pretty difficult, and it needs really large amount of time, energy and focus to make such analysis, and, in second part, get most exact words, that describes those differances. (I'm not native english speaker, so for me, this part is two times more difficult) I need this time for more important decision... which of HPs I like, I'll choose. It's between DT880/K702/Q701/HD600/HD650. And my time with those headphones is running out, I have last day for that.

I hope, you understand, why I could not make more deep analysis. These HD598 was for me only some bonus, just to see, if I would able to hear differance, to not feel stupid after I would buy HD600. But differance was there quite audible, and that was important for me.

post #42 of 48
Thread Starter 

Shure SHR1440 has just arrived... oh my... my jaw dropped.eek.gif I am really astouned. And they are not even burned-in. I need more time with them, if I don't dream, but from first listenings, it seems superior to all HPs, I've had borrowed till now. Need to analyze it... but seems very promising.


Edited by Warrax - 7/27/12 at 2:56pm
post #43 of 48

Hi, Warrax. I am currently curious about what your last thoughts of Shure SRH1440. According to your final post in this thread I guess you must really liked it, right? You have tried many headphones (even HD598s that I am using one too). Hopefully you are going to try the flagship of Shure which is SRH1880. 

 

What I do not like about my HD598 is mids. How could I say or describe it? I found out it is more forward than I want but the most negative thing I am not satisfied is the midrange which is a little thin on my ears. Mids really do not have enough impact when I listen to aggressive songs and singers with strong high voice such as Celine Dion. However, I admit that these headphone HD598 is really smooth. Maybe myHD598 is now only suitable for some of my entertainments such as movie, games and some relaxing genres.

 

I am using Fiio E10 and C421 (OPA2227) and I am going to buy a ODAC which is on my thought now. I think ODAC is better than Fiio E10 for sure.

 

Oh by the way, I have a question. Are Shure 1440 and 1880 hard to drive? Is my ODAC+C421 going to drive them well? Thanks for reading my question.

post #44 of 48
Quote:
Originally Posted by LoveKnight View Post

Hi, Warrax. I am currently curious about what your last thoughts of Shure SRH1440. According to your final post in this thread I guess you must really liked it, right? You have tried many headphones (even HD598s that I am using one too). Hopefully you are going to try the flagship of Shure which is SRH1880. 

 

What I do not like about my HD598 is mids. How could I say or describe it? I found out it is more forward than I want but the most negative thing I am not satisfied is the midrange which is a little thin on my ears. Mids really do not have enough impact when I listen to aggressive songs and singers with strong high voice such as Celine Dion. However, I admit that these headphone HD598 is really smooth. Maybe myHD598 is now only suitable for some of my entertainments such as movie, games and some relaxing genres.

 

I am using Fiio E10 and C421 (OPA2227) and I am going to buy a ODAC which is on my thought now. I think ODAC is better than Fiio E10 for sure.

 

Oh by the way, I have a question. Are Shure 1440 and 1880 hard to drive? Is my ODAC+C421 going to drive them well? Thanks for reading my question.

I'd like to direct you here to a more recent impression by Warrax:

 

http://www.head-fi.org/t/621539/hd-600-vs-he-400-vs-srh1440/30#post_8612662

 

"Actually now, I have new SRH1440... now not borrowed, but my own, I've just bought it yesterday. They are in burning phase, and I'll try to make on them dalethorn mod, which should bring them close to SRH1840. I am curious, if it really helps to reduce brightness a bit, because, it's true, it's issue on them. I need to EQ down highs, otherwise, it's too fatiqueing on higher or medium volume (on low volume, is ok). Another issue are basses... they are nice sounding, are precise, detailed, but... lack of punch energy. They cannot be felt on SRH1440, which is important I think. On HD600, basses have nice punch and impact... they can be nicely felt, so it brings more energy. I am curious, if Dalethorn mod helps SRH1440 to have nicer basses with better impact. If yes, then I would say SRH1440 would be really awesome NFB12.1 + modified SRH1440 combo."

 

Still a bit old for a post :p

post #45 of 48
Thread Starter 

Hi, unfortunately, with the time, I didn't like them so much as overall headphones. I did even dalethorn mod, but I have found out, that I simply need those basses from HD600.

SRH1440 have more details in mids and highs, but overall, I've liked sound of HD600 with NFB12.1 more. The weight in bass, and impact of bass, was needed to my musical preference in most songs. Now, NFB11.32 is on the way to me, which should be more neutral than NFB12.1, so I am curious, if it will fit HD600 same good as NFB12.1. But I guess yes, because NFB12.1 is warm and colored a bit, also HD600 are colored... but I would like to have them a little bit more neutral. So I hope, NFB11.32 do exactly that thing.

 

Back to SRH1440...

Another reason was, that they didn't fit on my head so good. I've noticed after some time with them, they are not for thin heads. They needs at least medium head. There has been very little pressure on my head, so they were too loose. Because of it, it pressed on my head from one spot from above... and it always went uncomfortable after hour or so. Also, they were too bulky for me. I didn't like them to touch...


On ther side, HD600 fitted my head perfectly. When I've counted pro and cons, I've decided to sell SRH1440. I will switch to HD600, as I've found out the most pros on these headphones, so I've choosed them as overall headphone. They are little more colored, and have little less detail in mids and high, also, are a bit less airy, but overall, I like them more... that basses often do great thing in my hearing experience. From time to time, I would like to have brighter headphones... for example, for gaming, I would choose sound of SRH1440 instead. Or, for songs, where are not basses very presented, mostly mids or highs. Also, for opera, for sure, I would choose SRH1440 over HD600. I have found out, that SRH1440 simply cannot bring so nice basses, as HD600 have, even with modding, and EQing... simply, nothing worked. At other point, also HD600's detail in mids and highs cannot be raised to level of SRH1440. So basicaly, you would need both of them for perfect coverage, at least, at my view.

 

If you ask me, what would be perfect headphones for me, then it would be ones with

 

Basses like HD600

Mids and Highs like SRH1440 with dalethorns mod (or probably even better from SRH1840, but I didn't heard them, so it's only my guess I would like em)

And Shape like HD600, except the construction would be more robust, and more similiar to DT880, with foam on headband from HD600, and velour materials on earpads from DT880. Of course with at least 3 meter cable. These would be perfect headphones for me.

 

Unfortunately, I can pick only one Headphones, and HD600 won it in overall aspect for me. I simply don't like so lean and light basses, as SRH1440 have, and even despite nicer mids and highs, I had all the time feeling, that it is missing for me.


Edited by Warrax - 9/28/12 at 3:34pm
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