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Smyth SVS Realiser - PRIR Exchange Thread - Page 19

post #271 of 353
Thread Starter 

Hmm well in my early weeks of using the realiser I had 4 favorites that I just kept switching back and forth. Then in the end I only had 2 favorites that I kept switching alot everytime while I was watching tv/movies. And then was convinced that 1 prir was the best, I used that prir for about a month without no switching back and forth again. After a month I tried the other one again and suddenly the one I been using for a month sounded like crap, like there was no depth in the sound field and front speakers sounded like being on the sides. I was shocked that I never heard those differences so obvious while i was actually A/B ing them non stop before. Not sure how this could have happened but a long break from switching all the time did wonders in my case :)
 

post #272 of 353
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hoax View Post

Hmm well in my early weeks of using the realiser I had 4 favorites that I just kept switching back and forth. Then in the end I only had 2 favorites that I kept switching alot everytime while I was watching tv/movies. And then was convinced that 1 prir was the best, I used that prir for about a month without no switching back and forth again. After a month I tried the other one again and suddenly the one I been using for a month sounded like crap, like there was no depth in the sound field and front speakers sounded like being on the sides. I was shocked that I never heard those differences so obvious while i was actually A/B ing them non stop before. Not sure how this could have happened but a long break from switching all the time did wonders in my case :)
 

I also think there is a big difference between listening to movies and watching TV via the Realiser and listening to audiophile recordings.  In the case of movies, it seems to me the main difference between PRIRs would be how well they capture the locations of the speakers.  However, those of us who are more into this for the music are perhaps more attuned to more subtle features of the sound stage, and to differences in timbre and other aspects of sound quality.  Hence "audiophile."  Not that this is a superior activity in any way, but just that audiophile types are more focused on different qualities of sound reproduction than are key for surround movie emulation.

post #273 of 353
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kiritz View Post

I also think there is a big difference between listening to movies and watching TV via the Realiser and listening to audiophile recordings.  In the case of movies, it seems to me the main difference between PRIRs would be how well they capture the locations of the speakers.  However, those of us who are more into this for the music are perhaps more attuned to more subtle features of the sound stage, and to differences in timbre and other aspects of sound quality.  Hence "audiophile."  Not that this is a superior activity in any way, but just that audiophile types are more focused on different qualities of sound reproduction than are key for surround movie emulation.


I agree.

 

For music, I don't mind hearing the "room" even if it is a little "live" or there are some reflections. I think music sounds less enjoyable in a very damped room.

 

However, for movies, it can be disconcerting to hear dialogue with a distinct "echo" of the room. If the character is is outdoors in the snow, say, and you hear their voice echoing in a room, that kind of ruins the illusion.

post #274 of 353

Uploaded a new one. This time I spent hours doing it, ended up very good. Also learned that you reallly need to spend time with the HP manual EQ routine to get best results!

 

Hekeli/Siba 7.1 (Genelec 8260A,7071A)

 

edit: Yeah my Mixroom sounds very muddy after this.. really need to go do it again someday.


Edited by hekeli - 10/25/12 at 1:10am
post #275 of 353
Quote:
Originally Posted by darinf View Post


I agree.

 

For music, I don't mind hearing the "room" even if it is a little "live" or there are some reflections. I think music sounds less enjoyable in a very damped room.

 

However, for movies, it can be disconcerting to hear dialogue with a distinct "echo" of the room. If the character is is outdoors in the snow, say, and you hear their voice echoing in a room, that kind of ruins the illusion.

I've actually yet to look at a blue ray movie using the Oppo 95 and the Realiser.  I'm sure it would be a terrific surround experience with my AIX 5.1 PRIR.  I know that when I was in LA at AIX they put on something like Top Gun, and the fighter planes were zooming over my head, etc.  However, I have my big screen HD TV set up in another room, and just a small monitor in my listening room.  Someday I have to try it out.  But yes, the AIX, as we have said, is a damped mixing room, probably better suited to movies than music.

post #276 of 353
Quote:
Originally Posted by hekeli View Post

Uploaded a new one. This time I spent hours doing it, ended up very good. Also learned that you reallly need to spend time with the HP manual EQ routine to get best results!

 

Hekeli/Siba 7.1 (Genelec 8260A,7071A)

 

edit: Yeah my Mixroom sounds very muddy after this.. really need to go do it again someday.


Thanks for uploading. I have yet to try it out.

 

Yes, I think the HP manual EQ is a good idea. Unfortunately I have never done it. I have trouble matching volume levels for some reason. It's good that it can be done and applied to the HPEQ so it should help the sound of all PRIR's.

post #277 of 353
Quote:
Originally Posted by hekeli View Post

Uploaded a new one. This time I spent hours doing it, ended up very good. Also learned that you reallly need to spend time with the HP manual EQ routine to get best results!

 

Hekeli/Siba 7.1 (Genelec 8260A,7071A)

 

edit: Yeah my Mixroom sounds very muddy after this.. really need to go do it again someday.

I tried your PRIR out briefly and like it a lot.  I'll continue to make more extensive comparisons, but I think it will be a great addition to my collection!

post #278 of 353

Hekeli/Siba 7.1 is a  very nice one, very clear speaker location and balanced position, it must be done very carefully.

post #279 of 353
Quote:
Originally Posted by darinf View Post


Yes, I think the HP manual EQ is a good idea. Unfortunately I have never done it. I have trouble matching volume levels for some reason. It's good that it can be done and applied to the HPEQ so it should help the sound of all PRIR's.

 

I think the optimized HPEQ is only truly applicable to the PRIR you are currently making. I guess it can help others too, but if you think about it, aren't you also compensating for all the faults in that current PRIR measurement? I've yet to make two identical PRIRs, there's always a small difference..

 

I think as a bonus it compensates for your hearing loss also (I have lots of tinnitus..). On some frequencies I really had to change balance wildly. biggrin.gif

post #280 of 353
Quote:
Originally Posted by hekeli View Post

 

I think the optimized HPEQ is only truly applicable to the PRIR you are currently making. I guess it can help others too, but if you think about it, aren't you also compensating for all the faults in that current PRIR measurement? I've yet to make two identical PRIRs, there's always a small difference..

 

I think as a bonus it compensates for your hearing loss also (I have lots of tinnitus..). On some frequencies I really had to change balance wildly. biggrin.gif


Actually, according to the manual, the manual EQ is applicable to any PRIR and shoudl improve all PRIR's while using that HPEQ.

 

Sure, if one set of speakers is much lower end, then all the frequencies might not be represented properly, but for higher end speakers, it should work independent of the speaker system.

 

So, from my understanding, all you are doing is EQ the headphones so that what you hear from the speakers is the same as what you hear in the headphones to make the HPEQ more accurate. If you EQ the headphones to be more accurate, then that optimized HPEQ will be more accurate regardless of the PRIR and the speakers.

 

I know it seems counter intuitive, but if you think about it, it shouldn't matter which PRIR/speakers you are trying to match.

 

Here's the relevant excerpt from the manual:

 

Quote:
Any slight mismatch is not particular to a measured room. The manual adjustment affects the HPEQ file, not the PRIR. So the MANUAL EQ procedure can be done later, in another room and with other (reasonably good) speakers, and, for that listener, would benefit any PRIR auditioned with the modified HPEQ. Of course, for this procedure, the real and virtual environments must match: same room, same speakers in the same positions, and same listener.

I am going to try it while I still have a good speaker system at home.

post #281 of 353
Quote:
Originally Posted by hekeli View Post

Uploaded a new one. This time I spent hours doing it, ended up very good. Also learned that you reallly need to spend time with the HP manual EQ routine to get best results!

 

Hekeli/Siba 7.1 (Genelec 8260A,7071A)

 

edit: Yeah my Mixroom sounds very muddy after this.. really need to go do it again someday.


I just tried your PRIR. It's very good! The speaker localization seems much better than other PRIR's I have tried other than my own, of course.

 

Thank you so much!

post #282 of 353
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by hekeli View Post

Uploaded a new one. This time I spent hours doing it, ended up very good. Also learned that you reallly need to spend time with the HP manual EQ routine to get best results!

 

Hekeli/Siba 7.1 (Genelec 8260A,7071A)

 

edit: Yeah my Mixroom sounds very muddy after this.. really need to go do it again someday.


Just loaded it and had a quick test with the music loop (when clicking mode on remote) and soloing channels. Speaker positions sound good indeed!

Will have to watch a movie tonight using this prir, Thanks for uploading :)

post #283 of 353

Hi all,

i just ordered a Smyth Realizer and i need a little bit of help from you guys...

I have a Bryston BHA-1 amp, a Bryston BDA-1 DAC and a Sennheiser HD800 headphones all connected with XLR cables.

i wanna use the realizer for movies and my source for the movies is a Kaleidescape M500 player (i have a Kaleidescape server with almost 5000 movies). the problem is that the K player doesn't decode the audio format so i need to put something in between to decode the signal and send it to the realizer. i would not like to have to get a big processor or pre-amp and would like to keep the things pretty simple if possible. i have thought about buying an Oppo BDP-103 or the upcoming BDP-105 to use it as a decoder through the HDMI input but after reading the specs it seems that these players don't decode the last formats and have a limited frequency for 7.1 through the HDMI input.

1) so does someone here as an idea of what i could use between my kaleidescape player and the Realizer? 

2) what is the best connection to go from the realizer the the DAC? SPDIF?

3) could you be kind to add me on your shared dropbox to be able to download some Realizer config files? my email address is olivier.slama@mac.com

4) does someone know what is the best 7.1 config available on the shared dropbox. i use to listen to a JBL Synthesis Everest in parents house and would love to get something close to it.

5) i'm thinking about using a Sunfire subwoofer that i have (with room equalizer) and connect it to the realizer or buy Crowson transducers. have you guys any experience and thoughts about this?

thanks in advance for your help.

best 

olivier

post #284 of 353
Quote:
Originally Posted by olivierLA75 View Post

Hi all,

i just ordered a Smyth Realizer and i need a little bit of help from you guys...

I have a Bryston BHA-1 amp, a Bryston BDA-1 DAC and a Sennheiser HD800 headphones all connected with XLR cables.

i wanna use the realizer for movies and my source for the movies is a Kaleidescape M500 player (i have a Kaleidescape server with almost 5000 movies). the problem is that the K player doesn't decode the audio format so i need to put something in between to decode the signal and send it to the realizer. i would not like to have to get a big processor or pre-amp and would like to keep the things pretty simple if possible. i have thought about buying an Oppo BDP-103 or the upcoming BDP-105 to use it as a decoder through the HDMI input but after reading the specs it seems that these players don't decode the last formats and have a limited frequency for 7.1 through the HDMI input.

1) so does someone here as an idea of what i could use between my kaleidescape player and the Realizer? 

2) what is the best connection to go from the realizer the the DAC? SPDIF?

3) could you be kind to add me on your shared dropbox to be able to download some Realizer config files? my email address is olivier.slama@mac.com

4) does someone know what is the best 7.1 config available on the shared dropbox. i use to listen to a JBL Synthesis Everest in parents house and would love to get something close to it.

5) i'm thinking about using a Sunfire subwoofer that i have (with room equalizer) and connect it to the realizer or buy Crowson transducers. have you guys any experience and thoughts about this?

thanks in advance for your help.

best 

olivier

That's interesting.

 

Myself, Kiritz, and Jand were just at a location earlier today auditioning the Realiser with a Bryston BHA-1! We were using it with a pair of Audeze LCD3's. I have to say, that combo was really impressive. I think Jand is considering buying that combo for his Realiser.

 

1) Unfortunately, I don't know of any device that will receive a signal from you Kaleidescape and decode the audio to 5.1 or 7.1 LPCM. In fact, There aren't many devices at all that will decode to LPCM for the Realiser. You need to replace the M500 with another media player. I use a Dune HD Max which is similar in functionality to your Kaleidescape. The Dune HD Max will decode just about all surround formats and output LPCM. It works really well over my hard wired network to my servers. Although I have to admit, I end up copying most of my media to a local hard drive in the Dune to avoid any network lag or stuttering, etc. I hear the Oppo players can also do the same, but I have never used one.

 

I searched a long time to find anything that would do the decoding for the Realiser. I can say that the Dune was by far the best performing device.

 

Sorry about the bad news, but again, VERY few devices will decode surround audio and output LPCM. It's a licensing thing. 

 

2) The only digital output from the Realiser is via optical SPDIF. That's your only choice.

 

3) Added to dropbox. (Be sure to copy NOT move! It defaults to move, for some lame reason.)

 

4) The best 7.1 PRIR is the one that works best for YOUR ears and also sounds good to YOU. There isn't one that's the best for everyone. Just like audio gear, there's no answer. However, some of my favorites are mine, of course, in the Darinf Folder: Audio Revelation, Acoustic Zen, Sonus Faber. Use the most recent measurements. The ones I uploaded today are way better than the previous ones.

 

5) Hook up the subwoofer since you already have it and see what you think. You have to use the "menu/TAC" settings to route any output to the tactile outputs. By default, there is no output to the tactile outs. I find even my cheap HSU subwoofer works pretty well and definitely adds to the realism of the lowest octaves. I have never heard/felt tactile transducers hooked up to the Realiser. You might search the other Realiser thread. I think others have commented about using tactile transducers. 

 

Good luck and have fun with your Realiser!

post #285 of 353

thanks for your answer Darin :)

 

1) that's kind of a bad news considering that i have spent more than 100k$ in my K-system... what do you think if i was getting a pre-amp like the integra 80.3 and use it to decode the signal then go to the realizer using the analog inputs and then analog output to the DAC. do you think that would work well? or the sound quality will not be as good as using the digital inputs/outputs the whole way? and in case going with analog was ok do you know if there are easier solution than buying such a big device as this Integra preamp?

2) noted

3) THANK YOU

4) ok

5) i'll be looking at the other threads, thanks

 

best,

Olivier

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