Sorry just a joke my friend!
Edited by our martin - 6/1/12 at 8:20am
Sorry just a joke my friend!
Thanks for all of your helpful replies.
Thanks a million, dear friend.
these graphs and your analysis were really great.I'm doing the same thing with others headphone too, but I have some questions.
How did you find out that K701 has a better balanced bass?
their line until 7000 is so similar. How did you find 600 ohms version has more bass impact? and graph shows that 600 ohms is more treblish but when people want to recommend a treble modified version of DT880 250 ohms, they mention to 600 Ohms version. How is it possible?
Dunno, one could argue it makes for easier comparision as frequency response is about the balance of the whole range. If bass is at say 0dB or 5dB is irrelevant, it's how it compares to 300Hz+ range that matters.
I think the average frequency amplitude would be ideal to center it to though (discluding at least sub 20Hz range as well as 20kHz+ range because it'll skew open vs closed comparision a bit) and not what it happens to be at 1kHz so yea I see your point.
No, no, no, sorry if I didn't speak properly, I meant the contrary. Let's reformulate it :
K701 - > lack of bass
dt880 600 ohms -> good balanced bass , but an obvious treble peak near 10k.
Note : the k701 also have a peak near 10khz, but it stands out less, especially when you compare it to the curve surrounding it.
You have to realize that not everyone love the k701, mainly because it is bright, lacking bass,... And the moderator unkle erik, literally bashed them , saying they sound "plasticy". It is very common , that when someone don't like the k701, then they are told to buy a better amp / source. Hence the myth "they are hard to drive". (By the way there's a similar story with hd650) .
If I rely on graph, the Q701, seems to offer more bass than k701 :
It's by looking at square response. Let's say that the bass is of better "quality" if you prefer.
The treble peak near 10 k, is sligtly more important for 600 ohm. But I notice also that the
treble is more pleasing in the 10k-20k range.
Anyway, there are lengthy discussion, regarding if it's worth it to get 600 ohm version over 250 ohm version. The difference might not be so obvious, so if you want something easy to drive at decent volume get 250 ohm , otherwise the 600 ohm version is slightly better, but this is even debated.
Except that the d7000 have an obvious bump near 1khz. So if you correct this bump, and re-adjust curve, the d7000 is merely lacking bass in the 10-30hz region , which is not very audible.
Thank you for your detailed answers.
If we want to talk based on graphs, as far as I learned in this 24 hours (I'm not sure at all)(I only talk about my 5 top choices):
Beyerdynamic DT880 Pro 600 Ohms:
only based on Frequency response graphs:
DT880, HD650 & HE-400 are winners. But each one in a limited range.
HE-400 in part of bass sounds range, DT880 in second part of bass sounds and also in mids & HD650 in treble sounds range.
Am I right?
We already know these are "winners", these are among the most recommended "mid-fi" headphones . Hd650 being the most popular.
These are speculations from graph, but you can't assess sound quality based only on graph.
It's just like saying that a meal have enough salt or too much salt, but doesn't say if you'd like the meal by itself.
The fact is that all these headphone would sound more balanced than the headphone you already own by a margin.
The hd650 has the best frequence "balance" overall, I'd say even over the hd600 (by speculating with graph, but I'm contradicting lot of people).
Also the highs from hd650 have a reputation for being non fatiguing , but some people are complaining they are lacking.
The dt880 is very close to hd650 (according to freq balance) , except that it does have more sub bass below 30hz , and also a treble peak at 10khz , this last difference could be the main reason some people avoid them.
The he-400 has most likely the best "quality of bass", based on the single fact that it doesn't use the same technology than other headphones you cited.
It is an orthodynamic, and one of the few "affordable" orthodynamic on the market. There's also fostex that offers cheap orthodynamic, but it seems that only if you do some physical modifications that they become interesting ( if you want to experiment ...) .
However quality bass doesn't mean it would be balanced. Somehow the freq balance of he-400 reminds me the d7000, with the bump near 1 khz.
Unlike the d7000, the he400 is much less comfy, you'd see some people complaining of the weight of he400 on their head (but the audeze lcd2, seem in another league, in term of pain).
I wouldn't take the srh1440, it looks like a "crippled" srh1840. I've seen some pics of driver, and for the srh1440 shure has put a small hole in front of the driver that is hindering air flow. It is obvious , just by looking at internals, that the srh1840 would sound better.
I know I can't. I only wanted to make things a little bit more objective.
I'm curious to know if amping or changing pads of DT880 can help it to sound a little bit less treblish or not?
Here are more speculation. I looked at website goldenears.net, and I found very interesting the property description, at the end of each reviewed headphone. From what I've understood these ratings are a combination from interpretation of measurements, and subjective experience. But where are other factors such like soundstage, speed, instrument separation ?
Warning: not all headphone models are reviewed at goldenear website, and I kept only models I found interesting.
Here's how the "perfect" headphone, would look to me.
What matters the most for me is clarity (first line). I think this mean how "clean" the headphone is, and it's the main area where the hd800 impressed me.
I'm disregarding second , and third line, I'm not sure I understand them well.
Treble relative to midrange & bass relative to midrange are indication to see if the headphone have a neutral frequency response.
I think good treble is a good balance between smoothness and aggressiveness, if it's too smooth it might be boring ( a matter of taste) , if it's too rough, it lacks refinement and it's fatiguing. However I can't imagine how you'd want more "fluid" bass, I guess bass texture means impact, so I set bass texture to max.
Otherwise at the budget price, I will mention an IEM, the altec lansing im716. They seem pretty good, but unfortunately discontinued. They are based on the etymotic ER4. The ER4 are marketed as being the most accurate IEM, I'm tempted to believe it (at least at their price range).
Best clarity at budget price:
The D860 seem to have very good clarity, but unfortunately they are not neutral. If you compare to the hd800, it seems there's a "little" gap if you can accept the brightness (otherwise just do an eq). If you look at reviews, they are limited, but positive.
Most neutral headphones at budget :
The hd600 seems the winner if I rely on goldenear's assessment. Just after the hd600, there's the hd650 and the dt800 (600 ohm version).
Now, the only reason to take the hd650 over the hd600, is to have slightly more clarity :
And the only reason to take the dt880 600 ohms version over the hd600, is that you don't like the overly smooth treble from hd600 (merzbow is as innocuous as a new age cd) . However you are loosing in other areas.
Best bass impact:
The d2000 offers best bass impact at budget price. They are not neutral , however they are not excessively far from neutral.
Their treble is as smooth as for sennheiser though. This is a quite popular headphone, especially from "bass heads":
Note : the d2000 are discontinued, pick one before it's too late.
That's all folks !
Again these are speculation. The srh940 doesn't seem to be special in any category, when I look at these assessments, but I'm still proud of them .
Wow!!! thank you.
I've never heard of this site before. It's graphs are great.
But some of it's reviews seem strange. For example if you count negative points (based on your criterion) of Audeze lcd-2 & Beyerdynamic T5, it's even more than Audio-technica M50 (14.5 negative point against 13.5 negative points of M50) or Sony Z1000 has got 26.5 negative point against 18 negative points of Superlux HD681.
and unfortunately it doesn't have graphs of HE-400 and Q701.
in all of reviews that I've read at this site, HD800 with only 2.5 negative points is at the top of their list. DT880,K701 & T1 are the followers (with 9 negative points / HD 600 has got 9.5 negative points).
If you like bright treble then yeah, hd800 only has 2.5 negative points. If you like neutral treble then it has 7.5 negative points. Inner fidelity has better graphs of most every headphone-- including HE-400.