Sennheiser IE800 IEM's - Page 43

Originally Posted by james444 

 

I wonder what's your conception of a "simple" vs. "complex" song? I usually choose exceptionally well recorded music for critical listening, like the Diana Krall song I posted earlier. The "complexity" lies in the details imo, e.g. a cymbal's tone color and weight, the sustain after it is struck. Seemingly "simple" sound information, that's actually incredibly "complex" to reproduce in a realistic way. You can tell a lot about a phone's treble quality from only a few cymbal strokes, if you just listen closely.

simple song - not that many instruments playing together at once. I don't know

complex song - lots of instruments playing together at once.

oh, and FX700's cymbal sounds a bit thin, not "brassy". But the are textures on the cymbal strokes though.

Quote:

Originally Posted by james444 

 

I wouldn't worry about "bias", since I already know a few other person's opinion on the IE800 and don't think it changed my own view of the Senns. I did a short "warm-up" with the IE800 and K3003 today and agree that they have different signatures, as well as strengths and weaknesses. To my pleasant surprise, the IE800 actually managed to outshine the K3003 with the classical piece I tried (though I still liked the K3003 better with most of the other tracks).

 

Afaik K3003 and W4 share TWFK for mid/highs (though I think it's a different version). That would explain some similarity. The W4 are stellar bang/buck imo.

I mainly listen to rock though.

Which one is close to a FX700, with a more extended treble, stronger treble presence, non-laid back mids, and slightly less bass? lol

and what's TWFK? 

and correct me if I'm wrong, I thought W4 has less treble presence than FX700?

I remember you and joker, as well as others told me K3003 has similar treble presence as FX700 when using High Boost filter. Well, unless you compared it with reference filter.

Quote:

Originally Posted by DMinor 

James I am looking forward to your A/B's between the IE800 and the EX1000. Based on your initial impressions, I doubt the IE800 will outperform the EX1000.

lol, seems like you are trying to make sure that IE800 won't outperform EX1000.

Based on the impression people on the Chinese forums I've read, IE800 still beats the EX1000 by sound quality overall.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mini0510 

lol, seems like you are trying to make sure that IE800 won't outperform EX1000.

Based on the impression people on the Chinese forums I've read, IE800 still beats the EX1000 by sound quality overall.

LOL I happen to read some Chinese as my second language. Please post the specific link to the forum post and let me practice my Chinese.

Quote:

Originally Posted by DMinor 

LOL I happen to read some Chinese as my second language. Please post the specific link to the forum post and let me practice my Chinese.

I don't know. It was brief. Quickly found the link. http://www.erji.net/read.php?tid=1312590&fpage=1&toread=&page=1

It the part where he/she said after 100 hours burn-in.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mini0510 

I don't know. It was brief. Quickly found the link. http://www.erji.net/read.php?tid=1312590&fpage=1&toread=&page=1

It the part where he/she said after 100 hours burn-in.

LOL the guy seems enjoyed taking the pics. I wouldn't give much weight to what he said briefly about the EXK. EX1000 has only dynamic drivers so how could you expect it to produce the "balanced armature" flavor? I found that's funny.

Quote:

Originally Posted by DMinor 

 

LOL the guy seems enjoyed taking the pics. I wouldn't give much weight to what he said briefly about the EXK. EX1000 has only dynamic drivers so how could you expect it to produce the "balanced armature" flavor? I found that's funny.

What I got from that post and other post/messages is that IE800 is better than the current top universals except K3003, which I'll find out about it from upcoming comparison from james444. He was just commenting on how it sound, it's not as good. There wasn't any explicit expectations. I find your rationalization is pretty funny.

I wonder how much Chinese can you read. It's not very easy to read/understand description of sound qualities of earphones.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mini0510 

He was just commenting on how it sound, it's not as good. There wasn't any explicit expectations. I find your rationalization is pretty funny.

I wonder how much Chinese can you read. It's not very easy to read/understand description of sound qualities of earphones.

Are you sure that guy is not yourself? LOL.I have the whole page translated into English and then read it.

Quote:

Originally Posted by DMinor 

Are you sure that guy is not yourself? LOL.I have the whole page translated into English and then read it.

Why would you think that guy is me? If that was me, do you think I still would consistently asking James for the comparison? Clearly, you are not thinking. Or fail trolling/joking.

Just a note, I tried several translators and they failed to translate correctly. I read English faster than I read Chinese. Since that posts is on forums, people tend to simply the language, use short phrase, and improper sentence structure. That usually messes up the algorithm used in translators.

Basically, I think your judgment and rationalization is poor.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mini0510 

Why would you think that guy is me? If that was me, do you think I still would consistently asking James for the comparison? Clearly, you are not thinking. Or fail trolling/joking.

 

Just a note, I tried several translators and they failed to translate correctly. I read English faster than I read Chinese. Since this is on forum, people tend to simply the language, use short phrase, and improper sentence structure. That usually messes up the algorithm used in translators.

Basically, I think your judgment and rationalization is poor.

You are right I was joking (or teasing), that was a poor judgement right there. LOL.

I think ultimately it may depend on what music you listen to though if you are deciding which one is better.

I personally use the IE800 only through my iPhone 5 to listen to pop music and the occasional dance/electronic piece. If you listen to classical or rock or something else, your preferences might differ.

I suppose I'll go read the Chinese site as well and see what that guy says :P

Quote:

Originally Posted by suetheq403 

I think ultimately it may depend on what music you listen to though if you are deciding which one is better.

 

I personally use the IE800 only through my iPhone 5 to listen to pop music and the occasional dance/electronic piece. If you listen to classical or rock or something else, your preferences might differ.

 

I suppose I'll go read the Chinese site as well and see what that guy says :P

I mainly listen to rock, from portable device like iPod touch.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mini0510 

oh, and FX700's cymbal sounds a bit thin, not "brassy". But the are textures on the cymbal strokes though.

 

and what's TWFK? 

and correct me if I'm wrong, I thought W4 has less treble presence than FX700?

I remember you and joker, as well as others told me K3003 has similar treble presence as FX700 when using High Boost filter. Well, unless you compared it with reference filter.

The IE800's cymbals sound even thinner than the FX700's. Don't know if you've heard the PFE232, but the Senns have a similar tuning of note weight (not frequency response, mind you): meaty bass combined with feather light treble. It has its merits, cause you get slam from down low and detail from up there at the same time, but as a tradeoff, overall timbre feels a bit skewed.

TWFK is a series of dual BA drivers, used in a lot of IEMs for mid-highs (W4, K3003, 4.Ai, SM3,...) or as full-range driver (UE700, DBA02, CK10,...). TWFK implementations may share some similarities (e.g. "brassy" treble), but depending on tuning and additional drivers used, their overall sound signatures may vary quite widely. W4 have more laid-back treble than even the K3003 with reference filters. I never use the high boost filter btw, cause it makes the AKGs spiky and impairs low volume dynamics.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mini0510 

What I got from that post and other post/messages is that IE800 is better than the current top universals except K3003, ...

Everyone's entitled to their opinions, but frankly, I think such statements are too generalizing and therefore of limited value. "Better" in which way?

Most folks here would probably use tonal accuracy as a benchmark, and the IE800 neither have a flat response (exaggerated bass), nor consistent note weight (weighty bass, thinnish treble). So, by that standard, they'd probably be "worse" than quite a few other universals. They sure sound damn impressive though and easily hold their own against the current top universals, but will definitely won't win over many Ety ER4 fans, lol.

Quote:

Originally Posted by james444 

 

The IE800's cymbals sound even thinner than the FX700's. Don't know if you've heard the PFE232, but the Senns have a similar tuning of note weight (not frequency response, mind you): meaty bass combined with feather light treble. It has its merits, cause you get slam from down low and detail from up there at the same time, but as a tradeoff, overall timbre feels a bit skewed.

 

TWFK is a series of dual BA drivers, used in a lot of IEMs for mid-highs (W4, K3003, 4.Ai, SM3,...) or as full-range driver (UE700, DBA02, CK10,...). TWFK implementations may share some similarities (e.g. "brassy" treble), but depending on tuning and additional drivers used, their overall sound signatures may vary quite widely. W4 have more laid-back treble than even the K3003 with reference filters. I never use the high boost filter btw, cause it makes the AKGs spiky and impairs low volume dynamics.

 

..... IE800 cymbals are thinner than FX700.... NOOOOO!!

what does that sound like? "fling" "fling" "fling" lol

well, I guess I might buy the IE800 then. I remember my Monster Turbine Pro Copper's treble was more "brassy" than FX700, since the BA driver. I kind of miss that.

and I thought the high boost filter doesn't change the rest of the spectrum, well, according to joker

"Tuning filters are - by nature – subtractive. They shape the sound by attenuating some frequencies over others. In the case of the K3003, the Treble Boost filter is just a grille, taking nothing away from the unfiltered sound. It provides a bright but refined signature, with plenty of treble that is really quite smooth for a TWFK-based earphone. There is no problem with treble quality when it comes to the Treble Boost filter but the quantity may push the tolerance limits for some, causing long-term listening fatigue."

Seems like a free treble boost...

Since K3003 uses BA driver for mids and treble, it's more brassy than FX700 right?

and is there an IEM with qualities like FX700, but with more treble presence and extension, brass treble, slightly less bass, non-laid back mid-range?

Is AKG K3003 a candidate?

EX1000 has brassy treble? Does K3003 sound close to EX1000? 

I really hope I don't have to go to the custom route.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mini0510 

 

..... IE800 cymbals are thinner than FX700.... NOOOOO!!

what does that sound like? "fling" "fling" "fling" lol

I give you an example: listen to this track from about 03:00 to 04:00. There's the vibes on the left, Dave on bass in the middle and the drummer at the right. I believe he's mainly working the hi-hat, so that may not be ideal, but still good enough to illustrate what I mean. I've seen Dave Holland live a few times and he usually stands a few steps back and leaves the center stage to his soloists.

Anyway, listening to this piece with the IE800, Dave sounds as if he's playing totally front/center, cause bass is noticeably enhanced. The vibes on the left sound about right and very natural (the Senn's mids are really marvellous). However, the drummer on the right sounds almost as if he's using pencils instead of drum sticks, cause treble is rather thinnish and light. It's hard to describe sound impressions half-decently, but I hope you get the picture.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mini0510 

and I thought the high boost filter doesn't change the rest of the spectrum, well, according to joker

 

"Tuning filters are - by nature – subtractive. They shape the sound by attenuating some frequencies over others. In the case of the K3003, the Treble Boost filter is just a grille, taking nothing away from the unfiltered sound. It provides a bright but refined signature, with plenty of treble that is really quite smooth for a TWFK-based earphone. There is no problem with treble quality when it comes to the Treble Boost filter but the quantity may push the tolerance limits for some, causing long-term listening fatigue."

 

Seems like a free treble boost...

Yeah, I can't explain why, but the K3003 don't sound that smooth to me with treble filters. Maybe it's because of the tolerance limit that Joker's talking about. No idea why they'd lose some dynamics either, but that's how I heard it. Anyway, there's already plenty of treble with the reference filters, in my book.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mini0510 

Since K3003 uses BA driver for mids and treble, it's more brassy than FX700 right?

and is there an IEM with qualities like FX700, but with more treble presence and extension, brass treble, slightly less bass, non-laid back mid-range?

Is AKG K3003 a candidate? 

Brassy treble = check, slightly less bass = check, non laid-back mids = check. As for more treble presence, probably not on an absolute scale. But if you EQ down the midbass on your FX700, treble will gain presence as a result. That's about the K3003's balance with reference filters.

Hi,

Have anyone posted a comparison between IE800 and EX1000? Can please link me to the particular post?

Thanks!

From what I gathered from james444, I felt IE800 is a IE80 on weed. Enhanced, but still maintain the house signature.

Am I wrong?