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REVIEW: Lear LCM-2B dual driver custom IEMs - a new custom company out of Hong Kong - Page 3

post #31 of 53
Thread Starter 
Wow this thread sort of blew up! A few comments:

I'm all for people showing up and registering here just to post their opinion of Lear. Positive or not. BUT they need to give a reason why they feel the way they feel. Just saying you are from HK does not qualify your opinion by much. What specifically did you think of the demo units?

I'm also not very sold on the idea of judging the company based on the demo units. I've had several poor experiences with demo models that sounded nothing like the real custom (which I also own) in a head to head comparison. Specifically the UM Merlin demo was terrible, and many prominent users like myself and average joe felt the same way. It was a $400-500 sound at best, not an $800 sound. So the Lear stuff could be having the same issue.

I hate to some arrogant, and people around here should know me well enough to recall that I'm a humble guy. I don't think too highly of my opinion just because I own a ton of gear and have experience with a ton more. But I will point out that people tend to hear things the same way I do when they try the same gear as me. It happened with the Merlin, the Miracle, the Heir 8.A, the 1964-T, and plenty of DACs and amps as well. I've got a pretty good track records of hearing things the way most other people seem to hear them. Not that there isn't room for disagreement - of course some will have different opinions. But I do think my record speaks for itself. So that should be considered when you hear some random unknown person talking about the demo model not sounding very good.
Edited by project86 - 4/13/12 at 4:53pm
post #32 of 53
Quote:
Originally Posted by project86 View Post

Wow this thread sort of blew up! A few comments:
I'm all for people showing up and registering here just to post their opinion of Lear. Positive or not. BUT they need to give a reason why they feel the way they feel. Just saying you are from HK does not qualify your opinion by much. What specifically did you think of the demo units?
I'm also not very sold on the idea of judging the company based on the demo units. I've had several poor experiences with demo models that sounded nothing like the real custom (which I also own) in a head to head comparison. Specifically the UM Merlin demo was terrible, and many prominent users like myself and average joe felt the same way. It was a $400-500 sound at best, not an $800 sound. So the Lear stuff could be having the same issue.
I hate to some arrogant, and people around here should know me well enough to recall that I'm a humble guy. I don't think too highly of my opinion just because I own a ton of gear and have experience with a ton more. But I will point out that people tend to hear things the same way I do when they try the same gear as me. It happened with the Merlin, the Miracle, the Heir 8.A, the 1964-T, and plenty of DACs and amps as well. I've got a pretty good track records of hearing things the way most other people seem to hear them. Not that there isn't room for disagreement - of course some will have different opinions. But I do think my record speaks for itself. So that should be considered when you hear some random unknown person talking about the demo model not sounding very good.


Good points! I'd like to lend some more constructive criticism:

 

  1. Let's hear both of what's good and bad --- it's highly difficult for customs to sound purely bad!
  2. One critcism was that the 'C' version didn't have enough clarity --- fair enough --- but saying the 'B' version is too bassy is a little odd. Isn't that what it's supposed to be? I can understand people not wanting it as their preferred signature (I know I would never get the bassy version), because it's tuned to have a lot of bass, but they did stamp that 'B' on there! If the bass was muddy, bloated, or whatever, then there is an issue. A unilateral criticism of the level of bass is perhaps not sufficient to form a sound argument, so let's hear specific qualities of the sound!
  3. I know some people's primary language isn't English, so if anyone would like assistance expressing their thoughts in English, I'd be happy to help.
  4. For the owner of Lear to post snarky comments like that on their own forum is decidedly unprofessional, but hopefully we can continue high level discussions here on head-fi!
post #33 of 53

@project86

 

Thank you for your review! I was pleased to dedicate some of my time for reading it.

Also huge thanks to you for other reviews especially about the Miracle. Your review have inspired me to put a trigger on the Miracle. I will get them from second hands, and then I will send them for getting them reshelled through UM.

 

Wow! This thread goes so fast! It looks like many people who have tried it don't really like it. I agree with the previous post. Despite the fact that everyone hears differently it will be nice if people will explain why they don't like it and focus on both good and bad sides rather on negative ones only.

 

Also, in my opinion, the owner shouldn't get angry because of users as it's only their personal opinions about company products. Moreover, isn't it better to try to listen to some constructive criticisms and improve products in a such way that there will be no negative impressions at all? (of course, there always will be a person who doesn't like it, but it still worth to do it. wink.gif )

 

 

post #34 of 53
Quote:
Originally Posted by tomscy2000 View Post

 

  1. One critcism was that the 'C' version didn't have enough clarity --- fair enough --- but saying the 'B' version is too bassy is a little odd. Isn't that what it's supposed to be? I can understand people not wanting it as their preferred signature (I know I would never get the bassy version), because it's tuned to have a lot of bass, but they did stamp that 'B' on there! If the bass was muddy, bloated, or whatever, then there is an issue. A unilateral criticism of the level of bass is perhaps not sufficient to form a sound argument, so let's hear specific qualities of the sound!


 

um...you got my word, thanks! for the B version I've tried, I think it is kinda muddy and  "inelastic", thats why i said its way too bassy. iem like 11pro also stresses on its bass, but we dont find the same issue with it. If someone like headphones produced by beats, may be you could stick to the B version, they have similar expression at low f

 

I am tired of keeping myself away from the investigation of the owner. Im just looking for some higher level of discussion, thats why i choose to express my feelings here^^

 

 

post #35 of 53

Well, honestly, I really am only inclined to try customs with special driver/damper/circuit setups anyways (that's their main advantage, unlimited possibilities), so I am still interested in how the five-driver sounds. Oh, and project86, it doesn't seem to be setup the same way as the ES5... the ES5 uses two separate TWFKs for the mids and highs, while the LCM-5 seems to use TWFK and another driver (DTEC, perhaps?) for the mids and highs. Lows should be the same, with a CI. It does give me pause that the LCM-5 is wired that way, though, as it means that the mids are probably on their own band pass circuit, which means it's a triple driver with an extra DTEC (or whatever it is) tuned only to have mids.

post #36 of 53
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by tomscy2000 View Post


Good points! I'd like to lend some more constructive criticism:

 

  1. Let's hear both of what's good and bad --- it's highly difficult for customs to sound purely bad!
  2. One critcism was that the 'C' version didn't have enough clarity --- fair enough --- but saying the 'B' version is too bassy is a little odd. Isn't that what it's supposed to be? I can understand people not wanting it as their preferred signature (I know I would never get the bassy version), because it's tuned to have a lot of bass, but they did stamp that 'B' on there! If the bass was muddy, bloated, or whatever, then there is an issue. A unilateral criticism of the level of bass is perhaps not sufficient to form a sound argument, so let's hear specific qualities of the sound!
  3. I know some people's primary language isn't English, so if anyone would like assistance expressing their thoughts in English, I'd be happy to help.
  4. For the owner of Lear to post snarky comments like that on their own forum is decidedly unprofessional, but hopefully we can continue high level discussions here on head-fi!


1) Agreed! I can find positive aspects even to the IEMs I hate.

 

2) Also agreed. There was a mention of Westone IEMs being similarly disappointing to him.... that bit of info could actually turn the criticism into something useful. If he would clarify and say it reminded him of a UM2 or W3 or whatever model, then people would be able to relate to that. Highs on some Westones have been a stumbling point to certain people so it wouldn't be an unreasonable statement.

 

3) That's nice of you. Could be helpful.

 

4) I don't know the exact quote, nor the context, so I won't comment on that. But we really shouldn't compare an open discussion forum like this one to a manufacturer's own website. By going there and using their forum, you are somewhat coming into "their house" and that generally requires a different approach. I don't see a lot of that sort of thing on the Emotiva forum, nor the Decware forum, to name a few examples But again, I don't know exactly what was said.  

 


 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kuroda Tsubasa View Post

@project86

 

Thank you for your review! I was pleased to dedicate some of my time for reading it.

Also huge thanks to you for other reviews especially about the Miracle. Your review have inspired me to put a trigger on the Miracle. I will get them from second hands, and then I will send them for getting them reshelled through UM.

 

Wow! This thread goes so fast! It looks like many people who have tried it don't really like it. I agree with the previous post. Despite the fact that everyone hears differently it will be nice if people will explain why they don't like it and focus on both good and bad sides rather on negative ones only.

 

Also, in my opinion, the owner shouldn't get angry because of users as it's only their personal opinions about company products. Moreover, isn't it better to try to listen to some constructive criticisms and improve products in a such way that there will be no negative impressions at all? (of course, there always will be a person who doesn't like it, but it still worth to do it. wink.gif )

 

 


Thanks! I do enjoy writing these types of reviews and sharing my experiences. They won't match with every other experience but generally they come fairly close. 

 


 

Quote:
Originally Posted by jackjack2011 View Post


 

um...you got my word, thanks! for the B version I've tried, I think it is kinda muddy and  "inelastic", thats why i said its way too bassy. iem like 11pro also stresses on its bass, but we dont find the same issue with it. If someone like headphones produced by beats, may be you could stick to the B version, they have similar expression at low f

 

I am tired of keeping myself away from the investigation of the owner. Im just looking for some higher level of discussion, thats why i choose to express my feelings here^^

 

 


Do you mind if I ask what source you used when you tried it? Because I had plenty of bad experiences with certain gear. And not necessarily cheap gear either. I just tried the Matrix Quattro DAC, which did a great job, but the matching Quattro amp sounds bad. The headphone out of the DAC unit has a .1 ohm output impedance, while the dedicated amp is 5 ohm. But if I didn't know better I would assume that the dedicated amp should be the better choice, and use it... leading to bad results. 

 

I also just tried the Hisound RoCoo D and it sounded really bad as well. So proper matching is essential.

 


 

Quote:
Originally Posted by tomscy2000 View Post

Well, honestly, I really am only inclined to try customs with special driver/damper/circuit setups anyways (that's their main advantage, unlimited possibilities), so I am still interested in how the five-driver sounds. Oh, and project86, it doesn't seem to be setup the same way as the ES5... the ES5 uses two separate TWFKs for the mids and highs, while the LCM-5 seems to use TWFK and another driver (DTEC, perhaps?) for the mids and highs. Lows should be the same, with a CI. It does give me pause that the LCM-5 is wired that way, though, as it means that the mids are probably on their own band pass circuit, which means it's a triple driver with an extra DTEC (or whatever it is) tuned only to have mids.


I just meant similar to the ES5 in terms of dual highs, dual mids, and a single low. In contrast to the usual "two of each" strategy that everyone uses.

 

post #37 of 53
Quote:
Originally Posted by project86 View Post  I just meant similar to the ES5 in terms of dual highs, dual mids, and a single low. In contrast to the usual "two of each" strategy that everyone uses.


Ah okay. The LCM-5's strategy looks a little more risky, but it might possibly pay off too. BTW, 'two of each' sounds biblical! tongue_smile.gif

post #38 of 53

1 Low 2 Mid 2 High with 3 sound tubes sound like an interesting method. If properly implemented I'm sure it'll sound good. 

I hope someone can compare it with the ES5

post #39 of 53
Quote:
Originally Posted by tomscy2000 View Post


Good points! I'd like to lend some more constructive criticism:

 

  1. Let's hear both of what's good and bad --- it's highly difficult for customs to sound purely bad!
  2. One critcism was that the 'C' version didn't have enough clarity --- fair enough --- but saying the 'B' version is too bassy is a little odd. Isn't that what it's supposed to be? I can understand people not wanting it as their preferred signature (I know I would never get the bassy version), because it's tuned to have a lot of bass, but they did stamp that 'B' on there! If the bass was muddy, bloated, or whatever, then there is an issue. A unilateral criticism of the level of bass is perhaps not sufficient to form a sound argument, so let's hear specific qualities of the sound!
  3. I know some people's primary language isn't English, so if anyone would like assistance expressing their thoughts in English, I'd be happy to help.
  4. For the owner of Lear to post snarky comments like that on their own forum is decidedly unprofessional, but hopefully we can continue high level discussions here on head-fi!


I listened to them after you gave me a heads up, although I have seen them before but never tried them. They are not bad but just not class leading for any particular genre. At the price they are good value for the money asked and it is a very well finished product. I think nowadays people are smart enough to decide what is good or bad....and as a step up from the 200-300 IEMs with the look of Customs, they will sell well.

 


Edited by spkrs01 - 4/13/12 at 10:47pm
post #40 of 53
Quote:
Originally Posted by spkrs01 View Post  I listened to them after you gave me a heads up, although I have seen them before but never tried them. They are not bad but just not class leading for any particular genre. At the price they are good value for the money asked and it is a very well finished product. I think nowadays people are smart enough to decide what is good or bad....and as a step up from the 200-300 IEMs with the look of Customs, they will sell well.


Thanks for that! We'll continue this talk in private... normal_smile%20.gif

 

post #41 of 53
Thread Starter 

Uh-Oh.... secret chatting.... wink_face.gif

 

Seriously though, thanks for the quick impressions. I would agree that they aren't blowing away the competition in dual driver models - it's just a different take on the sound signature, one that I happen to enjoy more than the others.

 

I just compared them to my 1964 Ears 1964-T which has three drivers and sells for roughly the same price. The 1964-T has way smooth highs, totally relaxed and laid back. More of a stage monitor sound. And the bass is tighter/more consistent, though it has less impact (which is a deliberate tuning choice rather than a flaw). Overall I'd say the 1964-T is more accurate, the LCM-2B more exciting. Which is better? Depends on your preferences (again).  

 

I just found this pseudo review from the Barks Japan website:

 

http://www.barks.jp/gakki/news/?id=1000075837

 

I think it is favorable overall but Chrome translation gives me a lot of nonsense phrases ("poking a face little by little"?) so I'm not positive. Can anyone do a better translation and summarize it for us? 

post #42 of 53

I think perhaps jackjack and his friends likes it when one section of sound excels. An iem like LCM which is average in all areas probably doesn't sound very appealing to people's ears.

post #43 of 53


 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Xymordos View Post

I think perhaps jackjack and his friends likes it when one section of sound excels. An iem like LCM which is average in all areas probably doesn't sound very appealing to people's ears.


I'm afraid I cant agree on that ,xymordos.

When I was testing LCMs, none of the them (except 1F?) gives me a "balanced"/ "flat" sound signature. LCMs dont sound average to me....Even for the part they focus on (bass/ clear/ flat), they cannot match their own introduction.

post #44 of 53

i didn't know they have their own product.  i had only been there once, few years back.  i remember they were only selling earphones and headphones.  they did have some custom cables for iem when custom cables weren't as popular as now.  i've been really busy lately. maybe i'll go when i have more time. 

post #45 of 53

Interesting product. Like how the shells look very clean. Great review!

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