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**Hifiman HE-400 Impressions and Discussion Thread** - Page 470

post #7036 of 17700
Quote:
Originally Posted by preproman View Post

 

Why??

 

His impression is just another subjective view.  Unless, you take his subjective impression as objective.  Measurement are the only thing that we can call objective at this point.  TBH to my they are still flawed.  But anyway.

Because I'm not a strictly "in objective we trust" person I guess; I respect and value the subjective impressions from people who actually try to listen with as little bias as possible, especially those who have versed enough impressions for me to have a fairly good understanding of their hearing acuity and preferences.

 

 

Don't judge me bro.

 

 

(Also I do agree that measurements, even fairly advanced stuff like CSDs, are still far from enough to show certain critical aspects of sound; they are not flawed, just insufficient IMO)


Edited by jerg - 2/7/13 at 10:46am
post #7037 of 17700
Quote:
Originally Posted by ninjames View Post

Well, I'm going on the premise that we're all crazy. To people not obsessed with headphones like us, we are definitely crazy.

I haven't been here too long, but I've figured out that setting my sarcasm detector to "strict" when reading Wayne's posts is best.

 

You don't even have to do that. Just quickly "proof" my post and you see that I have supplied some:  biggrin.gif  biggrin.gif  biggrin.gif in the post, it is meant to provide some humor.

 

For life is much too serious at times, so having a little chuckle here and there is good for all of us.    wink.gif

post #7038 of 17700
Quote:
Originally Posted by ninjames View Post

Well, I'm going on the premise that we're all crazy. To people not obsessed with headphones like us, we are definitely crazy.

For some people we might seem crazy. People that don't enjoy the finer things in life, and don't care one bit about sound quality.

 

My current audio setup is worth less than 600 euros. I've heard full sized audio systems worth double that, but didn't sound as good.

I'd say about one in ten grown men have a pretty expensive sound system that far exceeds my current setup. But that is considered very normal...

 

EDIT: Full size audio systems = speakers and stuff


Edited by Marleybob217 - 2/7/13 at 11:47am
post #7039 of 17700
Quote:
Originally Posted by jerg View Post

Because I'm not a strictly "in objective we trust" person I guess; I respect and value the subjective impressions from people who actually try to listen with as little bias as possible, especially those who have versed enough impressions for me to have a fairly good understanding of their hearing acuity and preferences.

 

 

Don't judge me bro.

 

 

(Also I do agree that measurements, even fairly advanced stuff like CSDs, are still far from enough to show certain critical aspects of sound; they are not flawed, just insufficient IMO)

 

 

Fair enough. Makes perfect sense to me.

 

To be clear.  I'm not saying measurements are flat out flawed - No.  Really I'm speaking on the HE-6 measurements.  Not other headphones.  I think all others are fairly objective.

post #7040 of 17700
Quote:
Originally Posted by chewy4 View Post

I would definitely be interested in seeing J$ vs jergpad vs velour graphs.

 

I would too.  But after all the J$ Beyerdynamic pads have been sold, and people have passed the statute of limitations with regards to being able to return them.  biggrin.gif

post #7041 of 17700
Quote:
Originally Posted by Marleybob217 View Post

For some people we might seem crazy. People that don't enjoy the finer things in life, and don't care one bit about sound quality.

 

My current audio setup is worth less than 600 euros. I've heard full sized audio systems worth double that, but didn't sound as good.

I'd say about one in ten grown men have a pretty expensive sound system that far exceeds my current setup. But that is considered very normal...

 

 

I can never understand this.

 

Every system that I've every heard that was double the cost - at the end of the day did sound better IMO.  Now, did it sound like it should cost double the price - no.  Case in point LCD-2 vs. LCD-3.  Are the LCD-3s worth the 1K difference - No, not to me.  However, IMO they do sound better.

post #7042 of 17700
Quote:
Originally Posted by wje View Post

 

I would too.  But after all the J$ Beyerdynamic pads have been sold, and people have passed the statute of limitations with regards to being able to return them.  biggrin.gif

I'm surprised there are still some left, I remember worrying about being able to get some about a month ago.

 

Until measurements are posted I'm going to assume that they have a completely smoothed out frequency response with a near instant decay in the CSD.

 

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by preproman View Post

 

 

I can never understand this.

 

Every system that I've every heard that was double the cost - at the end of the day did sound better IMO. Now, did it sound like it should cost double the price - no. Case in point LCD-2 vs. LCD-3. Are the LCD-3s worth the 1K difference - No, not to me. However, IMO they do sound better.

 

So if I take my system and embed it with diamonds is it gonna sound better?

 

People selling hifi equipment aren't following a whole lot of pricing standards. The correlation between sound and price isn't always going to be there.


Edited by chewy4 - 2/7/13 at 10:58am
post #7043 of 17700
Thread Starter 

^^ This is why I always to try buy used gear. For example, the lyr is a really good bargain at $450 IMO, but an outstanding value at what I paid used. And yes, I know that you forfeit the warranty, but as they are built like tanks and the repairs are not expensive it's certainly worth it for me to buy used. 

post #7044 of 17700
Quote:
Originally Posted by MattTCG View Post

^^ This is why I always to try buy used gear. For example, the lyr is a really good bargain at $450 IMO, but an outstanding value at what I paid used. And yes, I know that you forfeit the warranty, but as they are built like tanks and the repairs are not expensive it's certainly worth it for me to buy used. 

For me, the extra $80-100 is more than worth it for the warranty .. I just know, given my luck, I'll end up with broken equipment.

 

Also, I'm now contemplating selling my Little Dot MKIII to go toward the Mad Dogs ...

post #7045 of 17700
Quote:
Originally Posted by chewy4 View Post

I'm surprised there are still some left, I remember worrying about being able to get some about a month ago.

 

Until measurements are posted I'm going to assume that they have a completely smoothed out frequency response with a near instant decay in the CSD.

 

 

 

So if I take my system and embed it with diamonds is it gonna sound better?

 

People selling hifi equipment aren't following a whole lot of pricing standards. The correlation between sound and price isn't always going to be there.

 

Get Real - on the bold.

 

Please point me in a place where I can find a $500 system that sounds better than a $1000 - $1500 system.  I'm not being funny.  I would like to know.

 

Now the O2 will put up a fight with a lot of amps.  But I'll most likely like the amp that cost 2 times more.

post #7046 of 17700
Quote:
Originally Posted by preproman View Post

 

Get Real - on the bold.

 

Please point me in a place where I can find a $500 system that sounds better than a $1000 - $1500 system.  I'm not being funny.  I would like to know.

 

Now the O2 will put up a fight with a lot of amps.  But I'll most likely like the amp that cost 2 times more.

Eh, I'd rather not spark up a debate. There are better places for that than this thread. I'll just drop it.

post #7047 of 17700
Quote:
Originally Posted by preproman View Post

 

 

I can never understand this.

 

Every system that I've every heard that was double the cost - at the end of the day did sound better IMO.  Now, did it sound like it should cost double the price - no.  Case in point LCD-2 vs. LCD-3.  Are the LCD-3s worth the 1K difference - No, not to me.  However, IMO they do sound better.


I was talking about a full sized sound system, like speakers and stuff :p

 

I don't think it's even weird that headphones can sound better than speakers way below their price. The production costs are way higher in speakers than in headphones (I'm assuming this). Also, speakers will always be limited to the acoustics of the enterior of the house.

post #7048 of 17700

^^ Play nice guys! It wasn't my intention to start a fight :'(

 

Obviously headphone based sound systems will sound better when the price rizes. <- Roughly speaking, and up to a certain point.

 

But I think getting to a certain amount of sound quality with full sized speakers (when buying new) will cost more than with headphones.

post #7049 of 17700
Quote:
Originally Posted by Marleybob217 View Post


I was talking about a full sized sound system, like speakers and stuff :p

 

I don't think it's even weird that headphones can sound better than speakers way below their price. The production costs are way higher in speakers than in headphones (I'm assuming this). Also, speakers will always be limited to the acoustics of the enterior of the house.

 

 

Gotcha.  Yes - makes a difference..  Of course.

post #7050 of 17700
Quote:
Originally Posted by preproman View Post

I can never understand this.

 

Every system that I've every heard that was double the cost - at the end of the day did sound better IMO.  Now, did it sound like it should cost double the price - no.  Case in point LCD-2 vs. LCD-3.  Are the LCD-3s worth the 1K difference - No, not to me.  However, IMO they do sound better.

 

I can't say that's been the case for me.

 

I have a Stax SR-Lambda (with rebuilt drivers, admittedly) that I've been fond of, but I wasn't expecting to prefer it outright to the SR-202 and SR-303, which certainly cost more than their Normal bias grandfather does on the used market these days. They sounded different-kind of like the HE-400, in hindsight-but not better. Especially not in the midrange, which I prioritize most.

 

It could be that I'm just used to that old Lambda's way of presenting sound, but it does vocals in a way I've heard no other headphone do; it really seems like the vocalist is actually there, singing to you, totally natural and all. It doesn't seem like there's this raspy texture all over their voices that shatters the illusion, which has happened with many of the other higher-end headphones I've listened to.

 

How much of an expensive headphone's sound is expectation bias based on the price and its reputation, anyway?

 

Regardless, you may find that what you want out of a headphone isn't necessarily what the more expensive models are going to give you. Cost doesn't equal value to your ears.

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