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**Hifiman HE-400 Impressions and Discussion Thread** - Page 186

post #2776 of 18056
Quote:
Originally Posted by griff2 View Post

Ok well, I got my eagerly anticipated HE-400 today.  Now, my headphone collection includes the Sennheiser HD650 and my favourite closed back headphone the Beyer Dynamic DT 770 Pro.  I particularly like the DT 770s because they get to the heart of the music and present it as a coherent whole.  Anyway, I’ll cut to the chase on this: the first thing I noticed when I put the HE-400 on (before even plugging into my headphone amp) was a cuppy resonance – similar to if I’d cupped my hands over my ears (try it) – none of my other headphones do this, they all damp this resonance out.  On first listening to the HE-400, this cuppines was there and dominated the sound, ie although it was obvious the HE-400s drivers were excellent, there was a lack of cohesion to the music which spoilt the musical experience, in my opinion because of this annoying cuppy resonance.

 

I’m just thinking that maybe so much research and development has gone into getting the drivers right for the HD-400 that the headphone 101 of getting the interface to the ear has been missed.  Thoughts..

Can't say I've noticed the cuppy resonance you are describing. The mids sound extremely detailed and separated, albeit with slightly less-than-black background.

 

It's a different story if I actually cup my hands over the drivers though, but I don't think that's what you mean.

 

 

Edit: are you sure it's not just you disliking the sound signature? HE400 mids are coloured in that it has a mid-mids bump and a upper-mids dip.


Edited by jerg - 12/5/12 at 2:06pm
post #2777 of 18056
Thread Starter 

I can't imagine that you'd enjoy the hd650 and dt770 and not enjoy the he400. Each to his own though. If you don't like them pm me and I'll make you an offer on them.

post #2778 of 18056
Quote:
Originally Posted by jerg View Post

Can't say I've noticed the cuppy resonance you are describing. The mids sound extremely detailed and separated, albeit with slightly less-than-black background.

 

It's a different story if I actually cup my hands over the drivers though, but I don't think that's what you mean.

 

Yeah, can't say I've noticed it either. But just putting my hand near the cups has a really noticeable effect. It's a much stronger effect than with my HD 558. I wonder if that's because HE-400 is much more open or because it's a planar magnetic which has a membrane.

post #2779 of 18056
Quote:
Originally Posted by jerg View Post

Can't say I've noticed the cuppy resonance you are describing. The mids sound extremely detailed and separated, albeit with slightly less-than-black background.

 

It's a different story if I actually cup my hands over the drivers though, but I don't think that's what you mean.

 

 

Edit: are you sure it's not just you disliking the sound signature? HE400 mids are coloured in that it has a mid-mids bump and a upper-mids dip.

 

Aplogies, but I don’t think you understand what I’m saying.  If you cup your hands over your ears (without wearing headphones at all) you’ll get a resonant effect because your hands are acting as a reflector.  When I put the HD-400’s on I get a similar effect (before I even start to put anything through them).   In other words the HD-400s seem to lack the requisite damping to prevent the resonant effect of something reflective covering the ear. 

In terms of the resolving power of the drive units, I would agree that they are very good indeed and superior to both the Beyer Dynamic and Sennheiser headphones, particularly in the midrange.

post #2780 of 18056

Would would be the top 5 songs that the HE-400's would bring the hairs on your arms up, that you don't get the same from say the HD650's. In short what music (preferably popular) would your recommend with this HP's?

post #2781 of 18056
Quote:
Originally Posted by griff2 View Post

 

Aplogies, but I don’t think you understand what I’m saying.  If you cup your hands over your ears (without wearing headphones at all) you’ll get a resonant effect because your hands are acting as a reflector.  When I put the HD-400’s on I get a similar effect (before I even start to put anything through them).   In other words the HD-400s seem to lack the requisite damping to prevent the resonant effect of something reflective covering the ear. 

In terms of the resolving power of the drive units, I would agree that they are very good indeed and superior to both the Beyer Dynamic and Sennheiser headphones, particularly in the midrange.

 

I don't get the significance of this... you have a big diaphragm and magnet structs facing the ears, of course very minute amounts of sound bouncing off the ears will hit those and bounce back. Hell if I could actually perceive that effect though. Are you proposing that these need to have some damping material directly between the diaphragm and your ear canal?


Edited by jerg - 12/5/12 at 3:20pm
post #2782 of 18056
Quote:
Originally Posted by griff2 View Post

 

Aplogies, but I don’t think you understand what I’m saying.  If you cup your hands over your ears (without wearing headphones at all) you’ll get a resonant effect because your hands are acting as a reflector.  When I put the HD-400’s on I get a similar effect (before I even start to put anything through them).   In other words the HD-400s seem to lack the requisite damping to prevent the resonant effect of something reflective covering the ear. 

In terms of the resolving power of the drive units, I would agree that they are very good indeed and superior to both the Beyer Dynamic and Sennheiser headphones, particularly in the midrange.

 

He understood. He's just saying it doesn't happen to him and it only happens if he actually puts his hand on the cup. Doesn't happen for me either. In fact, this is the first time I've heard of this in all the hours of research I did on the HE-400. You got a faulty one, maybe?

post #2783 of 18056
Quote:
Originally Posted by griff2 View Post

 

Aplogies, but I don’t think you understand what I’m saying.  If you cup your hands over your ears (without wearing headphones at all) you’ll get a resonant effect because your hands are acting as a reflector.  When I put the HD-400’s on I get a similar effect (before I even start to put anything through them).   In other words the HD-400s seem to lack the requisite damping to prevent the resonant effect of something reflective covering the ear. 

In terms of the resolving power of the drive units, I would agree that they are very good indeed and superior to both the Beyer Dynamic and Sennheiser headphones, particularly in the midrange.

...What? You'll have to be a bit more precise, sorry. 

post #2784 of 18056
I
Quote:
Originally Posted by griff2 View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by jerg View Post

Can't say I've noticed the cuppy resonance you are describing. The mids sound extremely detailed and separated, albeit with slightly less-than-black background.

It's a different story if I actually cup my hands over the drivers though, but I don't think that's what you mean.


Edit: are you sure it's not just you disliking the sound signature? HE400 mids are coloured in that it has a mid-mids bump and a upper-mids dip.

Aplogies, but I don’t think you understand what I’m saying.  If you cup your hands over your ears (without wearing headphones at all) you’ll get a resonant effect because your hands are acting as a reflector.  When I put the HD-400’s on I get a similar effect (before I even start to put anything through them).   In other words the HD-400s seem to lack the requisite damping to prevent the resonant effect of something reflective covering the ear. 
In terms of the resolving power of the drive units, I would agree that they are very good indeed and superior to both the Beyer Dynamic and Sennheiser headphones, particularly in the midrange.

I actually think that "resonance" you speak of is its strong point. I don't know why you would be bothered by it, but the openess of the diaphrams really gives the sound a sense of transparency. The he400 with more dampening material would sound more like a HD650 with stronger bass and slightly darker mids. I doubt anybody would prefer a darker sound with the he400 qualities. When I first put on the he400, it almost felt like I had nothing on. The only thing I picked up on was a slight metallic veil over the sonic ambience in the room, giving the sound a colder, holographic sound signature. I mean, it's to be expected with something around your ears.
post #2785 of 18056
Quote:
Originally Posted by griff2 View Post

Ok well, I got my eagerly anticipated HE-400 today.  Now, my headphone collection includes the Sennheiser HD650 and my favourite closed back headphone the Beyer Dynamic DT 770 Pro.  I particularly like the DT 770s because they get to the heart of the music and present it as a coherent whole.  Anyway, I’ll cut to the chase on this: the first thing I noticed when I put the HE-400 on (before even plugging into my headphone amp) was a cuppy resonance – similar to if I’d cupped my hands over my ears (try it) – none of my other headphones do this, they all damp this resonance out.  On first listening to the HE-400, this cuppines was there and dominated the sound, ie although it was obvious the HE-400s drivers were excellent, there was a lack of cohesion to the music which spoilt the musical experience, in my opinion because of this annoying cuppy resonance.

 

I’m just thinking that maybe so much research and development has gone into getting the drivers right for the HD-400 that the headphone 101 of getting the interface to the ear has been missed.  Thoughts..

Maybe you're noticing ringing issues because of the grill? Have you tried taking the grill of? 

It's a known modification.

post #2786 of 18056
If he's talking about the resonance when placing your hands over the cups, thats a planar thing. Who the hell listen to thrir headphones that way anyways? Yes, its gonna be resonant if you do that. Fix? Dont do it.
post #2787 of 18056
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mad Lust Envy View Post

If he's talking about the resonance when placing your hands over the cups, thats a planar thing. Who the hell listen to thrir headphones that way anyways? Yes, its gonna be resonant if you do that. Fix? Dont do it.

Well I disagree.

 

I always put my hands over my headphones. 

Headphones must be capable of sounding good 'cupped'. It's a must really.

 

Joking ofcourse, but I can't imagine this is what he meant :p

post #2788 of 18056
Thread Starter 

^^ I must be missing something here. Why would anyone want to put their hands over the cups of the hp while listening to music. Of course it will sound wonky if you do that especially the he400. We have know this about them since the beginning. 

post #2789 of 18056

I believe most of you have misunderstood griff22's post. He says there is a resonance present similar to when you cup the driver with your hands. So I believe he means that it's present without cupping your hands over the driver. I may be wrong though, either way I don't detect it.

post #2790 of 18056
Quote:
Originally Posted by MattTCG View Post

^^ I must be missing something here. Why would anyone want to put their hands over the cups of the hp while listening to music. Of course it will sound wonky if you do that especially the he400. We have know this about them since the beginning. 

Let's not spend too much time on his problem untill he reformulates the question. 

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