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**Hifiman HE-400 Impressions and Discussion Thread** - Page 19

post #271 of 17698
Quote:
Originally Posted by TMRaven View Post

It's not really a stretch to say so.  My comparison between the two proves that very fact to me anyways.  The Denon might have more lower treble presence, but I still get a feeling of a decent treble spike in the upper treble range on the HE-400.  I just compared the two again for reference using Normalize by Flux Pavilion and Stayin' Alive.

 

I wouldn't call the Denon D2000 too extreme.  It's edgy yes, but nothing's extreme once you've heard a DT990.  Soft and resolved as the Beyer treble is, it's still a solar flare in comparison.

 

At least with the pleather, I never get a sense of a true spike.  Very nice, refined, detailed, articulate treble, but I don't get a sense of that spike, and I really must insist that the Denons (maybe D5k does have sharper treble than 2k?) are by far brighter, almost in the Beyer sense.  But yes, there's no question, once you've heard Beyer, nothing else short of Grado or HD800 will ever seem bright again eek.gif  HE-400 is simply not bright, in any way.  To call HE-400 bright would be to call HD650 and K702 "Beyer's new lineup" wink.gif

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Boss429 View Post

What would you guys recommend driving these HE-400's with? 

 

I currently have a Little Dot MK II. Someday I hope to upgrade to a Schiit Lyr, but I am afraid thats not going to be anytime soon. 

 

While they're relatively inefficient by headphone standards, they're efficient for ortho standards.  Virtually anything will drive them.  I won't deny that Lyr's my favorite, but my O2 drives them very well, in a different direction.  Even little E11's will drive them, though not as wonderfully as a higher end amp.

 

LDMKII is nice, but as an OTL, it may not be the best match for low impedance headphones.  It'll probably work, but I can't say how pleasing you'll find the output.  Generally OTL amps do better with higher impedance cans and can't generate the somewhat higher current required by low impedance cans.  But since HE-400 is more sensitive than other orhos, you still have a chance of it coming out ok!

post #272 of 17698

Thanks IEMCrazy,

 

I have considered buy a LD 1+ Hybrid, because it seems all my headphones I want are Low Impedance. I bought the LD MKII to drive my Beyerdynamic DT-880/600ohm and its pretty sweet with those. I just got some Denon D7000's and considering in a month or so adding either the HE-400 or Grado 325is. The latter three, would probably all benefit from the LD 1+ Hybrid?

post #273 of 17698
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Boss429 View Post

What would you guys recommend driving these HE-400's with? 

 

I currently have a Little Dot MK II. Someday I hope to upgrade to a Schiit Lyr, but I am afraid thats not going to be anytime soon. 

 

What are you using as a dac? That may be the more important question.

post #274 of 17698

Currently a FiiO e7.

 

Thats either going to be upgraded with a e17 or Little Dot I DAC. Probably going to be the LD, as it provides different input connections and a selector switch to switch between them. That way I could let all my TV, PS3, and PC all plugged in at the same time then switch between them. 

post #275 of 17698
Thread Starter 

The e17 pairs well with the he400's. It's my backup/portable amp currently but sound just great for all practical purposes. 

post #276 of 17698
Quote:
Originally Posted by MattTCG View Post

The e17 pairs well with the he400's. It's my backup/portable amp currently but sound just great for all practical purposes. 

 

Thing is, I dont need the portability factor. I dont own any portable devices. From what I read its a very good dac, but I am looking for something with some more options on it as far as inputs go. 

I am very happy with my e7, if it wasnt for wanting more input options I probably wouldnt even be looking at upgrading it. 

post #277 of 17698
Quote:
Originally Posted by MattTCG View Post

The e17 pairs well with the he400's. It's my backup/portable amp currently but sound just great for all practical purposes. 

 

Hey MattTCG, my he400s are coming tomorrow and I have a e17. are you eq'ing them at all? i know part of that question is personal preference, but i was just wondering how you listened to them.

can't wait! 

post #278 of 17698
Thread Starter 

If you want a full sized desktop amp to pair well with the he400, then look at the audio gd nfb12. It has a very nice dac with plenty of punch for the HFM line. 

 

 

Regarding the EQ, with the e17 I've found -2 on the treble and +2 on the bass is really nice. I never have used any EQ before...always listened flat. But the hardware EQ on the e17 has been nice.

post #279 of 17698
Quote:
Originally Posted by IEMCrazy View Post

 

At least with the pleather, I never get a sense of a true spike.  Very nice, refined, detailed, articulate treble, but I don't get a sense of that spike, and I really must insist that the Denons (maybe D5k does have sharper treble than 2k?) are by far brighter, almost in the Beyer sense.  But yes, there's no question, once you've heard Beyer, nothing else short of Grado or HD800 will ever seem bright again eek.gif  HE-400 is simply not bright, in any way.  To call HE-400 bright would be to call HD650 and K702 "Beyer's new lineup" wink.gif

 

 

 

 

Oh I'm sure once graphs and measurements are released for them, they'll showcase a bit of a spike in that range.  

post #280 of 17698
Quote:
Originally Posted by IEMCrazy View Post

 

What makes you so sure the Canare wouldn't also suit HE-500 better, based on personal preference, than the silver?  I would think with pleather pads and the Canare cable, they would start sounding a lot more like HE-400.  They'd still be brigher and more mids-centric, but the overall timbre and signature would probably be more similar.   I doubt HE-500 "benefits" from silver any more than 400, only that the sound signature is based on that general direction for each. 

 

I still have mixed feelings about silver cables.  They're crazy popular with HD650, and yet, if you brighten it too much, is it still and HD650?  (There's also the bit about spending $200-300 on a cable for a $500 headphone that used to cost $350.... )


I really love my HD650 with Moon Audio Blue Dragon V3 cable (NOT SILVER), yes I'm one of those who says that $200 after market cable makes difference and i paid $350 for my HD650.

post #281 of 17698
Quote:
Originally Posted by olegausany View Post


I really love my HD650 with Moon Audio Blue Dragon V3 cable (NOT SILVER), yes I'm one of those who says that $200 after market cable makes difference and i paid $350 for my HD650.

 

The most important part is what makes YOU happy with your listening experience.  A $200 cable can mean very different things to different people.  Some might not place as high of a value on having such a cable.  Yet, there will be others who may have more disposable income and think very little of the expense, yet enjoy what the cable brings to the cable.

 

I do have experience with Canare and the Mogami Quad Neglex.  The Mogami is a bit more than twice the cost (per linear foot), yet I do believe it is a slightly better sounding cable.  It was pretty much the norm on the last 2 or 3 Grado / Magnum modifications that I had performed.  I think as time goes by, I'll get another order in for some cable to make better 4-pin extension cables for my HifiMANs that I'm running off the speaker taps.  This will also include a new cable that leads to the golden connectors on the cups, too.

post #282 of 17698

My income not allowing me to spend $200 on cable just to show others i have one but once i got one i notice improvement in bass depth plus treble became refined

As i said before ON MY SETUP without external amp D5000/7000 more neutral and balanced for me than HE-400 plus light and comfortable. At the  same time HE-400 live well with recordings whose level is too high while on D5000 they are distorted. D7000 almost fix that problem but have only 95% of bass depth comparing to D5000 so i chose to keep D7000 to best overall sound. Plus i prefer pleather pads on HE-400 for bass but they less comfortable for me since i'm wearing glasses. I borrowed and tried E11 but didn't notice any improvement on HE-400 while noticed some bass improvement on HD650 but still not on par with HE-400 / D5000/7000 so i'm planning to sell HD650

post #283 of 17698
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by olegausany View Post


I really love my HD650 with Moon Audio Blue Dragon V3 cable (NOT SILVER), yes I'm one of those who says that $200 after market cable makes difference and i paid $350 for my HD650.

 

Wait, I thought that cable was silver...no?

post #284 of 17698
Quote:
Originally Posted by olegausany View Post


I really love my HD650 with Moon Audio Blue Dragon V3 cable (NOT SILVER), yes I'm one of those who says that $200 after market cable makes difference and i paid $350 for my HD650.

 

Interesting you went with blue.  What improvements did you notice from it?   I was considering a silver for a while, but after hearing O2 brighten up HE-400 (and disliking the result) I'm thinking blue/black may be preferable.  Did you try black or silver at all, or only the blue?

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by wje View Post

 

The most important part is what makes YOU happy with your listening experience.  A $200 cable can mean very different things to different people.  Some might not place as high of a value on having such a cable.  Yet, there will be others who may have more disposable income and think very little of the expense, yet enjoy what the cable brings to the cable.

 

My feeling on cables (beyond the fact that pre-made after-market cables are grossly overpriced for what you get, it is unfortunately the norm) is that compared to headphone, amp and DAC changes, a cable has marginal ability to change anything.  However, once you've settled on end-game source/amp and don't intend to upgrade it, cables, like tubes, can be used to slightly tweak/refine your sound where you want it to be.  Cost-to-performance they're miserable value, but  I do believe they can add the finishing touch to round out little issues with equipment you've already decided you like enough to stick with.

 

Other than maybe buying LCD-2 someday, I'm pretty much at end-game with HE-500/D5k/Lyr/Bifrost/O2.  I don't intend to upgrade the DAC or the amps (though I could add a "desktop O2' when available, not for improvement in sound but in connection options and fit & finish) and LCD-2 is the only remaining headphone I have much of any interest in at all unless I feel the desire to pick up T50's for playing with mods.  So on that front, tweaking via cables and tubes is a nice way to alter what I already like by slight margins.  And that's the only position I find them terribly worth recommending. 

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by MattTCG View Post

 

Wait, I thought that cable was silver...no?

 

Dragon in general, or what you thought olegausany bought?  For the dragons, blue & black Dragon are copper, Silver Dragon is silver.  Black supposedly has thicker gauge conductors as the main difference.

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by olegausany View Post

My income not allowing me to spend $200 on cable just to show others i have one but once i got one i notice improvement in bass depth plus treble became refined

As i said before ON MY SETUP without external amp D5000/7000 more neutral and balanced for me than HE-400 plus light and comfortable. At the  same time HE-400 live well with recordings whose level is too high while on D5000 they are distorted. D7000 almost fix that problem but have only 95% of bass depth comparing to D5000 so i chose to keep D7000 to best overall sound. Plus i prefer pleather pads on HE-400 for bass but they less comfortable for me since i'm wearing glasses. I borrowed and tried E11 but didn't notice any improvement on HE-400 while noticed some bass improvement on HD650 but still not on par with HE-400 / D5000/7000 so i'm planning to sell HD650

 

E11 isn't an excellent amp for HD650 which craves high voltage, or for that matter HE-400 or D5000 either, though I liked it better for HD650 than my Headroom Micro.  But HD650, and I think HE-400 really opens up on a hybrid amp.   D5000 I like with a nice SS amp though.  E11 isn't terrible for what it is, but I have all three headphones you mention (D5k not D7k) and E11 doesn't bring out the best in any of them the way Lyr or O2 does. Lyr (and most hybrids I'd guess) is pretty incredible with HE-400 and HD650.

 

But I'd love to know your Dragon impressions and comparisons, since I'm considering one!

post #285 of 17698
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by IEMCrazy View Post

 

Interesting you went with blue.  What improvements did you notice from it?   I was considering a silver for a while, but after hearing O2 brighten up HE-400 (and disliking the result) I'm thinking blue/black may be preferable.  Did you try black or silver at all, or only the blue?

 

 

My feeling on cables (beyond the fact that pre-made after-market cables are grossly overpriced for what you get, it is unfortunately the norm) is that compared to headphone, amp and DAC changes, a cable has marginal ability to change anything.  However, once you've settled on end-game source/amp and don't intend to upgrade it, cables, like tubes, can be used to slightly tweak/refine your sound where you want it to be.  Cost-to-performance they're miserable value, but  I do believe they can add the finishing touch to round out little issues with equipment you've already decided you like enough to stick with.

 

Other than maybe buying LCD-2 someday, I'm pretty much at end-game with HE-500/D5k/Lyr/Bifrost/O2.  I don't intend to upgrade the DAC or the amps (though I could add a "desktop O2' when available, not for improvement in sound but in connection options and fit & finish) and LCD-2 is the only remaining headphone I have much of any interest in at all unless I feel the desire to pick up T50's for playing with mods.  So on that front, tweaking via cables and tubes is a nice way to alter what I already like by slight margins.  And that's the only position I find them terribly worth recommending. 

 

 

Dragon in general, or what you thought olegausany bought?  For the dragons, blue & black Dragon are copper, Silver Dragon is silver.  Black supposedly has thicker gauge conductors as the main difference.

 

 

E11 isn't an excellent amp for HD650 which craves high voltage, or for that matter HE-400 or D5000 either, though I liked it better for HD650 than my Headroom Micro.  But HD650, and I think HE-400 really opens up on a hybrid amp.   D5000 I like with a nice SS amp though.  E11 isn't terrible for what it is, but I have all three headphones you mention (D5k not D7k) and E11 doesn't bring out the best in any of them the way Lyr or O2 does. Lyr (and most hybrids I'd guess) is pretty incredible with HE-400 and HD650.

 

But I'd love to know your Dragon impressions and comparisons, since I'm considering one!

 

For me, a cable change on the he400 made a significant difference. It definitely changed the sound signature. I happen to like the change. Both my cables (he400&d2k) are just to thick, heavy and inflexible. I bought a cable made by Chris_himself and I'm really appreciating the physical differences. Chris's cables are featherlite and very flexible. Also I made mine shorter for convenience.  Just makes for a more enjoyable experience all around IMO.

 

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