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**Hifiman HE-400 Impressions and Discussion Thread** - Page 1105

post #16561 of 18674
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bogatyr View Post
 

Hey guys I have a question and would like to hear your opinion on something.

 

Last year (mid March of 2013) I've purchased a pair of HE-400s. At the time of my purchase the Head-Direct website advertised a 3 year warranty on HE-400 model but couple of months ago I've noticed that the same website now offers only a 1 year warranty.

 

Which leaves me wondering - what the ****?

Normally I wouldn't worry about these things as I possess basic soldering skills but from my understanding this soon-to-be discontinued model will be quite difficult if not impossible to fix at home if a driver goes dead.

I have the same issue - basically, they changed their policy and while that smells a little like "bait and switch", good luck proving your case. I assume it is because their early-gen drivers were problematic but, now in their fourth iteration, they've ironed out most of the issues and feel less obligation to worry about failure. But they know their product's failure/defect rate, and we don't, making the odds favor them.

 

Longer warranty = Increased costs for company = less profit = worse for them

Longer warranty = reduced costs for consumer = less risk = better for them

 

1 yr warranty Vs. 3 yr warranty = Consumer loses

 

Given the premium pricing Hifiman is after, I think a better warranty should be standard. When Kia and Hyundai wanted to grab market share, part of the strategy was industry-first 10 year/ 100,000 mile warranties. Did A LOT to get people to take the "risk" on a younger company. Hifiman should take a lesson from that. I wanted a cable replacement and won't get it, and my issue is the exact issue others have commented on (making it possibly a design problem). But it'll cost me $60 bucks minimum to replace (15% of the phone's cost). Basically, it is making me want to find another company to buy from - if the Hifiman's used a more standard vanilla connector system it would be a lot cheaper and easier for me to just replace the stupid thing myself down the road. The thought of sinking $460 ($400 for phones, $60 for replacement cable) into these phones is just pushing it when my Sennheiser's are pushing 10 years old and still perfect.

 

The phones are awesome and all, but I feel pretty let down. Lesson learned.

post #16562 of 18674
Quote:
Originally Posted by MrMateoHead View Post
 

I have the same issue - basically, they changed their policy and while that smells a little like "bait and switch", good luck proving your case. I assume it is because their early-gen drivers were problematic but, now in their fourth iteration, they've ironed out most of the issues and feel less obligation to worry about failure. But they know their product's failure/defect rate, and we don't, making the odds favor them.

 

Longer warranty = Increased costs for company = less profit = worse for them

Longer warranty = reduced costs for consumer = less risk = better for them

 

1 yr warranty Vs. 3 yr warranty = Consumer loses

 

Given the premium pricing Hifiman is after, I think a better warranty should be standard. When Kia and Hyundai wanted to grab market share, part of the strategy was industry-first 10 year/ 100,000 mile warranties. Did A LOT to get people to take the "risk" on a younger company. Hifiman should take a lesson from that. I wanted a cable replacement and won't get it, and my issue is the exact issue others have commented on (making it possibly a design problem). But it'll cost me $60 bucks minimum to replace (15% of the phone's cost). Basically, it is making me want to find another company to buy from - if the Hifiman's used a more standard vanilla connector system it would be a lot cheaper and easier for me to just replace the stupid thing myself down the road. The thought of sinking $460 ($400 for phones, $60 for replacement cable) into these phones is just pushing it when my Sennheiser's are pushing 10 years old and still perfect.

 

The phones are awesome and all, but I feel pretty let down. Lesson learned.

 

Yep. Here's a screenshot from their store page last year. Take a look at the Warranty policy, it's been like that for months until they decided to discretely bump it down to 1 year and pretend that this never existed.

Created with GIMP


Edited by Bogatyr - 3/1/14 at 10:42am
post #16563 of 18674

I must've JUST missed the 3-year window. Sux.

post #16564 of 18674
Quote:
Originally Posted by MattTCG View Post
 

 

I owned both of these hp's for a long time as the make good complements to each. Now I only have the 650 while I wait for the new hifiman's to arrive. 


Darn...making me think I need to keep them both. Was not planning on that! You're right though, they both are different but compliment well.

post #16565 of 18674
Quote:
Originally Posted by beaver316 View Post
 

 

I think I've found your problem. You're using the standalone version of Electri-Q, not the posihfopit version. My standalone version is v1.8.9. My posihfopit version v1.0

 

Only the posihfopit version works with foobar, but you will need a VST wrapper to allow them to interface. My recommendation is this one.

 

I'm using the VST wrapper, the copy of posihfopit I have keeps crashing. Can you post up your copy? I keep getting a range check error


Edited by Daemos - 3/1/14 at 9:49pm
post #16566 of 18674

I currently have a garage1217 starlight amp with my HE400, do u guys think I will get a significant improvement by moving to project ember amp?

post #16567 of 18674
Quote:
Originally Posted by MrMateoHead View Post
 

Just wanted to say thanks for a great review...

 

I've been taking a break from the HE-400s and listening to Pioneer's BS-22s with subwoofer (I snapped a couple weeks ago). The imaging and midrange are so nice on them - vocals are always pegged to the center, and in front. My distance from the stage is literally my distance from the speaker - it is an uncanny and, to steal from a reviewer, "very seductive" effect. The treble is a tad laid-back for my taste, but they still retain great air and detail while seeming just a little warm with the sub working (sub is actually really good if a bit loose and boomy at around 40 hz). In effect, for $200 bucks all in, the Pioneers are highly satisfying. The main drawback is a lack of ultimate dynamic range - they go into compression somewhere around 90-100 dBs, so they don't get any "crank it" points, but at anything less than that they have the same awesome "effortlessness" of the HE-400s. They are the first speaker, of any type, I have ever owned, that I can listen to straight-up classical piano on without almost immediately sensing a timbre problem. Now that is a good speaker. Sadly, the HE-400s don't quite get there on the piano - there are some resonances / spikes in response in places I am not sure about that get in the way of a perfect performance. There is no question that I will be getting the Pioneer towers at some point - for about $250/pair they are a straight up giveaway to non-wealthy audiophiles like me.


Hi, thanks for taking the time to respond to my impressions on the 400 and 650. It's interesting to see what speaker systems you are listening to. I run Tannoy System 10 DMT II's thru a Hafler power amp for my 'desktop' system. Yes, it's huge overkill. I came from a recording studio background so I'm pretty much all about near and midfield professional driver matched monitors. My other speakers that I use are my yamaha MSP10's. I love these as well. I also have a pair of Mackie HR624's that are well, not getting much use, although they are decent enough.

 

I'm no expert but the Tannoy's with their dual concentric drivers hit the sweet spot for me for imaging. I'm a believer in the system. Here's a pic. So, they are the standard by which I'm comparing headphones. I know, it's kind of pointless to compare speaker experience with headphones, but I do. These are the ones I lust for being another poor somewhat audiophile - Tannoy Prestige Series

 

I mostly agree with you on the 400's. They are somewhat fun. They have moments where I'm very impressed but then sometimes not at all! I'm about 45 hours into 'burn in'. Maybe they will change some more?

 

Oh, and about the HD650. I've listened to a lot of Sennheisers and they do sound better. For example I owned the HD598 and never ever thought it was that great. I much prefer the Sony MA900 over that one. The 650 is very musical to me. You'll probably end up with a pair some day haha. Everyone does! You can't escape them.:) They are certainly not the most accurate but I'm feeling more and more they are musical.

 

Anyway, have the 400's on now..:P

post #16568 of 18674
They make a pretty good gaming headset smily_headphones1.gif

post #16569 of 18674
Quote:
Originally Posted by Daemos View Post
 

 

I'm using the VST wrapper, the copy of posihfopit I have keeps crashing. Can you post up your copy? I keep getting a range check error

 

Here is the latest and final version, I think it includes the posihfopit version in the installer.

 

http://www.savioursofsoul.de/Christian/vst-plugins/eqs-filters/electri-q/

post #16570 of 18674
Quote:
Originally Posted by beaver316 View Post
 

 

Here is the latest and final version, I think it includes the posihfopit version in the installer.

 

http://www.savioursofsoul.de/Christian/vst-plugins/eqs-filters/electri-q/

 

That's the one I have that doesn't work, and when I try to use the posihfopit version, it gives me the out of range error.

post #16571 of 18674
Quote:
Originally Posted by Daemos View Post
 

 

That's the one I have that doesn't work, and when I try to use the posihfopit version, it gives me the out of range error.

 

Try uninstall and reinstall it. If that doesn't help then try a different VST wrapper.

post #16572 of 18674
Quote:
Originally Posted by MrMateoHead View Post
 

 

I've not owned the HD-650s myself, but I have heard quite a few Sennheisers so I 'get' much of the appeal (comfort in fit and also sound quality). To me, however, most Senn's I've owned lack the speed and attack that really help get my attention and blood going. They were better for me as "background" phones and less successful when I really started listening critically and trying to search through the layers of sound. Also, while the midrange is great, they always trade off quite a bit of bass and treble energy for the sake of low-fatigue. Sometimes I just wanted more at both ends if you know what I mean! Anyway, the 650s have been out forever, and the main reason I've skipped them is that I think there are more interesting phones out for $500 these days. :D

 

 

A 650 properly amped is more "chill inducing" then anything I have heard. No need to get angry, but until you have heard them on a well matched amp do not assume, I know I did and I was wrong.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Citizen13469 View Post
 


Hi, thanks for taking the time to respond to my impressions on the 400 and 650. It's interesting to see what speaker systems you are listening to. I run Tannoy System 10 DMT II's thru a Hafler power amp for my 'desktop' system. Yes, it's huge overkill. I came from a recording studio background so I'm pretty much all about near and midfield professional driver matched monitors. My other speakers that I use are my yamaha MSP10's. I love these as well. I also have a pair of Mackie HR624's that are well, not getting much use, although they are decent enough.

 

 

I love David Haflers amps/preamps, good stuff!

post #16573 of 18674
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fearless1 View Post
 

A 650 properly amped is more "chill inducing" then anything I have heard. No need to get angry, but until you have heard them on a well matched amp do not assume

I'll just assume you are right about my assumptions. :rolleyes: In all seriousness though, I will demo them if I ever get the chance (or buy them if I can find them cheap), but I am more interested in exploring other brands at the moment. I want to downsize / simplify / and focus on value.

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Citizen13469 View Post


Hi, thanks for taking the time to respond to my impressions on the 400 and 650. It's interesting to see what speaker systems you are listening to. I run Tannoy System 10 DMT II's thru a Hafler power amp for my 'desktop' system. Yes, it's huge overkill. I came from a recording studio background so I'm pretty much all about near and midfield professional driver matched monitors. My other speakers that I use are my yamaha MSP10's. I love these as well. I also have a pair of Mackie HR624's that are well, not getting much use, although they are decent enough.

 

I'm no expert but the Tannoy's with their dual concentric drivers hit the sweet spot for me for imaging. I'm a believer in the system. Here's a pic. So, they are the standard by which I'm comparing headphones. I know, it's kind of pointless to compare speaker experience with headphones, but I do. These are the ones I lust for being another poor somewhat audiophile - Tannoy Prestige Series

 

I mostly agree with you on the 400's. They are somewhat fun. They have moments where I'm very impressed but then sometimes not at all! I'm about 45 hours into 'burn in'. Maybe they will change some more?

 

Oh, and about the HD650. I've listened to a lot of Sennheisers and they do sound better. For example I owned the HD598 and never ever thought it was that great. I much prefer the Sony MA900 over that one. The 650 is very musical to me. You'll probably end up with a pair some day haha. Everyone does! You can't escape them.:) They are certainly not the most accurate but I'm feeling more and more they are musical.

 

Anyway, have the 400's on now..:P

So much pressure to get some HD 650s lol. We'll see. "Musical" is usually a good descriptor but my next set of phones are probably focal spirit pros. Time to experience a superior "closed" phone and $350 MIGHT be a good deal.

 

Your desktop system IS overkill. Then again so is mine - the pioneers are running off a Class D amp which turned out to be rather awesome - totally black, and great SQ. For once going "cheap" on something didn't mean giving up quality. I've got about 170-200 RMS maybe 2 feet from my ears. The speakers work best at a minimum 3-6 feet probably, but as I wrote, image very well. So, sound appears to pour from my monitor and not the sides at only 1-2 feet away. Admittedly, I still have some "expectation bias" to work off - that 4 inch woofer just CAN'T be good - right? But it takes a beating and has a good roll off - they reach their limits and start compressing but I've not heard distortion or over-excursion. The sub blends very well and 'disappears', and if you don't push it too hard it is well behaved and won't chuff. It can't compare to my JL Microsub (the amazing ported sub that sounds sealed 90% of the time), but as far as 8's go, it impresses. :D

 

Mind you, I shopped for a decent 2.1 computer setup for awhile - in the $100-200 range. For about $300, this system destroys any of the computer 2.1s - if you can spare the space. It actually sounded damn good in the big living room too - filling it right up with good sound. Basically, my current dream system is 3 of the pioneer towers, 1 HSU 10 or 2 Pioneer subs, and a pair or two of the bookshelves and a Yamaha receiver. Other than missing out on concert level SPLs, such a system would no doubt be a fantastic music / movie system with few flaws @ about $1,000.

 

Option two is to finish my JBL system. I have some JBL Studio 8-inch three way book shelves (S38 series II) and the center channel in my brother's living room. They are amazing movie speakers, but less optimal for music. They have that JBL "tight" bass (sometimes lacking, sometimes perfect, sometimes "do I have a sub in here?"), and an airy midrange. But they are forward at high volume, losing some composure, and they have a very narrow and hard to find sweet spot (with exception of the center which has great dispersion). Then again the sweet spot is indeed sweet. I've thought about getting a solid 10-12 inch sub to pair with them and find some used Studio 6 inchers to hang on the wall but the cost is pretty high to finish the system vs. just going all in on Pioneer. The JBLs create a very convincing "Cinema" sound and handle Blu-Rays extremely well. Hands down, for movies, they kick all kinds of ass. They crank and handle the HD content in a way the pioneers just can't and work better in a larger room. Decisions decisions . . .

 

I figure monitors would be a lot more accurate and "in their element" on a desk, but they were too expensive and I wanted a full-range performance with a sub (and too much power if possible). But I am not surprised you like Concentric - I've tried that in cars and the imaging / blending is always better. But in a car, the placement sucks so you end up with better imaging / worse staging. Eventually, I am going to relocate my desk, and use stands to get the pioneers about 6 feet from my ears, toed in to the desk. The golden triangle ought to let me get the best response, widest stage, and retain solid imaging.

 

Ah audio. It never ends. ;)

post #16574 of 18674
Quote:
Originally Posted by MrMateoHead View Post
 

Basically, my current dream system is 3 of the pioneer towers, 1 HSU 10 or 2 Pioneer subs, and a pair or two of the bookshelves and a Yamaha receiver.

 

 

Yamaha RX-659's can be found on E-bay for under 100 dollars, Burr-brown DAC in them , awesome features, just no HDMI . I have owned multiple Yamaha's and none sound as good as the mentioned. I highly recommend it unless you want HDMI.  I have an newer RX-A3000 and it does not sound as good.

post #16575 of 18674
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fearless1 View Post
 

Yamaha RX-659's can be found on E-bay for under 100 dollars, Burr-brown DAC in them , awesome features, just no HDMI . I have owned multiple Yamaha's and none sound as good as the mentioned. I highly recommend it unless you want HDMI.  I have an newer RX-A3000 and it does not sound as good.

I was leaning toward the current RX-V375 as HDMI is a must and it can be had for $200. It isn't clear that spending more gets a better amp section until you are way up the price ladder and in any event, the added power wouldn't typically be a noticeable SPL gain (literally everything I can afford is somewhere in the 50-70 watt range, realistically). Then again Pioneer is all class D at this point, I think, and the Sony's seem to be better than I remember. But spending more seems to be about features these days, and not much else. Frankly a good 5 channel component amp and a surround decoder/receiver is all I really care to have at this point but the specs game makes it hard to guess where the value is (Emotiva and Outlaw amps start at $400-$700, worth every penny, but too much). I have experimented with wi-fi and "app" integration in a lot of current consumer products and they generally are not worth it. Or at least, they don't match the speed and convenience of just using a laptop as a media / streaming server.


Edited by MrMateoHead - 3/2/14 at 9:45am
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