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**Hifiman HE-400 Impressions and Discussion Thread** - Page 915

post #13711 of 18673
Quote:
Originally Posted by Thujone View Post
 

Look at the curve that jerg posted for the HE-400 measurements on stock pads for reference. Basically, to be "balanced", you need to bring up the recessed region by 10dB.

 

Hmmm what? Like this you mean? LOL

 


Edited by nicholars - 10/16/13 at 2:50pm
post #13712 of 18673
Quote:
Originally Posted by Textfeud View Post
 

Someone spell it out for us. :tongue: I need my balanced EQ on Amarra. :D

 

hahahahah your sig picture made me laugh :D

post #13713 of 18673

Crazy Mario, gotta love him. :D

post #13714 of 18673

You want it you got it -

 

Staring at a frequency response chart and trying to set your EQ properly is not necessarily the best way to go about trying to get a "flat" response. For one thing, audio measurements occur under controlled conditions (typically then averaged, meaning a different result occurs at each measure); a person sitting on a bus or at home is making adjustments much more "randomly". You certainly are not being precise, since your are limited in part by the quality of your equipment, and the accuracy of the chart you are staring at. I at least have no idea at all whether or not easy-EQ accurately gives me the curve I am looking for. It is a bit of a crap shoot.

 

Secondly, it is likely that enough variation in one's perception and sensitivity to various frequencies (AND recording quality for that matter) makes EQing a partly 'custom' endeavor and not a 'universal' one. I am convinced for example, via car audio, that atmospherics play a role. My systems always have seemed to sound better on foggy nights, worse on bitter cold nights. Bad time to make adjustments either way. Also, I don't think I can hear under 30-40hz or over 14-15khz so why bother screwing with frequencies at those extremes? Maybe you can, so making adjustments there is critical to your enjoyment. But I believe that perception is a big limiting factor, and using the wrong recordings can encourage excess boost or cut.

 

Thirdly, when frequency response is measured, it is sometimes done to report frequency response within a certain range. For example, speaker A does 50hz-15khz + or - 2dB, Speaker B does 40hz-20khz + or - 6.4 dB. Speaker A is relatively "flat", because frequencies typically stay within a range of what would not really be audible, where speaker B would like have peaks or dips that should be quite audible and depending on where they are, distracting, fatiguing, or possibly fun (big bass). I am not aware that there is a broad consensus as to the optimal headphone frequency response. I assume that flatter is better, but getting 'flat' is different with phones.

 

That said, lots of headphones 'roll off' bass and treble extremes or otherwise seem to have odd response curves. When looking at the HE-400 curve, what is most apparent is that it is quite flat through the range (20hz - 10khz). The big "scoop" is between 2khz-6khz, but lots of headphones "scoop" this area as well to different degrees. It is where a lot of sibilance I don't like can be found, so I consider it a good thing. But when looking at charts of "warmer phones", I expect to see relatively flat response curves with rolling off starting somewhere in the 2-4 khz range. Or, basically, a downward sloping line starting at bass and dropping through the midrange and treble.

 

The General Rule I use for EQ is always to look for a peak to 'cut', not a trough to 'boost'. If I wanted more sub-bass with the HE-400, I would consider cuts in the 100-500 hz range. If the treble is killing you, focus on around 8-10 khz. Admittedly, the HE-400 gives a profile that is not easy to EQ, since it looks like it needs a big boost in the 2khz-6khz area, not cuts in bass or high frequencies. But for best results, I find that cutting 8-10khz region and again around 14khz by about 2-4 db makes the overall sound better for my ears.

post #13715 of 18673

Yes I agree, looking at the FR graph it *should* make the HE400 sound better by boosting the 2-6khz but to my ears it does not sound right.... I think it is because this was how the headphones were designed to sound. I lower >8khz but leave the rest flat because for some reason the mids just sound *wrong* when changed (to me anyway) ... I just accept that the HE400 has dark upper mids and enjoy it for what it is... Might give EQ'ing the upper mids another try but when I have tried it before it seems to mess up the sound too much whereas EQ >8khz removes the sibilance and tizz nicely without causing any problems if you do it right...

post #13716 of 18673
Quote:
Originally Posted by Textfeud View Post
 

Anyone using HE-400 with Amarra and have some good EQ presets for me? I'm new to Amarra and EQ'ing. I bought Amarar Hifi so I could use it with iTunes EQ but it doesn't work with custom presets. So now I'm going to try out Amarra! I want the HE-400 balanced.


Did you look at Audirvana+ plus ? It is only $74 and it is great. I tried Amarra and did not like the interface. A+ has an old school AV receiver-type interface and I think it needs to be re-skinned for sure but the sound is superb and easy to use. No limits on file types (flac to aiff...why!?) /sample rates either.


Edited by Lohb - 10/17/13 at 3:29am
post #13717 of 18673
Quote:
Originally Posted by MunkyNutz View Post
 


Did you look at Audirvana+ plus ? It is only $74 and it is great. I tried Amarra and did not like the interface. A+ has an old school AV receiver-type interface and I think it needs to be re-skinned for sure but the sound is superb and easy to use. No limits on file types (flac to aiff...why!?) /sample rates either.


Yes, I have Audirvana + demo up and running. Decided on Amarra Hifi because I liked the soundsignature better. Might get it though, but still unsure. It's a little bit more laidback than Amarra and I like a more forward sound.

post #13718 of 18673
Quote:
Originally Posted by nicholars View Post
 

Yes I agree, looking at the FR graph it *should* make the HE400 sound better by boosting the 2-6khz but to my ears it does not sound right.... I think it is because this was how the headphones were designed to sound. I lower >8khz but leave the rest flat because for some reason the mids just sound *wrong* when changed (to me anyway) ... I just accept that the HE400 has dark upper mids and enjoy it for what it is... Might give EQ'ing the upper mids another try but when I have tried it before it seems to mess up the sound too much whereas EQ >8khz removes the sibilance and tizz nicely without causing any problems if you do it right...


Could you maybe post your EQ preset because I too like the mids the way they are.

post #13719 of 18673
Quote:
Originally Posted by nicholars View Post
 

 

Hmmm what? Like this you mean? LOL

 

:D

post #13720 of 18673

I've found that around an additional 5-6db at 5khz is about neutral for the HE-400.  2khz is pretty fine default, but maybe could use a bump of around 1-2 db rise.  3-4khz could use a rise between 2 and 6db.  10db raise at 6khz makes them sound like an HD700, if that's your thing.


Edited by TMRaven - 10/17/13 at 5:47am
post #13721 of 18673
Quote:
Originally Posted by TMRaven View Post
 

I've found that around an additional 5-6db at 5khz is about neutral for the HE-400.  2khz is pretty fine default, but maybe could use a bump of around 1-2 db rise.  3-4khz could use a rise between 2 and 6db.  10db raise at 6khz makes them sound like an HD700, if that's your thing.


This is what I make of it, please don't laugh.

 

 

post #13722 of 18673
Quote:
Originally Posted by Textfeud View Post


This is what I make of it, please don't laugh.



I really think it depends on music genre. The 400 is my electronic music hp, so I bump 30Hz a bit and then do a moderate rolloff after 4kHz.
post #13723 of 18673
Quote:
Originally Posted by Textfeud View Post
 


Could you maybe post your EQ preset because I too like the mids the way they are.

 

Something like this sounds good to me with electronic music.... I am a bit of a basshead.... That amount of treble EQ removes most of the tizz / sibilance and you do not lose much detail.  Change the amount of bass and treble depending how much you like... Also depending on the quality of the recording / mp3... I dont like sibilance...

 

 

Here is an even more EQ'd version for uber bass and smooth treble.... Might look like a lot but it's good if the recording is bad or the mp3 low bitrate.... The HE400 still sound brighter than something like HD650, even with this much EQ....

 

 

 

lol....


Edited by nicholars - 10/17/13 at 7:39am
post #13724 of 18673
Quote:
Originally Posted by nicholars View Post
 

 

Something like this sounds good to me with electronic music.... I am a bit of a basshead.... That amount of treble EQ removes most of the tizz / sibilance and you do not lose much detail.  Change the amount of bass and treble depending how much you like... Also depending on the quality of the recording / mp3... I dont like sibilance...

 

Earlier I thought the roll off from 8K and upwards had huge detail loss in the treble, however when I add 3-4 db in the 2k-4k region, it brings out the detail in the treble (or upper midrange, whatever you wanna call it) that I really enjoy. I don't think the sonic information in the 8K region and above is very important anyways. Let me know if I'm wrong

post #13725 of 18673
Quote:
Originally Posted by mogulmaster View Post
 

Earlier I thought the roll off from 8K and upwards had huge detail loss in the treble, however when I add 3-4 db in the 2k-4k region, it brings out the detail in the treble (or upper midrange, whatever you wanna call it) that I really enjoy. I don't think the sonic information in the 8K region and above is very important anyways. Let me know if I'm wrong

The best way to tell is to take 8k and above all the way down to zero and see if you like it. When I originally bought the HE-400, I did something similar to this but over time I grew fond of the treble energy; it just makes everything sound more crisp.

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