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**Hifiman HE-400 Impressions and Discussion Thread** - Page 836

post #12526 of 17595
Quote:
Originally Posted by TMRaven View Post
 

Might be a 'getting used to it'k ind of deal.  For example, if you EQ a treble rolloff to make the HE-400's treble more neutral, on some songs you might notice a drastic difference right away, and it might sound veiled in comparison.  That's by no means a loss of detail or clarity though, it just means the more treble you have the more perceived clarity you have.  Give that EQ'd treble a good 10 minutes of listening though, and it'll quickly become your norm.

 

Listen to this guy. Give your ears some time to get used to. At least 20 minutes imo. As for subbass, you can decrease it less and is what I do as well. HE-400 has a bit too much bass in the 200~600Khz area IMO which veils the mids quite a lot. To those that do not eq down the midbass and just the trebles, the whole sound sounds veiled because both the mids and treble has lost presence! 

 

Also for those that say EQing reduces SQ. I believed the same as well. But when you learn to EQ well, you get to know that it does not decrease SQ at all. It's all about the balance between the bass, mids and the trebles as a whole since every frequency bands affect one another IMO again.

 

For those that wanna try out my EQ settings:

 

I use Jriver so I use the bands used there.

 

60hz: -2.3db

170hz: -3.5db

310hz: -3.5db

600hz: -3.1db

1khz: 0db

3khz: +1.2db

6khz: 0db

12khz: -1.5db

14khz: -1.5db

16khz: -1.5

 

with using parametric EQ, decrease 8khz by -3db with bandwidth of 1.

 

I'm using these settings with jergpads as well btw. Also, some alteration from that as base will be fine according to your personal preference since I've been changing myself as well. But with this setting, I don't get treble spikes, and overall a balanced sound with mids clear and bass present when called upon which is how it is on neutral phones.

 

Please don't bash me if you don't like these settings haha... I just wanted to share :)


Edited by jay567 - 9/5/13 at 10:23am
post #12527 of 17595
Quote:
Originally Posted by Muzika View Post
 

 

That's the main problem I've had so far with EQ'ing. I haven't been able to EQ without it sounding as though it's been EQ'd! By that I mean the balance seems out of wack, or clarity is lost in the high-end. So far I'm presuming that's due to my poor EQ skills; I've tried other people's presets and attempted the proper EQ'ing guide here on the forums (but had trouble getting through it) though sadly I'm yet to have any real success. And with all the time I'd already spent researching the headphones and potential alternatives and reading various guides, plus time for modification and also sorting out my media player + library - I've so far lost patience with trying to get the headphones to a truly listenable and carefree state. Hence my lack of enthusiasm for them.

 

It's been good as a learning process and I've largely enjoyed being forced to get to know my HE-400s more intimately, but it reaches a point where it becomes frustrating and rather annoying to have to do so much work to get a professionally designed, moderately expensive pair of headphones to work well. I do believe in these headphones, and that they're quite exceptional to other people, I'm just yet to really get there myself.

 

I know exactly what you mean here. Back when I was busy experimenting with different EQ setups trying to find the perfect curve for the HE-400, there were occasions where if I EQed the treble too much, it would totally change the sound signature. It sounded unnatural and veiled despite removing the harshness completely. Even when I listened to it for a good 10 minutes I couldn't adjust. It's best to find the right compromise, don't change it too much where the overall sound suffers, and at the same time don't change it too little where you hardly hear a difference. With the right compromise you can achieve an outcome where the sound seems totally natural and you would never guess EQ was being applied.

post #12528 of 17595

I noticed it is dependent on genre.... For example rock or metal music sound wrong with a lot of EQ on the treble but electronic music you do not notice it really, probably because it is not reproducing real sounds a lot of the time, except vocals which the HE400 is pretty good at anyway.

post #12529 of 17595
Quote:
Originally Posted by beaver316 View Post
 

I know exactly what you mean here. Back when I was busy experimenting with different EQ setups trying to find the perfect curve for the HE-400, there were occasions where if I EQed the treble too much, it would totally change the sound signature. It sounded unnatural and veiled despite removing the harshness completely. Even when I listened to it for a good 10 minutes I couldn't adjust. It's best to find the right compromise, don't change it too much where the overall sound suffers, and at the same time don't change it too little where you hardly hear a difference. With the right compromise you can achieve an outcome where the sound seems totally natural and you would never guess EQ was being applied.

I can indeed agree with this. The correct balance can be really hard to find.

post #12530 of 17595

Nothing like swapping from the HE-400 and finding that all your other headphones are super veiled... because you forgot to turn the EQ off...:p

post #12531 of 17595
Quote:
Originally Posted by jay567 View Post
 

 

Listen to this guy. Give your ears some time to get used to. At least 20 minutes imo. As for subbass, you can decrease it less and is what I do as well. HE-400 has a bit too much bass in the 200~600Khz area IMO which veils the mids quite a lot. To those that do not eq down the midbass and just the trebles, the whole sound sounds veiled because both the mids and treble has lost presence! 

 

Also for those that say EQing reduces SQ. I believed the same as well. But when you learn to EQ well, you get to know that it does not decrease SQ at all. It's all about the balance between the bass, mids and the trebles as a whole since every frequency bands affect one another IMO again.

 

For those that wanna try out my EQ settings:

 

I use Jriver so I use the bands used there.

 

60hz: -2.3db

170hz: -3.5db

310hz: -3.5db

600hz: -3.1db

1khz: 0db

3khz: +1.2db

6khz: 0db

12khz: -1.5db

14khz: -1.5db

16khz: -1.5

 

with using parametric EQ, decrease 8khz by -3db with bandwidth of 1.

 

I'm using these settings with jergpads as well btw. Also, some alteration from that as base will be fine according to your personal preference since I've been changing myself as well. But with this setting, I don't get treble spikes, and overall a balanced sound with mids clear and bass present when called upon which is how it is on neutral phones.

 

Please don't bash me if you don't like these settings haha... I just wanted to share :)

Sorry for the noob question, but Isnt the spike around 9khz?

post #12532 of 17595

^you can't rely on the headphone.com graph. The treble is elevated from 8kHz and onwards to 16 kHz or so as I remember

post #12533 of 17595
Quote:
Originally Posted by realityhas View Post
 

Sorry for the noob question, but Isnt the spike around 9khz?

 

You know what, after some more listening with all genres, I did think that bandwidth of 3 with -4~5dB worked better. So yeah you are right. But it's that specific part only that's really peaky. The rest just needs toning down fairly lightly.

post #12534 of 17595

Just slightly off-topic.  Would anyone consider baking a cake for me next month in the shape of some HIfiMan headphones?  As for the frosting, I'm open to any color - so let your creative juices flow.  I won't be picky with the details like the black mesh driver screens so that area doesn't have to be too accurate.  I think this kind of cake would be really unique.  Oh, you're probably wondering what the occasion is?  Well, my old self will be turning 50 years old.  I'm not sure if I'm currently in a mid-life crisis, gone past a mid-life crisis or would be heading into a mid-life crisis down the road.  So far, I don't have any radical desires to splurge on a red Corvette convertible so I can drive with the top down and let my receding hairline fly all over the place.

 

That is all.  Thank you.  :p

 

Oh, based on my 5 decades of life, I feel like I've learned a lot of skills from working with electronics as a hobby, to automotive diagnosis and repair.  These are just side hobbies and not my day job.  For the day job, I work with lots of great clients, do a fair bit of business analysis, write system specs, configure and customize COTS CRM products for about 20 user agencies.  It's a job I love.  Really.  To me, it doesn't feel like work.  I don't even remember which Fridays I get paid because my wife is the CFO of our family.  Thus, I've always had a quite conservative budget when dealing with my audio purchases.  None of the ultra fancy stuff.  So, back to the skills area.  I think there might be plenty of you young-ins out there that may benefit from such knowledge and experience in the business climate - both private and pubic sector.  Or even some of the common sense items that I've discovered along the way, too.  I'm not willing to share or give away such knowledge, but do believe the hourly rates could be open to negotiation.  I must remind you though, my rates will never go below the 3-figure range.  Get yer wallets ready gentlemen ... or, any ladies too.  :D

 

Now, get back to the HE-400 discussion.  Stat!

post #12535 of 17595
Quote:
Originally Posted by wje View Post

Just slightly off-topic.  Would anyone consider baking a cake for me next month in the shape of some HIfiMan headphones?  As for the frosting, I'm open to any color - so let your creative juices flow.  I won't be picky with the details like the black mesh driver screens so that area doesn't have to be too accurate.  I think this kind of cake would be really unique.  Oh, you're probably wondering what the occasion is?  Well, my old self will be turning 50 years old.  I'm not sure if I'm currently in a mid-life crisis, gone past a mid-life crisis or would be heading into a mid-life crisis down the road.  So far, I don't have any radical desires to splurge on a red Corvette convertible so I can drive with the top down and let my receding hairline fly all over the place.

That is all.  Thank you.  tongue.gif

Oh, based on my 5 decades of life, I feel like I've learned a lot of skills from working with electronics as a hobby, to automotive diagnosis and repair.  These are just side hobbies and not my day job.  For the day job, I work with lots of great clients, do a fair bit of business analysis, write system specs, configure and customize COTS CRM products for about 20 user agencies.  It's a job I love.  Really.  To me, it doesn't feel like work.  I don't even remember which Fridays I get paid because my wife is the CFO of our family.  Thus, I've always had a quite conservative budget when dealing with my audio purchases.  None of the ultra fancy stuff.  So, back to the skills area.  I think there might be plenty of you young-ins out there that may benefit from such knowledge and experience in the business climate - both private and pubic sector.  Or even some of the common sense items that I've discovered along the way, too.  I'm not willing to share or give away such knowledge, but do believe the hourly rates could be open to negotiation.  I must remind you though, my rates will never go below the 3-figure range.  Get yer wallets ready gentlemen ... or, any ladies too.  biggrin.gif

Now, get back to the HE-400 discussion.  Stat!
Wayne: advance greetings from the Eastern Hemisphere. On that cake do you want a replica of the jerpads by modulor on the side?😄 Have a great one!
post #12536 of 17595
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by wje View Post
 

Just slightly off-topic.  Would anyone consider baking a cake for me next month in the shape of some HIfiMan headphones?  As for the frosting, I'm open to any color - so let your creative juices flow.  I won't be picky with the details like the black mesh driver screens so that area doesn't have to be too accurate.  I think this kind of cake would be really unique.  Oh, you're probably wondering what the occasion is?  Well, my old self will be turning 50 years old.  I'm not sure if I'm currently in a mid-life crisis, gone past a mid-life crisis or would be heading into a mid-life crisis down the road.  So far, I don't have any radical desires to splurge on a red Corvette convertible so I can drive with the top down and let my receding hairline fly all over the place.

 

That is all.  Thank you.  :p

 

Oh, based on my 5 decades of life, I feel like I've learned a lot of skills from working with electronics as a hobby, to automotive diagnosis and repair.  These are just side hobbies and not my day job.  For the day job, I work with lots of great clients, do a fair bit of business analysis, write system specs, configure and customize COTS CRM products for about 20 user agencies.  It's a job I love.  Really.  To me, it doesn't feel like work.  I don't even remember which Fridays I get paid because my wife is the CFO of our family.  Thus, I've always had a quite conservative budget when dealing with my audio purchases.  None of the ultra fancy stuff.  So, back to the skills area.  I think there might be plenty of you young-ins out there that may benefit from such knowledge and experience in the business climate - both private and pubic sector.  Or even some of the common sense items that I've discovered along the way, too.  I'm not willing to share or give away such knowledge, but do believe the hourly rates could be open to negotiation.  I must remind you though, my rates will never go below the 3-figure range.  Get yer wallets ready gentlemen ... or, any ladies too.  :D

 

Now, get back to the HE-400 discussion.  Stat!

 

Wayne,

 

I'm happy to bake you that cake. I'm not sure what it will look like after shipping but I'll mark it fragile. It will come in a usps flat rate medium box and I'm sure that our postal service will handle with care. ;) Happy 50th!! I wish you the very best and 50 more brother. 

post #12537 of 17595

 

Close if the colors were reversed.

 

Happy B-day Wayne!

post #12538 of 17595

Happy Birthday wje! Hope it's fantastic for you! 

 

Onto an unrelated topic, does anyone know if the HE-400 cable is a 4 conductor down to the TRS jack? If I cut it off could I then put an XLR jack on it? 

I was considering picking up an upgrade NFB-10ES2 upgrade or NFB-28 and I'd like to run my HE-400/500 balanced (I've got 2 stock HE-400 cables).  

post #12539 of 17595
Quote:
Originally Posted by Uberbob102000 View Post
 

Happy Birthday wje! Hope it's fantastic for you! 

 

Onto an unrelated topic, does anyone know if the HE-400 cable is a 4 conductor down to the TRS jack? If I cut it off could I then put an XLR jack on it? 

I was considering picking up an upgrade NFB-10ES2 upgrade or NFB-28 and I'd like to run my HE-400/500 balanced (I've got 2 stock HE-400 cables).  

 

Yup, you certainly could!  It's Canare Star Quad cable though, so you'd have to have a multimeter or tester to figure out which trace is which, as there will be 2 white and 2 blue wires.

 

 

 

Happy Birthday Wayne!

:beerchug:

post #12540 of 17595
Quote:
Originally Posted by jerg View Post
Really negative as in "how is this scam being sold for $400 even Beats are better" negative? Or that it is not up to snuff for your standards, disregarding the price?

 

Because you may or may not know this but, people get HE400s for the sake of a good compromise, in getting really exceptional bass (for the price), open and detail-oriented sound, without breaking the bank too badly.

 

Everyone knows about the shortfalls of HE400 already (tizzy treble, dark upper mids, grey somewhat uneven background) or at least I hope so, and I'm interested to see if you will grill these cans further than that.

 

Haha no, I don't think the Beats are better. Definitely more along the lines of the latter. And my complaints do go beyond those things you mentioned. In any case the review isn't done yet so I shouldn't say too much about it now.

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