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Schiit Gungnir DAC - Page 74

post #1096 of 1669
Quote:
Originally Posted by justie View Post

Hey guys, has anyone tried using a USB 3.0 cable with the gungnir before? Also, is there even a difference between a usb 2 and usb 3 cable?

 

EDIT: nvm, just realised the usb3.0 male B plug is different.

Bits is bits. They are either there "1" or absent "0" -- if the existing cable does not "lose" bits, then no amount of cable improvement will make any sonic difference.  Period.  

 

I'm not sure if there are any cable eval tools.  One way to do it would be to hang a large disk drive off your USB and test cable and turn on disk driver debugging (using some sort of Linux) to see if there are any read/write errors, then pump data to it all day long.  A 6MB/sec disk or SSD would be the best.

 

Cheers,

Frank

post #1097 of 1669
Quote:
Originally Posted by pelli View Post

This could be a pretty simple A/B if you connect a Mjo/Gun stack with both balanced and single ended ICs and switched the Mjolnir between SE and balanced.  You could even enlist a friend for a blind test to see if there is a placebo free difference.  

 

I have both the Gungnir and an Uber Bifrost.  When either drive my single ended headphone amp (Twisted Pear Ventus) I can NOT tell the difference.  I CAN tell the difference when I A/B them to my Wyred4sound STI-1000 as it has both balanced and single ended inputs.  Before I upgraded the Bifrost to Uber, I could tell the difference between the two DACs on phones.

 

Phones are Sennheiser HD800, DACs are USB driven with 24/192khz material via a MacBook Pro and Audirvana+

 

Cheers,

Frank

post #1098 of 1669
"Bits is bits. They are either there '1' or absent '0' -- if the existing cable does not 'lose' bits, then no amount of cable improvement will make any sonic difference. Period." Without wanting to get into this time-honored disagreement yet again, let me gently suggest a couple of potential considerations. I am no expert, so what I'm suggesting could just be trash and ignorable, in which case, go ahead and ignore it. - Thought experiment: No music playing through the cable. Lots of electrical noise, though. Can you hear it? If we're not talking about an optical cable, then sure, it's an electrical wire. The fact that someone slaps the label "USB" on it doesn't make it suddenly immune to electrical noise. So if one cable deals with noise better than another, there's a potential difference. - Reading through a white paper by the former ESS SABRE DAC developers (now Resonessence), I saw a paragraph about how it is critical for the DAC chip to have a constant voltage level for comparison when it's evaluating whether a bit is 1 or 0 and the time when changeover occurs. So electrical noise in the power used by the DAC chip might potentially result in jitter. - Electrical noise into the DAC's clock(s) might also conceivably cause jitter. A link to some pictures and text (not by a native English speaker) that might be of interest in this connection: http://www.phasure.com/index.php?topic=2557.msg26459#msg26459
post #1099 of 1669
Quote:
Originally Posted by judmarc View Post

"Bits is bits. They are either there '1' or absent '0' -- if the existing cable does not 'lose' bits, then no amount of cable improvement will make any sonic difference. Period." Without wanting to get into this time-honored disagreement yet again, let me gently suggest a couple of potential considerations. I am no expert, so what I'm suggesting could just be trash and ignorable, in which case, go ahead and ignore it. - Thought experiment: No music playing through the cable. Lots of electrical noise, though. Can you hear it? If we're not talking about an optical cable, then sure, it's an electrical wire. The fact that someone slaps the label "USB" on it doesn't make it suddenly immune to electrical noise. So if one cable deals with noise better than another, there's a potential difference. - Reading through a white paper by the former ESS SABRE DAC developers (now Resonessence), I saw a paragraph about how it is critical for the DAC chip to have a constant voltage level for comparison when it's evaluating whether a bit is 1 or 0 and the time when changeover occurs. So electrical noise in the power used by the DAC chip might potentially result in jitter. - Electrical noise into the DAC's clock(s) might also conceivably cause jitter. A link to some pictures and text (not by a native English speaker) that might be of interest in this connection: http://www.phasure.com/index.php?topic=2557.msg26459#msg26459

 

I DO NOT disagree with judmarc's caveat.  Yes, noise and other interference CAN make a difference.  I'm sure there is some threshold where suddenly - and it WILL be suddenly - the cable causes errors.  Or a super-cheap or damaged cable is simply not up to snuff.  Whether the noise causes jitter or loss, the plot of where the loss/jitter occurs will be a step, not some nice curve on a graph.

 

The data wires in USB are twisted pair - this eliminates most noise.  Compare to speed and reach of Gigabit Ethernet where the spec is 100 meters on twisted pair.  USB also includes grounded shielding whereas GigE does not.  Some USB cables have ferrite cores on each end, this will also help.

 

One interesting factoid is that USB2.0 is limited to 5 meters simply because the spec requires a 1.5 micro-second response (turn-around time) to a command, else it considers the command lost.

 

There is a lot of good info on Wikipedia (take with grains of salt): https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Universal_Serial_Bus

 

This site has a fairly coherent description of async USB:  http://audiophilleo.com/definitions.aspx?Asynchronous%20USB

 

The bottom line is that there are LOTS of other places that are more likely to cause audio degradation than the USB cable!

 

That being said, if using Windoze there is a tool:  http://www.usblyzer.com/  that could help.  It has a 33 day free trial.

 

Cheers,

Frank

post #1100 of 1669

Is there a way to connect an iphone (either 4 or 5) to the Gungnir successfully?

 

I have the Apple Camera Connection Kit, and it works great with my 3rd gen iPad connected to the Gungnir.  It doesn't, however work with the iphone, which is mentioned in other threads.

 

I've searched this thread pretty thoroughly and couldn't find an answer so hopefully this question isn't a repeat.

post #1101 of 1669

You need a airplay compatible device to get digital out of iPhones. I'd suggest the Apple TV or AirPort express. If you do pick up one of those devices, make sure you look out for the "buy better gear" light (far right).

 

That's the easy solution, the probably better but more difficult one is installing XBMC and enabling it's AirPlay services to stream music from your phone, to your PC and out it's digital port.

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hrSfqOWETv8

 

Good luck!

post #1102 of 1669

Don't forget about the Pure i20, it will extract the spdif signal from an iPod/iPhone and send it to the Gungnir via toslink or coaxial and includes a remote for $99.

post #1103 of 1669
As of last night I'm the proud owner of a Gungnir. This is an upgrade from my beloved Bifrost and even after one hour of listning I'm really glad I decided to move up to the Gungnir. This is a big step forwards in sound quality biggrin.gif
post #1104 of 1669
Quote:
Originally Posted by grokit View Post

Don't forget about the Pure i20, it will extract the spdif signal from an iPod/iPhone and send it to the Gungnir via toslink or coaxial and includes a remote for $99.

For the iPhone 5 you will need the lightning to 30 pin adaptor to hook up to the Pure i20 or wadia 170i

post #1105 of 1669

Hi guys!

 

Forgive my ignorance but, this thing can be connected to non-balanced equipemnt right?

I have the HE-400 headphones and the Schiit asgard 1 and im wonderig if I should aim for this or the Bifrost (im much more inclined to get this, thou i know Ill have to save cash for a few months).

post #1106 of 1669
Quote:
Originally Posted by catspaw View Post

Hi guys!

 

Forgive my ignorance but, this thing can be connected to non-balanced equipemnt right?

I have the HE-400 headphones and the Schiit asgard 1 and im wonderig if I should aim for this or the Bifrost (im much more inclined to get this, thou i know Ill have to save cash for a few months).

Yup.

I have the HE-4 and previous had the Valhalla connected to my Gungnir before I ponied up for the Mjolnir...

-terry

post #1107 of 1669
Quote:
Originally Posted by BokononVolta View Post

Yup.

I have the HE-4 and previous had the Valhalla connected to my Gungnir before I ponied up for the Mjolnir...

-terry

Cool, thx.

Now only to save up cash :D. My wallet has been too sorry for the last months.

post #1108 of 1669

Hi.

Sorry for my english...:)

Which connection Gungnir playing better,with coax or usb gen 2.Who may tell me?

Thanks..

post #1109 of 1669
Quote:
Originally Posted by nilov View Post

Hi.

Sorry for my english...:)

Which connection Gungnir playing better,with coax or usb gen 2.Who may tell me?

Thanks..

 

Usually coax, although some prefer USB depending on the quality of their other options.

post #1110 of 1669

I recently paired my LCD2.2s with Mjolnir/Gungnir and am enjoying the setup immensely. I'm running optical from amp/DAC to XPS Dell desktop, which I've found isn't a great option because the ports don't provide a solid connection, and I've experienced popping/crackling noise and music cutting in and out from the LCD's.

 

I'm considering either sending in the Gungnir for the usb 2.0 upgrade, or getting the MF V-Link 192. I e-mailed Jason at Schiit, and he suggested that if I were to go usb, to get the upgrade, as their usb is better than most of the converters out there. Can anyone who's tried both suggest the better route to take? Thanks.
 

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