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Schiit Mjolnir headphone amplifier - Page 136

post #2026 of 3263

Kind of feel like we're playing semantics here. Is it possible it's both?

 

I have understood jitter as inaccuracy in timing...but I also acknowledged the potential to lead to noise.

 

The original point was that not all noise is jitter as you had thought.

 

Perhaps a breakdown of different kinds of jitter?


Edited by paradoxper - 12/8/12 at 4:05pm
post #2027 of 3263

No need.  You learn somehing new everyday.

post #2028 of 3263

Jitter is the measure of time that the data is either early or late.

 

The downside that is often ignored about balanced outputs is the noise floor is doubled as is the output impedance.

post #2029 of 3263

Why? 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Solude View Post

 

The downside that is often ignored about balanced outputs is the noise floor is doubled as is the output impedance.

post #2030 of 3263
Quote:
Originally Posted by Solude View Post

Jitter is the measure of time that the data is either early or late.

 

The downside that is often ignored about balanced outputs is the noise floor is doubled as is the output impedance.

That is if there's a noise floor at all. I only see this as a problem with, say, IEM's for the most part.

post #2031 of 3263

Let's be honest here, whether noise floor or common noise we're talking about tiny numbers.  But of the two, noise floor is easy to hear on efficient cans.

post #2032 of 3263
Quote:
Originally Posted by Solude View Post

Let's be honest here, whether noise floor or common noise we're talking about tiny numbers.  But of the two, noise floor is easy to hear on efficient cans.

No argument there.

post #2033 of 3263
Quote:
Originally Posted by ardilla View Post

Why? 

In theory, a balanced amplifier will have an output impedance twice as high as an equivalent SE amplifier because the balanced amplifier will have two active outputs: the non-inverting and the inverting output.
An SE amplifier will only have a non-inverting active output as the headphone is referenced to ground.

Output Noise is 3 dB higher in a balanced output than with an SE output, however, the signal is 6 dB higher in a balanced output.

So the noise will be 3 dB lower in a balanced output stage.
post #2034 of 3263

Doubling of output voltage or noise voltage still results in 6dB ;)  And though the percentage stays the same... the floor is raised and listening level is not.  Ie if you listen at 2V single ended with 50mV noise, you'd listen to 1V per side balanced with a combined 100mV noise.  Numbers are pure fiction to put some reference to the discussion.

post #2035 of 3263
Quote:
Originally Posted by Solude View Post

Doubling of output voltage or noise voltage still results in 6dB wink.gif  And though the percentage stays the same... the floor is raised and listening level is not.  Ie if you listen at 2V single ended with 50mV noise, you'd listen to 1V per side balanced with a combined 100mV noise.  Numbers are pure fiction to put some reference to the discussion.

No, the noise is uncorrelated so sums algebraically :

http://www.electronicspoint.com/summing-noise-sources-t102289.html

The summed noise is 3 dB higher, as the noise is uncorrelated, but the summed signals are 6 dB higher as the two signals are correlated, i.e. identical:

Hence total noise is 3 dB quieter than total signal.
Edited by Chris J - 12/10/12 at 9:43am
post #2036 of 3263

I think you are talking signal noise, the white noise that increases as the pot increases, while I am talking noise floor, ie the noise of the amp with no input that is fixed and doesn't track the pot generally measured in uV.  In the end it really doesn't matter because either way you are stuck using what's in house ;)

post #2037 of 3263

I heard a balanced amp halves the headphones impedance.  So for example, if the LCD-2 is rated at 60ohms, will it be 30ohms if used with the Mjolnir?  Is this true? How do you compare the output wattage of a balanced amp to a SE amp at a given impedance?


Edited by technica18 - 12/9/12 at 7:52pm
post #2038 of 3263
Quote:
Originally Posted by Solude View Post

I think you are talking signal noise, the white noise that increases as the pot increases, while I am talking noise floor, ie the noise of the amp with no input that is fixed and doesn't track the pot generally measured in uV.  In the end it really doesn't matter because either way you are stuck using what's in house wink.gif

That is all the same type of noise.

Go read the literature, I'm sick of debating this.
redface.gif
post #2039 of 3263
Quote:
Originally Posted by technica18 View Post

I heard a balanced amp halves the headphones impedance.  So for example, if the LCD-2 is rated at 60ohms, will it be 30ohms if used with the Mjolnir?  Is this true? How do you compare the output wattage of a balanced amp to a SE amp at a given impedance?

No, the LSD-2 will still be a 60 Ohm headphone. There is a tremendous amount of misunderstanding about balanced amplification.
Hard to separate the BS from the truth.rolleyes.gif
post #2040 of 3263
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris J View Post


No, the LSD-2 will still be a 60 Ohm headphone. There is a tremendous amount of misunderstanding about balanced amplification.
Hard to separate the BS from the truth.rolleyes.gif

 

700

 

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