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Audio-Gd Reference 10 - Page 16

post #226 of 342

Hi, Perhaps someone could point me in the right direction. I have never used a dedicated dac before and I am also new to hi rez music, streaming "sqeezebox ect, I would like to move in this direction. I will be using the dac with a power amp and I'm not a headphone user. I am looking for something with a volume control as I don't have a pre amp.

So, do I get the NFB7.32 dac with volume control or the 10.32 dac/pre amp? I don't want a pre if not needed. Would there be 

any advantages in having a dedicated dac NFB7.32 direct to power amp?

thanks

post #227 of 342
Quote:
Originally Posted by pshdk View Post

Hi, Perhaps someone could point me in the right direction. I have never used a dedicated dac before and I am also new to hi rez music, streaming "sqeezebox ect, I would like to move in this direction. I will be using the dac with a power amp and I'm not a headphone user. I am looking for something with a volume control as I don't have a pre amp.

So, do I get the NFB7.32 dac with volume control or the 10.32 dac/pre amp? I don't want a pre if not needed. Would there be 

any advantages in having a dedicated dac NFB7.32 direct to power amp?

thanks

The NFB-7.32 is dedicated dac WITHOUT volume control. You need a pre in addition with this.

post #228 of 342
Quote:
Originally Posted by i019791 View Post

The NFB-7.32 is dedicated dac WITHOUT volume control. You need a pre in addition with this.

 

Or the NFB-27 (which is the ES9018 version of the Reference 10 => with a balanced headphone amp / preamp)

 

I happen to have one for sale (230V).

post #229 of 342

Hi,

The NFB 7.32 can be custom ordered with volume control.

post #230 of 342
Quote:
Originally Posted by blitzxgene View Post

The digital stopband seems to control the amount of treble energy coming through more or less. Setting to -90 gives the system a smoother and warmer sound. The dithering setting is affects 16 bit music by attempting to pad it to 24 bit (or so I am led to believe). However, it removes a fair amount of detail from 16 bit music and I prefer to hear all the little things. 

With dithering off and the passband set to the stock -130, music is analytical. With the dithering off and the passband at -90, music is warmer and more musical while still retaining great detail.

Yes, stopband allows signal energy to "escape". Lower stopband -> less energy in audio range -> lower dynamics.

Dithering effects are more difficult to apprehend correctly and good quality recording with very resolving headphone is required to hear dithering benefits. No dithering can seem more detailed because all instruments and voices are more pronounced and in your face. That is good, but you lose micro details, precise positioning and depth of the stage. The resulting "no dithering" sound is more left-right oriented with instrument and voices "fighting" each other because all their respective loudness seems the same (or very close).

So sure - DSP-1 switches are there for "tailoring" somewhat the PCM1704 sound to owner's likings. If you prefer "softer", less dynamic "equalized" sound - lowering the passband attenuation and turning of dithering is the way to go. But from my experience - KingWa's original DSP-1 settings were/are the ones that sound best (or at least the ones that I always return to).
post #231 of 342
Stupid question... Where are those jumpers? Anyone tried -50?
post #232 of 342

Jumpers are located on the DSP-1 board. The older version of the DSP-1 board had DIP Switches instead of jumpers. You can see the older DSP-1 board here:

 

 

 

Info about setting up the jumpers can be found at the bottom of Ref10.32 settings page here. 

post #233 of 342

Has anyone listened to both the 10.32 and Burson Conductor and made any comparisons?  

post #234 of 342
Quote:
Originally Posted by PiNa.cz View Post

Jumpers are located on the DSP-1 board. The older version of the DSP-1 board had DIP Switches instead of jumpers. You can see the older DSP-1 board here:

 

 

 

Info about setting up the jumpers can be found at the bottom of Ref10.32 settings page here. 


Ah thanks. Done it today. Since Stopband Attenuation is default at -130DB, I just put cap on Jumper6 DITH which sets Data Dithering off.

 

So far so good. I didn't do critical A/B listening, changes seems to be rather small, but to my favor.

post #235 of 342
Quote:
Originally Posted by OneSec View Post


Ah thanks. Done it today. Since Stopband Attenuation is default at -130DB, I just put cap on Jumper6 DITH which sets Data Dithering off.

 

So far so good. I didn't do critical A/B listening, changes seems to be rather small, but to my favor.

After lots of experimenting and trial and error, I can now say that the stock settings do sound best provided the quality of your chain is high enough. The stopband diffuses the soundstage but can mellow out harsher treble, which is what I was using it for. It turns out I was using a horrible excuse for a power cord on my reference 10 that overbloated bass and etched the treble. You probably don't have that problem if you are using the stock cord, but I never have and probably never will (and don't know if that has a similar effect). As for the hardware dithering, leave it active for the occasional 16 bit sound passing through your system and grab Jriver when funds allow, as the bit depth upsampling to 32 bits negates the built in dithering and adds some perceivable depth/layering to the sound. Make sure to use ASIO and flash one of your firmware chips to the newest one #7 (or order the chip through kingwa) as it is very nice sounding (coming from #4). 

 

Last thing is that you should try aftermarket power cords if you think it might be something that could influence the sound of your unit. I'm using a shunyata venom 3 to great effect on all my equipment. Stay away from pangea anything at this level though.

post #236 of 342
Hi all,
Using good powercords is a must on the Ref 10 and if you want the best also use a netfilter and a very good USB cable.
It is no big investment but the results are very good.
I use Yarbo 8000 and 9000 powercords, a Bada 5600 netfilter and the Ortophone silver USB cable. No high-end prices but very good value for money and the sound is so much better then with standerd cables.

Regards,
Tini
post #237 of 342
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tini View Post

Hi all,
Using good powercords is a must on the Ref 10 and if you want the best also use a netfilter and a very good USB cable.
It is no big investment but the results are very good.
I use Yarbo 8000 and 9000 powercords, a Bada 5600 netfilter and the Ortophone silver USB cable. No high-end prices but very good value for money and the sound is so much better then with standerd cables.

Regards,
Tini

 

I followed this advice also.

 

I don't really like the Yarbo 8000 though; it's very very stiff and the strain on the connector is quite strong.

The Bada is very nice (look & usability) and the Schuko connectors allowed me to solve my phase-inversion issue with the NFB-27.

 

The Audio-GD TOTL DACs are very sensitive to AC power (at least the phase inversion) since I simply could not focus on the sound before I solved the issue (too hard & glary sounding).

post #238 of 342
Quote:
Originally Posted by blitzxgene View Post

After lots of experimenting and trial and error, I can now say that the stock settings do sound best provided the quality of your chain is high enough. The stopband diffuses the soundstage but can mellow out harsher treble, which is what I was using it for. It turns out I was using a horrible excuse for a power cord on my reference 10 that overbloated bass and etched the treble. You probably don't have that problem if you are using the stock cord, but I never have and probably never will (and don't know if that has a similar effect). As for the hardware dithering, leave it active for the occasional 16 bit sound passing through your system and grab Jriver when funds allow, as the bit depth upsampling to 32 bits negates the built in dithering and adds some perceivable depth/layering to the sound. Make sure to use ASIO and flash one of your firmware chips to the newest one #7 (or order the chip through kingwa) as it is very nice sounding (coming from #4). 

 

Last thing is that you should try aftermarket power cords if you think it might be something that could influence the sound of your unit. I'm using a shunyata venom 3 to great effect on all my equipment. Stay away from pangea anything at this level though.


Hi blitzxgene, thank you for your heads-up. I was not aware of the fact there is a new firmware for the Ref10 already released. I did try #4 in the past but ended up using my modded HiFace with digital Belden coax cable thru Ref's coax input. I am also using DIY power cable and power conditioner unit with my Ref10 and it shows. But will try to upgrade the firmware to the newest one #7 as soon as time allows and will report back.

post #239 of 342

Hey Clemmaster,

 

Yarbo 8000 is indead a little stiff but great value for money. I also use the Yarbo SP-PSC-3C to my speakers (Klein & Hummel O300), a little expencive but perfect quality. The guys at Yarbo know what they are doing ;-).

 

Do you use USB on the ref 10? Because then you have to try the Ortofon DGI-K2 Silver USB. I used the Audioquest Forest before and switched to the Ortofon, this realy opened up the sound without any harsh. It's not very expencive compared to other pure silver (data wires) cables.

 

Regards,

Tini

post #240 of 342

http://www.cabledyne.com/usb-cable.html

 

This one blew down my wall... from the us of A.

beerchug.gif

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